Is American/Full Contact Kickboxing dead in the United States?

[Tunney]

???

Rick got crippled in that fight.

Because he lacked lowkick defense. He was dominating otherwise.

 

[Yodsanan]

He clearly lost the fight for no reason other than lack of lowkick defense.

Of course, these are just isolated examples which you can't really use to prove a point. The bottom line is that AK is a much more dynamic and well rounded style. If they had adapted to low kicks (which they stupidly didn't), Muay Thai would almost certainly not have ascended the way it did.

If if if. stay grounded on reality.

 

[Yodsanan]

If boxers learned kicking they would own kickboxers.

 

[Tunney]

If if if. stay grounded on reality.

I am grounded in reality. The early fights of AK vs Muay Thai make it very apparent that AK was the more effective style EXCEPT for the lowkick achilles heel. Which is my whole point.

 

[Snubnoze707]

The Muay Thai base is plodding and brawling by nature, it could be easily exploited by someone with better footwork and a larger arsenal of kicks.

Then why hasn't it? And you realize there are substyles within Muay Thai? Probably not...

 

[Yodsanan]

I am grounded in reality. The early fights of AK vs Muay Thai make it very apparent that AK was the more effective style EXCEPT for the lowkick achilles heel. Which is my whole point.

that's a major oversight. lowkicks and lowkick defence are a complex topic and take years to master. Even Duke Roufus completely took a 180 on his views from after his fights, after he visited several thais to teach him the art of lowkicking.

 

[Tunney]

Then why hasn't it? And you realize there are substyles within Muay Thai? Probably not...

It's an obvious weakness and the only reason I can figure is because Muay Thai-based styles are so entrenched at this point.

 

[Tunney]

that's a major oversight. lowkicks and lowkick defence are a complex topic and take years to master. Even Duke Roufus completely took a 180 on his views from after his fights, after he visited several thais to teach him the art of lowkicking.

I'm not denying the effectiveness of lowkicks.

 

[Jimmy Jazz]

Tunney sounding like Duke Roufus after Changpuek smashed his brother.

didnt roufus break Changpuek's jaw?

 

[Yodsanan]

didnt roufus break Changpuek's jaw?

He did. You know what he also did? Outweight him by 20 pounds.

 

[Snubnoze707]

It's an obvious weakness and the only reason I can figure is because Muay Thai-based styles are so entrenched at this point.

Huh?

So how do you explain Holzken and Valtelini completely dismantling Ramon Daniels by plodding forward. Plodding forward and trapping a guy that is constantly moving and requiring distance for flashy kicks is exactly what you want to do.

 

[Snubnoze707]

He did. You know what he also did? Outweight him by 20 pounds.

And he also lost LOL...

 

[Yodsanan]

 

[Vil7]

That's why they produce world champions in muay thai, kickboxing and boxing and are known by everyone in the full contact world as the best strikers.




He was touted as the Bill Wallace of this generation and achieved nothing in kickboxing when he stepped up in competition. All it needed to stop him was basic stuff.

I've never heard him being called that & Wallace was a superior boxer

 

[Yodsanan]

I've never heard him being called that & Wallace was a superior boxer

could be, not to much of an expert on that. who's known to be the best AK right now?

 

[leonlak]

Roufus might've won that fight early except for the infamous Saeksan throwing ice and water all over the ring incident, which gave Changpuek an extra 30 seconds to recover. IIRC, he still looked pretty dazed when the 2nd round should have started. Roufus could have finished him off.

 

[ArtemV]

Valtellini was a lot of fun to watch before he had to retire he had very good low-kicks.

 

[Guestx]

AK probably works best in the mess that is the AK ruleset. . .

I don't know why the ruleset is a mess or superior or inferior to any other ruleset.

This is the bullshit and hypocrisy surrounding American Kickboxing: People want to talk shit on it because leg kicks, knees and elbows are not allowed.

But those same people revere boxing even though it's ruleset is even more restrictive.

American Kickboxing allows for everything that boxing does and more.

K1 more than AK. MT more than K1 (to my recollection).

MMA more than all of the above.

The AK ruleset provides what is needed to see a certain kind of fight, and it's a kind of fight that I think is a lot of fun to watch.

I'd give just about anything to watch a kickboxing match that is structured for guys like Jerry Trimble to unload on dudes with awesome kicks.





What's interesting about this discussion though is Steve Vick competed under rulesets that allowed low kicks and he was still able to pull off some wild shit. He basically fought like it was an AK match regardless of the rules and still was able to win fights.

The guy was just phenomenal. We don't see a lot of guys who fight like this anymore and that's a damn shame.

 

[Yodsanan]

I don't know why the ruleset is a mess or superior or inferior to any other ruleset.

wasn't meant to be a bad implication. kickboxing rulesets as a whole are a mess, because they are too many. AK is a cool sport to watch, and probably even more to practice, so more power to you.


Tunney was talking nonsense, that's all.

 

[Guestx]

wasn't meant to be a bad implication. kickboxing rulesets as a whole are a mess, because they are too many. AK is a cool sport to watch, and probably even more so practice, so more power to you.

Sadly it seems at this point the AK ruleset is all but dead and buried, at least in terms of any meaningful professional competition.

I don't understand why it couldn't be appreciated and accepted for what it was even in the K-1 era. Like I said, it leads to a certain kind of fight, a kind of fight that's exciting to watch and that you're not going to get once you allow low kicks and other techniques.