How Threatening was Muammar Gaddafi?

[Islam Imamate]

I don't think you or I have a crystal ball.

This is just make pretend here.

Right but we can analyze the situation based on the conditions of Libya before the intervention and after and what we know of the conflict. I'm actually talking about concrete details here whereas you're making pretty general statements. Not all speculation is equal.

 

[Trotsky]

I reread this twice, trying to figure out how Gaddafi figured into it.

This was like me going into the Mueller investigation thread and saying "weird thing about Donald Trump is that he is massively involved in the marijuana business. I know this because I get really, really high."

 

[GSP_37]

It's not just the individual who poses a threat, but the countless terrorists he deploys and enables with various dangerous shit.

 

[Stoic1]

Read the history of Libya and you see just how transformational he really was. One of the biggest reasons *NOT* to vote for Hillary was understanding how stupid she really is thinking that removing 'Daf was the right thing to do. Much like thinking removing Saddam was the right thing to do.

 

[carlos cadona]

By 2011 he had already been tamed by the west and was of no serious threat to anybody, he also lost literally every war he ever fought.

 

[second sight]

hillary should have suffered the fate she forced on him

 

[Cuauhtemoc]

I'm not so sure, the consequences were terrible obviously, but no one can accurately predict those.

Gaddafi was about to go full Assad on Benghazi till we hit his tanks in the open.

Seeing what happened in Mosul and other places, I think the outcome is still preferable.

Also, putting the blame squarely on the US and Obama isn't fair either.

France and the UK were lighting the place up before us.

It was mostly the Euros that destroyed him, but I think he was going to fall easily regardless. Libyan military was a joke compared to Syria.
The idea that he was going to massacre a bunch of civilians is wrong. The rebels were armed and barricaded.
See how long it took the much more powerful Syrian military to take over Aleppo and that was with Russian, Hezbollah and Iranian help. I think his troops would be destroyed by the rebels regardless.

All in all, I'm not sad for him, he was a bad guy, he conducted wars of aggression against innocent countries like Chad (where he also got his ass kicked by a ragtag militia with toyota trucks). The main problem was that NATO didn't destroy his arsenal.
Libya had a weak military but it had a LOT of small arms like rockets, rifles, grenades, antitank missiles and so on. These started to appear all over the region after his downfall.

 

[Quinton Overeem]

Well first of all that was france and the uk. I know this might come to a shock, but not everything we do in the middle east is an american ordeal. You seem to not remember that the brits and french have had hands in africa long before the us.

Lol what's wrong with you? This is exactly what I said in my post. I don't know about the US and the UK (because maybe their own citizens probably know better), but that I definitely know about my own country (france) causing trouble (and what we did to Libya because of Sarkozy) in Africa.

Sarkozy should be in jail for this (among many other things).

PS : But if you quoted my post in order to go along and support yours against someone else, my bad.

 

[Fronk]

Btw I was in class and I happened to sit next to this very beautiful Russian girl. I happened to be reading a book from the library on some subject related to Islam and not really minding her until she asked it about it. Finding out that I'm Muslim she asked what I knew about Libya and started praising Khadaffy and his education and healthcare programs before sneaking in a jab at America for fucking up Libya. Very funny to see some good ole Russian anti-imperialism in person, especially from such a lovely source.

Putin brings up up Libya time and time again as proof of the disingenuous nature of these "responsibility to protect"-missions. Russia and China gave up an inch and the West ended taking an entire mile. It's probably the reason Russia has been standing so firmly behind the Syrian goverment.

 

[Seaside]

Not as bad as Saudis, Pakistan or Iran. Which means US and NATO allies had to destroy him.

 

[Seaside]

Btw I was in class and I happened to sit next to this very beautiful Russian girl. I happened to be reading a book from the library on some subject related to Islam and not really minding her until she asked it about it. Finding out that I'm Muslim she asked what I knew about Libya and started praising Khadaffy and his education and healthcare programs before sneaking in a jab at America for fucking up Libya. Very funny to see some good ole Russian anti-imperialism in person, especially from such a lovely source.

Ah so you are Muslim i was right. Russia and china are way less imperialistic than the US or UK or NATO leaders.

 

[Jake the Muss]

Gaddafi Was To Receive U.N. Human Rights Award

It's all f'd. Gaddafi didn't get assassinated because of human rights violations, the real reason that is being circulated is because he was trying to create a gold backed currency to compete with the euro and dollar.


It would've liberated Africa. He was being a pain in the ass, and so they made sure he got treated in kind.

 

[ShinkanPo]

Gaddafi Was To Receive U.N. Human Rights Award

It's all f'd. Gaddafi didn't get assassinated because of human rights violations, the real reason that is being circulated is because he was trying to create a gold backed currency to compete with the euro and dollar.


It would've liberated Africa. He was being a pain in the ass, and so they made sure he got treated in kind.

Hehehehe

 

[rearnakedchoke]

We can only know from what the media wanted us to think of him (here in the west).

 

[tonni]

Part of my dad's side of the family is from Bucharest but came over in the early 1900s. The little I know of modern Romania comes from the Top Gear special when they went there in GT cars and noted that as soon as you leave a major city the roads become dirt and the area becomes "Borat land" to quote Clarkson.

It does have an incredible driving road though.


I've had one friend visit the area and he said if you're in the city it looks great and a modern country, you leave the city.... it's like going back in time.

Romania's beautiful, though. One of the last remaining wildernesses of Europe.

 

[bad mojo]

A lot of big construction companies from former Yugoslavia worked in Lybia. Gaddafi invested huge amounts of money into improving infrastructure all across the country, including some incredible projects.I know a lot of people that worked there in the 80s, and they all tell the same story: Gaddafi ruled with an iron fist, but average folks enjoyed benefits that you wouldn't find anywhere else (you didn't pay for electricity, water, phone bills, housing, education and medical care were free, you didn't even pay for a loaf of bread).

He made a grave mistake when he tried to ditch the dollar. Incredibly naive move.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Ah so you are Muslim i was right. Russia and china are way less imperialistic than the US or UK or NATO leaders.

I'm publicly Muslim. I prefer telling people that than I'm atheist for some reason. Here I'm strictly a materialist.

And yeah I wasn't saying Russia is imperialist(though they are in their own way) but that they're anti-imperialist, or at least anti-Western imperialism and its funny to see that trickle down to individuals.

 

[Rockapotomuss]

The Arab leadership cleanse was not taking Gaddafi out on its own, so we gave him a little push. It is the goal of western nations to keep the Middle East destabilized in order to prevent any sort of second coming of Saladin from uniting the region, taking the oil, and kicking all westerners out.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Putin brings up up Libya time and time again as proof of the disingenuous nature of these "responsibility to protect"-missions. Russia and China gave up an inch and the West ended taking an entire mile. It's probably the reason Russia has been standing so firmly behind the Syrian goverment.

I tend to think the cult of personality that leaders like Putin have in their countries is exaggerated insofar as they're sincerely believed by the populace and not just feigned for fear of reprisal but this girl is a ways off from Russia, makes me wonder if the average Russian is a true believer.

To be fair though critiquing the Libya intervention is very fair, it was clumsily handled. Putin's intervention in Syria was handled far better, I gotta give him that.

 

[Gregolian]

Romania's beautiful, though. One of the last remaining wildernesses of Europe.

Isn't Austria much the same way? Seems like the smaller Euro countries are less, well, developed so they have more of the original forests and shit left.