How good was Fedor really? Was he truly elite?

[MMAK]

I don't know about the best chin ever. He was good at avoiding damage.
If you rewatch the Lewis fight, he may have been slightly ahead on points, but it was closer than you think. Vitali was getting fucked up. Lewis would have found that chin pretty soon, as a couple more shots to that eye would have left him blind and leaking. And it WAS Lewis's last fight.
I think he's probably the HW goat. Definitely the best of his era, and his era was definitely the strongest in HW history. The 70s was strong too. Ali was the best. But the 2nd best of the 70s (Frazier or Foreman) wasn't as good as the second best of the 90s (I'm thinking Bowe, Holyfield, or Tyson). It's all hypothetical....
Anyway, it's good to discuss it with someone that is thinking about it rationally.

Lewis was getting tired and Vitali was pushing him around the ring. It's very possible that Lennox was about to gas and get ko'd.

 

[Epsteins Guard]

Especially knowing what I know now about what was really going on in Pride for a very long time combined with the fighting abilities Fedor showed outside of Pride, I think under fair fight conditions Dan Henderson, Anderson Silva, Randy Couture and probably a lot of other fighters beat Fedor.

Anderson Silva was in Pride.

He got tapped out by such luminaries as Daiju Takase and Ryo Chonan.

But you think he would have beat the HW champ?

That's not delusional at all lmao

 

[Cartiac]

Anderson Silva was in Pride.

He got tapped out by such luminaries as Daiju Takase and Ryo Chonan.

But you think he would have beat the HW champ?

That's not delusional at all lmao

The answer is yes. You don't know shit about Pride bro. Pride was literally started as a professional wrestling organization with the differentiation that the fighting would be more real than WWF, but the outcomes equally as scripted and fixed. That is why it was so f'n entertaining, because it was specifically crafted that way and we know it was controlled by Yakuza that informed fighters if they valued their life or that of their family they would honor the fight outcomes that were expected I would appreciate if someone could show me statements otherwise but I don't think Pride ever even claimed to be anything other than what it was.

There is also a very distinct pattern of dominant Pride fighters not having near the same level of success in other organizations after it was dissolved despite claims of having such a superior level of competition.

 

[Chayanne]

Fedor prime vs Jones Prime
Fedor wins

 

[Hog-train]

Fedor is kind of like Mike Tyson in his prime - in that you're not saying he's elite only because of who he beat, but HOW he beat people.

He just utterly dominated with explosive power and speed. Power puncher with hand speed still not surpassed by any HW fighter and also dominant ground and pound and slick submissions.

Name me one HW that is more explosive.

 

[moreorless87]

Anderson Silva was in Pride.

He got tapped out by such luminaries as Daiju Takase and Ryo Chonan.

But you think he would have beat the HW champ?

That's not delusional at all lmao

I mean Anderson even at HW I thin would always have upset potential but really stylistically thats not a good fight for him IMHO, even standing I think Fedor's power would be a big issue for him but on the ground his defensive guard would likely get him pulped.

 

[NenadRS]

I mean Anderson even at HW I thin would always have upset potential but really stylistically thats not a good fight for him IMHO, even standing I think Fedor's power would be a big issue for him but on the ground his defensive guard would likely get him pulped.

Age and prime are important, just look at his peak performances, hard to find fighter like that.

Also for comparison to Jones his first loss was at the age of 33/34, on his 34th fight.

Jones left LHW at the age of 32, 28th fights, he had his tough fights with Santos/Reyes (and lost to Reyes on points). So he played safe, similar to GSP, left early.

All these fighters were amazing in prime, hard to compare them. But consider that he never failed drug test, looked natural, declined naturally and kept fighting till the very end when he had nothing more to give, that is for respect too, till the age of 46.

 

[fica]

Here's how I always look at Fedor's "padded" record.

Top fighters nowaday fight 1-3 times a year against quality opponents.

Fedor fought at least 1-3 times a year against quality opponents, with some cans added on top of that.

The second one is more impressive, since at HW even some random can could knock you out with 1 lucky punch.

i mean guy fought bigger guys then him there were no weight class and they fough in week more fights then some in whole year

 

[Fedorgasm]

I think Bigfoot ended Fedor's prime.

Werdum beat prime Fedor, so he deserves all the credit in the world.

But TRT Bigfoot was a monster, and he gave Fedor a serious beating. As they say, it ain't the age, it's the mileage. Well Bigfoot probably put 5 years of mileage on Fedor's brain, because after that fight, he was like Chuck Liddell at the end of his career. Just tap him in the face and the lights go out.

So Werdum deserves credit, Bigfoot less so IMO, because he was only good on the juice.

Hendo, Bader, and Mitrione all beat Fedor after he has CTE so definitely not in his prime

 

[Lee Danger]

Fedor is kind of like Mike Tyson in his prime - in that you're not saying he's elite only because of who he beat, but HOW he beat people.

He just utterly dominated with explosive power and speed. Power puncher with hand speed still not surpassed by any HW fighter and also dominant ground and pound and slick submissions.

Name me one HW that is more explosive.

Randleman.
But i agree with all you've said here.

 

[Lee Danger]

I think Bigfoot ended Fedor's prime.

Werdum beat prime Fedor, so he deserves all the credit in the world.

But TRT Bigfoot was a monster, and he gave Fedor a serious beating. As they say, it ain't the age, it's the mileage. Well Bigfoot probably put 5 years of mileage on Fedor's brain, because after that fight, he was like Chuck Liddell at the end of his career. Just tap him in the face and the lights go out.

So Werdum deserves credit, Bigfoot less so IMO, because he was only good on the juice.

Hendo, Bader, and Mitrione all beat Fedor after he has CTE so definitely not in his prime

If memory serves me right Fedor won the first round then threw Bigfoot on top of him very early in the second round and after almost 5 minutes of gnp he was exausted and done.

That takedown was the Fedor's equivalent of the Weidman's spinning kick versus Rockhold: a single move that ended changing a lot more than a single round.

 

[NenadRS]

If memory serves me right Fedor won the first round then threw Bigfoot on top of him very early in the second round and after almost 5 minutes of gnp he was exausted and done.

That takedown was the Fedor's equivalent of the Weidman's spinning kick versus Rockhold: a single move that ended changing a lot more than a single round.

Yes, that fight was hard to watch, what Fedor survived, he took crazy amount of damage. His timing was so off, he was missing so many punches in the first round. Who knows what would have happened in 3rd round without doctor stoppage between rounds. Both were very exhausted.

Bigfoot was weird during that time, easily knocked out by DC few times in 2 minutes, and later had crazy war with Hunt and eating all Hunt's power shots like it is nothing.