How easily would Prime-Big Nog have submitted Francis?

[VERBAL-FEDOR]

If the fight included USADA, that "lean 235lb Pride-Big Nog" you speak of wouldn't be allowed to compete.

Anyways, The big black buck sleeps prime Nog at least 50% of the time IMO. He got outclassed by a VERY well rounded fighter on Saturday. While his cardio needs work, a bum, he's certainly no bum.

Wait a sec....you actually think Francis is all natty?

LMFAO!!!!

 

[smellmyfarts]

Wait a sec....you actually think Francis is all natty?

LMFAO!!!!

I wouldn't be surprised. Have you ever seen an interview inside an NFL locker-room after a game? A good percentage of those guys are clean. There are some fucking freaks out there. You ever looked at an old pic of Jim Brown? The guy was absolutely clean and barely lifted, yet he was a 230lb rock
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BzNCX3PWATI/UCKYza5GdFI/AAAAAAAAUMk/c_7rXdUcoRs/s1600/Tow07d.jpg


Anyways, I can almost guarantee he's not on a perpetual cycle of jet fuel like pretty much everyone in Pride was even if he's not 100% natural.

 

[ostlerrage]

and I don’t mean that PTSD-bloated, zombie Big Nog that showed up to fight in the UFC you fools!

I am talking about the lean 235lb Pride-Big Nog that absorbed full power kicks from Mirko and a pile driver from 350lb juiced up Bob Sapp.

I think he would have Francis tapping within the first 2mins.

I dont think so.

 

[SirKratos]

Prime Nog, but in what organisation? If its not PRIDE, Nog gets KTFO after literally the first half decent punch Ngannou lands.

Lets not pretend like the difference in Big Nog's chin pre and after UFC isn't because of the juice. MMA fans are so gullible

Everyone knows it, no one wants to say it because everyone likes PRIDE.

 

[moreorless87]

If the fight included USADA, that "lean 235lb Pride-Big Nog" you speak of wouldn't be allowed to compete.

Anyways, The big black buck sleeps prime Nog at least 50% of the time IMO. He got outclassed by a VERY well rounded fighter on Saturday. While his cardio needs work, he's certainly no bum.

You've got to laugh at the idea that Nog is the guy more likely to be on PEDs in this matchup.

 

[moreorless87]

Prime Nog, but in what organisation? If its not PRIDE, Nog gets KTFO after literally the first half decent punch Ngannou lands.

Lets not pretend like the difference in Big Nog's chin pre and after UFC isn't because of the juice. MMA fans are so gullible

Everyone knows it, no one wants to say it because everyone likes PRIDE.

Nog's decline wasn't really just down to chin though was it? he took big punishment from Herring and Sylvia before coming back to win, got blasted repeatidly by Mir before the fight was actually stopped and took a lot of shots from Randy.

I mean yeah I think you can make a case his chin perhaps dropped off a bit but really the difference was he became so much easier to hit as he slowed down and potentially vision issues.

Ironically Nog in the UFC actually put on more muscle than in Pride, probably because like Crocop he knew his speed was gone anyway so might as well focus on power. Plus of course its not like the UFC was exactly watertight with its PED testing is it?

 

[Typrune Goatley]

 

[TUFNewb]

Lol. Just squint your eyes a bit. It would be literally indistinguishable with this:

 

[smellmyfarts]

You've got to laugh at the idea that Nog is the guy more likely to be on PEDs in this matchup.

Do you?

There is no question Nog used PEDs while fighting in Japan.Watch his his first fight in the states.

 

[moreorless87]

Do you?

There is no question Nog used PEDs while fighting in Japan.Watch his his first fight in the states.

Isnt there? based on what? merely opportunity? plus of course as I mentioned PED testing in the UFC in the late 00's was hardly that difficult to beat.

Meanwhile you have Ngannou as a mountain of muscle training in a facility partly managed by the UFC's head of drug testing.

 

[xMaxPower]

wouldnt be able to take him down imo

 

[tru3f4n]

nog gets it to the ground by pulling deep half, sweep ->guillotine ala Tim Sylvia

nog is probably the worst match for ngannou. Granite chin + best hw blackbelt (until werdum came into the picture)

ngannou might have a shot clubbing crocop in the face, but crocop might random LHK or bob sapp his orbital too

I thought once Pride died shit like this would've went away by the time Nog fought Sylvia his chin was worn a bit. I highly doubt his chin would last in this "matchup" Nog getting submissions after taking a beating wouldn't fair too well here. Maybe Francis would gas and Nog would get another sub I just don't see Nog outmuscling him or being able to stand with him while he's fresh.

 

[Hollywood Jack]

Big Nog could wrestle now? He was anywhere near as strong and athletic as Stipe? I love Nog and watched him in his prime, but he would have been sleeping long before any of that could happen.

 

[moreorless87]

Big Nog could wrestle now? He was anywhere near as strong and athletic as Stipe? I love Nog and watched him in his prime, but he would have been sleeping long before any of that could happen.

Took down Crocop, Barnett, Sergei, etc, again I'd say he had the Maia edge of not caring if he ended up on his back and I'd say he was a good deal faster and more agile than Stipe if not quite as powerful.

Don't think he'd get a fresh Ngannou down easily but after a few mins boxing with him when his gas goes, yeah I can definitely see it. Honestly though based on that performance I would pick him to beat Ngannou in a straight MMA boxing match.

 

[Joohnmatrix]

Isn't it obvious that Francis was never that good now that he's lost.

 

[moreorless87]

Isn't it obvious that Francis was never that good now that he's lost.

I think its obvious from the way he lost that he was never as good as a lot of the hype, still legit of course but there were some very obvious weaknesses exposed.

 

[Hollywood Jack]

Took down Crocop, Barnett, Sergei, etc, again I'd say he had the Maia edge of not caring if he ended up on his back and I'd say he was a good deal faster and more agile than Stipe if not quite as powerful.

Don't think he'd get a fresh Ngannou down easily but after a few mins boxing with him when his gas goes, yeah I can definitely see it. Honestly though based on that performance I would pick him to beat Ngannou in a straight MMA boxing match.

I think people have a tendency of overrating the past. This is a young and quickly evolving sport. I think Ngannou destroys any version of Nog. And in a straight MMA boxing match as you call it, no chance. I understand your sentiments, I would like to share them, but intellectually I cannot.

 

[moreorless87]

I think people have a tendency of overrating the past. This is a young and quickly evolving sport. I think Ngannou destroys any version of Nog. And in a straight MMA boxing match as you call it, no chance. I understand your sentiments, I would like to share them, but intellectually I cannot.

I would say the opposite, UFC history is choc full of examples of people overrating the present with hype trains crashing and burning because its what the hype is always behind.

I think the sports not so young and quickly envolving as self serving UFC hype makes it, someone like Nog was training with Olympic level boxers for example. Now it maybe took longer to filter down to some other divisions but HW had that level of training over 15 years ago, Fedor as well was training with russian Olympic level boxing coaches.

Seriously watch Ngannou vs Stipe with an honest eye and tell me that boxing is technically better than Nog vs Sergei, swinging wild hooks and uppercuts with very little timing. Yeah no doubt Ngannou is more powerful than Nog but he wouldn't have an easy time catching him and if he doesn't fairly quickly I think that fight suggests he gasses.

 

[Clear Winner]

Big Nog could wrestle now? He was anywhere near as strong and athletic as Stipe? I love Nog and watched him in his prime, but he would have been sleeping long before any of that could happen.

Yep. I get the feeling that a lot of these guys never actually watched Pride.

 

[Hollywood Jack]

I would say the opposite, UFC history is choc full of examples of people overrating the present with hype trains crashing and burning because its what the hype is always behind.

I think the sports not so young and quickly envolving as self serving UFC hype makes it, someone like Nog was training with Olympic level boxers for example. Now it maybe took longer to filter down to some other divisions but HW had that level of training over 15 years ago, Fedor as well was training with russian Olympic level boxing coaches.

Seriously watch Ngannou vs Stipe with an honest eye and tell me that boxing is technically better than Nog vs Sergei, swinging wild hooks and uppercuts with very little timing. Yeah no doubt Ngannou is more powerful than Nog but he wouldn't have an easy time catching him and if he doesn't fairly quickly I think that fight suggests he gasses.

You raise some interesting points. I do remember Big Nog training with the Cuban Olympic Boxing Team and Lil Nog competing in the Pan American Games in boxing. I also remember how Fedor used to train when he was still hungry. I also agree about hype jobs, but not all of the current top fighters and up and coming guys are that. I still think this is an ever evolving sport and that today's fighters are more advanced than they were 10-15-20 years ago. But there's always room for disagreement.