Opinion History will not be kind to Joe Biden

avenue94 said:
Why would you not take into account the Covid recovery when the US outperformed nearly every other comparable country, as well as its own recovery post-recession? Recoveries are never even and carry trade offs, with the US prioritizing the speed of the rebound this time.
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That’s my point it’s a astrek included
 
ShadowRun said:
That’s my point it’s a astrek included
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Yeah but it's an asterisk the other way. It's an extraneous factor that offered a challenger for the US and other countries, and the US surmounted this challenge far better than most. Are there any other countries you feel had a better Covid recovery economically?
 
Screenshot-20250112-140133-Brave.jpg
 
Yeah there is nothing positive I can think of.
  • Failed on the economy.
  • Failed on the border.
  • Failed on foreign policy, a disaster of a withdrawal from Afghanistan which no doubt emboldened Putin to invade. Allowed sanctions on Iran to expire which allowed them to fund Hamas which directly lead to the current situation over there.
  • Abused the presidential pardons to a ridiculous degree.
  • Ran on being a moderate but allowed the woke mob to take control and push the trans ideology on kids at a time when the rest Europe was starting to pull back on the more extreme stuff as it became apparent it has causing harm.
  • Took more vacation days in a shorter period than the average American worker would in nearly five decades.
  • Had the most embarrassing debate performance ever.
  • Basically pissed on the rug on the way out by allowing Ukraine to strike Russia with long-range U.S. Missiles, a line he said previously he was unwilling to cross due to the risk of escalation. Also showed contempt for the tax payers by pettily trying to sell border wall materials off for pennies knowing Trump would have to rebuy buy them at full cost.
 
He did better stuff domestically than any president in decades (low bar to be fair) and got us out of Afghanistan but it seems he is and was suffering from Parkinson's and to anyone honest he'll be known for supporting a genocide.
 
ShadowRun said:
Did they adjust scoring criteria for Covid recovery which inflated all kinds of stats ?

Also cheers SherBro any good burbon or whiskey as of late ? I’m in Thailand having some Jamison (it’s top whiskey at most bars here).
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Cheers, I am definitely jealous of the weather you are probably having. We’ve been lucky to not get too much snow this winter (knock on wood), but Wisconsin winters just drag the fuck on. As for whiskey , are you familiar with Old Overholt? It’s a rye whiskey made by Jim Beam and it’s basically been bottom shelf garbage for years, but they’re trying to rebuild the brand. Last year they released a 10 Year Cask Strength that I never could hunt down, and this year they released an 11 Year Cask Strength that I actually did managed to find, and is really fantastic.

Is your scoring criteria question about the presidential ranking? I am not sure what criteria is used, it’s a poll done by historians and it’s definitely got some subjectivity. Like a few years back, Obama was #15 but in this most recent lust was #7. Andrew Jackson fell several places. Interestingly, Bill Clinton was ranked just slightly higher by conservative historians (#10) than liberal ones (#12). Time is funny like that: conservatives are probably a bit easier on his sexual indiscretions in light of Trump, and we’re a bit harder. Likewise, farther left liberals may not like Clinton’s more centrist policies.

I just think it’s instructive, is all. If we’re asking how history will look back in a certain POTUS, these surveys help us at least answer the question of whether they’re viewed in a generally favorable way or an unfavorable one. Right wing posters here seem to think Trump is miles better than Biden, but he’s not even close in the ranking that historians did.
 
avenue94 said:
Why would you not take into account the Covid recovery when the US outperformed nearly every other comparable country, as well as its own recovery post-recession? Recoveries are never even and carry trade offs, with the US prioritizing the speed of the rebound this time.
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Yeah, in order to be in the "all-time worst" levels you need a major catastrophe or foul-up or just be monstrously inept. In the last several decades, Dubya with Iraq and Trump by being himself deserve to be in this category.

Biden has been a pretty average president. The pandemic recovery was an absolute positive but his cognitive decline and pardoning of his son bring him down to "average."
 
Possum Jenkins said:
Yeah, in order to be in the "all-time worst" levels you need a major catastrophe or foul-up or just be monstrously inept. In the last several decades, Dubya with Iraq and Trump by being himself deserve to be in this category.

Biden has been a pretty average president. The pandemic recovery was an absolute positive but his cognitive decline and pardoning of his son bring him down to "average."
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I generally agree. I think the all-time worst bottom 5 are pretty well set for me.

W. Bush
Pierce
Trump
Andrew Johnson
Buchanan

I could see switching the order on a couple. Pierce may be worse than Trump…. What makes him along with Buchanan and Johnson so bad is their horrific policies that either helped bring about the Civil War, or made Reconstruction horrific. If we were to have some type of national split, or even a more minor civil war type scenario in the next 20 years, I think Trump will be looked at as a major cause of that.

As for Biden… I’d say he’s in the top 20. #14 may be a bit high, but I think top 20 is a safe bet.
 
Possum Jenkins said:
Yeah, in order to be in the "all-time worst" levels you need a major catastrophe or foul-up or just be monstrously inept. In the last several decades, Dubya with Iraq and Trump by being himself deserve to be in this category.

Biden has been a pretty average president. The pandemic recovery was an absolute positive but his cognitive decline and pardoning of his son bring him down to "average."
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I think when the dust settles he'll be considered above average, dependent on how Trump does (if there is more significant democratic backsliding, Biden will be responsible for failing to step aside soon enough). The Hunter pardon is bad, but mostly in a symbolic sense, not in an undermining civic trust or damaging society bad sense at this point.
 
Lmao at anyone who voted for Biden, but lmFao, yes, with the capital F for anyone who continues to support him.

Most of society cannot simply comprehend how stupid you are
 
HereticBD said:
I did address it. I said your novels over Biden's supposed "accomplishments" don't mean shit. He'll go down as one of the worst Presidents in history by the people that matter. The public. Not your left wing historians, who try to re-write history over decades, like they did with Jimmy Carter.

Biden is a bum, and he'll be remembered as such.
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You aren’t…YOU AREN’T LISTENING TO EXPERTS?! WHY DO YOU HATE SCIENCE?!
 
sanguinius said:
You aren’t…YOU AREN’T LISTENING TO EXPERTS?! WHY DO YOU HATE SCIENCE?!
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Yeah, fuck those guys who actually study history for a living. If we wanna know how history will view Biden, why ask historians when John Q. Dumbfuck’s opinion is so much more valuable?
 
BFoe said:
Yeah, fuck those guys who actually study history for a living. If we wanna know how history will view Biden, why ask historians when John Q. Dumbfuck’s opinion is so much more valuable?
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"John Q. Dumbfuck". So typical. When the election doesn't go their way its because Americans are stupid. From the people that parrot the same talking points as Whoopi and Joy Behar do on The View.
 
Mr Holmes said:
"John Q. Dumbfuck". So typical. When the election doesn't go their way its because Americans are stupid. From the people that parrot the same talking points as Whoopi and Joy Behar do on The View.
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“Parroting asking points from the View.”So typical.
I know you guys love junk, bullshit news but I don’t know anyone who actually watches the View.

It’s not a matter of the election not going our way, it’s a matter of people have emotion-based perceptions which don’t align with facts. When the Right thinks Biden is a shit POTUS but actual historians rank him Top 15, that’s a really big disconnect and it isn’t the historians who are wrong. It’s low-information voters who are wrong.

A staggering number of people don’t know what causes inflation, don’t know that deflation is not only very difficult to achieve but is actually worse than inflation so not something we’d want to achieve, if you were going to try and achieve it you wouldn’t do so by adding massive tariffs to everything, a surprising number of Americans don’t seem to understand how tarrifs work anyhow…people bought into right wing messaging and propaganda, and weren’t well-informed.
 
Regardless of how you feel about Biden, it's tough to give much credit to the man himself. His term will be remembered most by his administration lying for years about the president's cognitive abilities, backed by the media machine. Biggest presidential scandal in our lifetime and nobody will be held accountable for it.
 
BFoe said:
When the Right thinks Biden is a shit POTUS but actual historians rank him Top 15, that’s a really big disconnect and it isn’t the historians who are wrong. It’s low-information voters who are wrong.

A staggering number of people don’t know what causes inflation, don’t know that deflation is not only very difficult to achieve but is actually worse than inflation so not something we’d want to achieve, if you were going to try and achieve it you wouldn’t do so by adding massive tariffs to everything, a surprising number of Americans don’t seem to understand how tarrifs work anyhow…people bought into right wing messaging and propaganda, and weren’t well-informed.
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I take it these genius "historians" you are referencing voted for Harris/Walz in 2024?

If they did, are you saying these historians are not wrong in their rankings because they agree with you politically?
 
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