Goodbye Fedor vs. Crocop: The HW division is on a whole new level now

Dbreiden83080 said:
His run in the UFC was not very good overall. CC everybody and I mean everybody said he was coming to dominate. Not even close. He mostly got whooped..
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Cro Cop did not fight a single fight in the ring in UFC.
 
HydralisK said:
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Stipe has never been KO'd.
Neither DC.
 
Dbreiden83080 said:
His run in the UFC was not very good overall. CC everybody and I mean everybody said he was coming to dominate. Not even close. He mostly got whooped..
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A fighter's career begins in the UFC.
 
MartinGibson86 said:
Only proven fact is that Cain pounded Nog.
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This is basically what much of UFC hype is built on, the idea that physical decline doesn't exist and that only results matter, any kind of analysis that doesn't agree with your viewpoint can just be disregarded.

The issue for some I'd imagine is when you've been hoodwinked by this kind of hype its rather humiliating to climb down from it. That's not to say Cormier and Stipe aren't great fighters and would have been great fighters in Pride(but I suspect not a the very top of it) to but the evolution hype is clearly bollocks, its UFC marketing to sell you todays product as the latest and greatest.
 
Claude said:
A fighter's career begins in the UFC.
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Not entirely. But when fans want to dismiss UFC level competition when the fighter in question constantly refuse to sign UFC contracts. Yeah that is a bunch of bullshit. Because some of his contemporaries were supposed to come to the UFC and dominate. They didn’t.
 
moreorless87 said:
This is basically what much of UFC hype is built on, the idea that physical decline doesn't exist and that only results matter, any kind of analysis that doesn't agree with your viewpoint can just be disregarded.

The issue for some I'd imagine is when you've been hoodwinked by this kind of hype its rather humiliating to climb down from it. That's not to say Cormier and Stipe aren't great fighters and would have been great fighters in Pride to but the evolution hype is clearly bollocks, its UFC marketing to sell you todays product as the latest and greatest.
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The de-evolution is drug testing. MMA talent is better than ever but WWs, MWs, and LHWs can't juice up to HW anymore.
 
Dbreiden83080 said:
His run in the UFC was not very good overall. CC everybody and I mean everybody said he was coming to dominate. Not even close. He mostly got whooped..
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You can explain that with age and wear and tear.
It's harder for you to explain Anderson being 3-2 in PRIDE before making UFC look like kintergarten.
 
Dbreiden83080 said:
Not entirely. But when fans want to dismiss UFC level competition when the fighter in question constantly refuse to sign UFC contracts. Yeah that is a bunch of bullshit. Because some of his contemporaries were supposed to come to the UFC and dominate. They didn’t.
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And UFC fighters around the time kept dominating for years and years.
 
Claude said:
Stipe has never been KO'd.
Neither DC.
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CroCop was 3-6 in the UFC. His most notable win - Pat Barry.

Sorry that you fell for the Pride HW hype.

Fedor's post Pride career was pretty equally as grim.

The most notable fighters to come out of Pride were Shogun Hendo and Rampage.
 
MartinGibson86 said:
All I know is he wasn't remotely competitive
and was nearly decapitated.

I guess the Nog who fought Coleman woulda killed Cain.
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Cain would have broken Pride Nog's glass chin with his heavy hands.
 
superpunch said:
The de-evolution is drug testing. MMA talent is better than ever but WWs, MWs, and LHWs can't juice up to HW anymore.
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I suspect if drug testing(although its still IMHO FAR from watertight, especially in terms of fighters being able to bulk up before their MMA career) is causing a problem today its that it means MMA can't get by on an aging talent base propped up by steroids.

I mean you saw in Pride that someone like Coleman was able to carry on at a good level into his 40's and we know common opinion of why that was but generally MMA in that era was a young mans game, at HW Fedor, Nog, Crocop, Aleks, Sergei, Barnett, Arlovski, Werdum etc were all in their 20's. Young fighters naturally have a lot of testosterone and fewer injuries to recover from hence needing to take steroids less(not that some didn't anyway likely of course).

Personally my view is that PEDs actually became a bigger issue post Pride as training tended to move to the USA which is central when it comes to PED use at a personal level(not direct state sponsored doping) and indeed most of the Brazilians caught on PEDs trained in the USA.
 
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