Crime Get me Roger Stone (for obstruction, lying, and witness tampering) (SCO thread v. 28)

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The part about this leak that no Trumper seems to want to understand is that Mueller can't go from evidence to arrest without involving outside parties. Mueller has a pristine record and has leaked nothing, but once he has the evidence for an arrest it goes to a grand jury or judge, they issue a warrant, the clerk delivers the warrant to the appropriate authorities to make the arrest. There are a lot of people between Mueller's investigative team and the FBI personnel who showed up at Roger Stone's door, and any of them could have leaked it.

There's also the concept of court house reporting they don't seem to get. Every court house in the USA has a local beat reporter, no matter how small the county. That beat reporter is at the court house every day, knows all the employees in the court house on friendly terms and certainly knows the difference between standard procedure and something non-standard. It was non-standard for the grand jury to meet on Thursday(rather than the usual Friday), and that's something a local beat reporter would pick up on.
 
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LangfordBarrow said:
A continuous stakeout is outside the realm of possibility?
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Or even more likely a leak from a court clerk where the warrant was issued?

Journalists cultivate friendships with people in the courts (Bailiffs, Security, Admin staff) for just that reason.
 
foxnoob said:
The part about this leak that no Trumper seems to want to understand is that Mueller can't go from evidence to arrest without involving outside parties. Mueller has a pristine record and has leaked nothing, but once he has the evidence for an arrest it goes to a grand jury or judge, they issue a warrant, the clerk delivers the warrant to the appropriate authorities to make the arrest. There are a lot of people between Mueller's investigative team and the FBI personnel who showed up at Roger Stone's door, and any of them could have leaked it.

There's also the concept of court house reporting they don't seem to get. Every court house in the USA has a local beat reporter, now matter how small the county. That beat reporter is at the court house every day, knows all the employees in the court house on friendly terms and certainly knows the difference between standard procedure and something non-standard. It was non-standard for the grand jury to meet on Thursday(rather than the usual Friday), and that's something a local beat reporter would pick up on.
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This happened recently where someone overheard a document request. If I wasn't drunk I'd remember the particulars. :oops::D
 
Quipling said:
Previous Threads
1. Don Jr. Confirms Trump Tower "adoption" meeting w/ kushner, Manafort
2. Gowdy Excoriates Trump
3. Trump Fixates on Leakers
4. Cover of Time
5. "Nothing Illegal"
7. "Nothingburger"
8. Royale With Cheese
9. First Charges
10. One Guilty Plea, Two Indictments
11. This is it Megathread
12. From Mueller with Love
13. Bob Mueller's Thirteen Russian Burgers
14. Conspiracy is a Gates-way Drug
15. Nunberg, not Nothingburger
16. Urine Trouble
17. Tamper Tantrum
18. The investigation just GRU
19. Mid-air Collusion
20. Just a Cohencidence
21. Pecker Problems
22. Patton the Back
23. Manafort Pleas, Thank You
24. Ferris Mueller's Election Off
25. Use it in a Sentence
26. Flynn Cohen to Prison
27. Perjuring the Swamp
28. Get me Roger Stone

Current big news:
  • Roger Stone has been charged with Obstruction, Lying to Investigators, and Witness Tampering. This is in connection with an investigation into his contacts with WikiLeaks and the dissemination of info from the DNC and Clinton hacks
  • BuzzFeed reported that Trump instructed Michael Cohen to lie under oath about the Trump tower deal in Russia. The SCO asserted that Buzzfeed's report was inaccurate with respect to specific statements and conclusions that they drew from them. Guiliani stated that Trump and Cohen discussed the Trump tower deal and Cohen's congressional testimony.
Mod note from previous thread: Please post in here with regards to the subject at hand. Any general chat can go in the WR Lounge thread.
Just to be clear, going forward, these type of posts also count of derailing:
1. Talking about how the thread is derailed/ how mods should handle a situation (report and continue on topic discussions)
2. Joking about posters who are reply banned from the thread
3. Posts with only flaming that do not have any other information about the topic
4. A reply to any of the above

Stop doing these. This isn't some game of getting each other reply bans and infractions. Just stay on topic, report when needed. We have the WR OT for posts like the ones above but they have no place in a normal thread.

Major events so far:
  • Manafort, Trump's campaign manager and transition committee member has been indicted arising from misconduct reaching into 2017 related to payments received through 2014 from the pro-russia faction of Ukraine's pre-war government. Manafort pleaded guilty, agreed to cooperate with federal prosecutors, and then lied to them.
  • Roger Stone has been charged with Obstruction, Lying to Investigators, and Witness Tampering. This is in connection with an investigation into his contacts with WikiLeaks and the dissemination of info from the DNC and Clinton hacks
  • Michael Cohen, Trump's attorney, has pleaded guilty to campaign finance violations, which he claims to have committed at Trump's direction to influence the election. Cohen cooperated with federal prosecutors and received a 3-year sentence.
  • Allen Weisselberg, the Trump Org. CFO, has agreed to immunity in exchange for cooperating with federal prosecutors
  • Rick Gates has pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI and conspiring (with Manafort) to commiting tax fraud, failing to register as a foreign agent, and lying to the FBI
  • George Papadopolous pleaded guilty to lying to federal investigators in 2017 about activities occuring 2016-17. Admits to meeting with various Russian officials regarding setting up meetings and "dirt" on Hillary while acting on behalf of the Trump campaign, something he previously denied. Papadopoulos is now accusing Mifsud of being a deep state plant on Twitter.
  • Mike Flynn, Trump's National Security Advisor, has also pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about several meetings that he had with the Russian ambassador. Flynn was allegedly involved in other business involving Turkey, but has not yet been charged with respect to that behavior.
  • 13 Russian indictment for activity starting in 2014 and continuing through 2017. A US citizen pleaded guilty for agreeing to help them. There is also a separate 12 count indictment targeting GRU officers
  • An attorney linked to Manafort, Gates, and a Russian oligarch has pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI
  • Yohai, Manafort's former son-in-law has agreed to cooperate with the Justice Department
  • Daniels's lawsuit has somehow, insanely, gotten linked up to the Mueller investigation thanks to alleged wrongdoing and influence-peddling by Michael Cohen. Who has pleaded guilty and offered to fully cooperate.
  • Twelve Russian intelligence officers have been indicted for conspiracy against the United States and aggravated identity theft
  • Bruce Ohr, of dossier fame, has been working to obtain information from Russian oligarchs since 2014.
  • Documents relating to Manafort's guilty plea implicate Tony Podesta. Tony Podesta is the brother of Clinton's campaign advisor, John Podesta. His former firm, which is now cooperating with the probe, worked for Manafort in Ukraine.
Dumb talking points:
Stone wasn't charged with Collusion!
Correct. He was charged for obstructing the investigation, lying under oath, and witness tampering.

Why hasn't anybody been charged with "collusion"?
Collusion is a catch-all term. It's not the name of a specific crime.

So where is the Collusion?
The Mueller investigation is about any links between "the Russian Government and individuals associated with the campaign of Donald Trump". Stone is an individual associated with the campaign of Donald Trump. The link investigated there revolves around the information stolen by Russian state actors and distributed through WikiLeaks. For other links, read above.

Where are the thousands of Indictments?
What thousands? There are forty or so listed here, but nobody has claimed thousands.

Stone says he didn't do it!
So do a lot of other defendants who turn out to be guilty.

These are "process crimes", so they don't really count.
First, there isn't a judge in this country who believes that things like obstruction and witness tampering aren't serious crimes. The distinction between "process" crimes and other felonies is meaningless. Second, a significant amount of charged conduct goes well beyond "process." Third, there is definitely a great deal of uncharged or sealed conduct that goes beyond "process"-as shown by the failed redaction in Manafort's recent filing.

CNN was there an hour before Stone was arrested!
Who gives a shit? Why does that matter?
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So weren't all these people just acting in their share holders interest, or is this different then when the AG of Massachusettes goes after Purdue pharma?

Shouldn't the government go after the regulators meant to police this, and not the poor folks who were just acting in their share holders interests?
 
LangfordBarrow said:
Or the tax returns?
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citizen-kane-clapping-gif.gif
 
roger-stone-1.jpg


The man has Nixon on his back. He ain't snitching lmao.
 
dembonesPLUSone said:
The man has Nixon on his back. He ain't snitching lmao.
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Stone is definitely hardcore, but the dude loves to party.

He will face a choice of spending the remainder of his life behind bars or the remainder of his life a free man who can do blow and fuck hookers.

Methinks he chooses the latter when the rubber meets the road. If he really goes down swinging, god bless the man for his misplaced loyalty but that would be stupid as fuck for him to do to himself and his family.
 
foxnoob said:
Stone is definitely hardcore, but the dude loves to party.

He will face a choice of spending the remainder of his life behind bars or the remainder of his life a free man who can do blow and fuck hookers.

Methinks he chooses the latter when the rubber meets the road. If he really goes down swinging, god bless the man for his misplaced loyalty but that would be stupid as fuck for him to do to himself and his family.
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I disagree. I think he'd probably fall on his sword for his ideology. Wasn't he charged with something similar in regards to elections? It was something.. I'm too lazy to look it up but I remember watching it on his documentary.
 
dembonesPLUSone said:
I disagree. I think he'd probably fall on his sword for his ideology. Wasn't he charged with something similar in regards to elections? It was something.. I'm too lazy to look it up but I remember watching it on his documentary.
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If he does I'll be thoroughly impressed by his courage of conviction, even though his conviction is loyalty to a criminal enterprise.

I just don't see it. It's far more likely that Stone is all bluster, he's a soft old fart who has no business trying to get along in jail.
 
foxnoob said:
If he does I'll be thoroughly impressed by his courage of conviction, even though his conviction is loyalty to a criminal enterprise.

I just don't see it. It's far more likely that Stone is all bluster, he's a soft old fart who has no business trying to get along in jail.
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It's not like they'd put him in a supermax. He'd be living life in prison. We all know the super wealthy and powerful people don't do "hard" time.

He's highly intelligent too. He's going to be hard to take down and you can bet your ass on that.
 
dembonesPLUSone said:
It's not like they'd put him in a supermax. He'd be living life in prison. We all know the super wealthy and powerful people don't do "hard" time.

He's highly intelligent too. He's going to be hard to take down and you can bet your ass on that.
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I've never seen anything out of him to back up the claim that he's highly intelligent. He's actually handled himself quite poorly through this whole investigation. Smart people tend to not be so loud.

Is it your position that Stone will not be convicted?
 
foxnoob said:
I've never seen anything out of him to back up the claim that he's highly intelligent. He's actually handled himself quite poorly through this whole investigation. Smart people tend to not be so loud.
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He seems like a sociopathic narcissist. Everything is about him and he celebrates corruption. It's amazing that people are so drawn to these types.
 
Stone was just on Jim amd Sam a couple days ago... It's safe to say, he didn't see this coming.

 
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