Tech Gaming Hardware discussion (& Hardware Sales) thread

[Prefect]

it really depends on what you're doing.

if you're just gaming, i'd stick to the 5900x or 5800x. maybe even the 5600x, depending on your specific situation.

both the 5950x and 3090 are more geared to workstation kinda shit than gaming, imo. they're kinda overkill.

You not bottlenecked with a 5600x and better processors only yield a few frames of fps. You would be better not spending the extra money or just putting it into a better graphics card. You have to turn the resolution down a lot choke up a CPU. What is the point of having a nice rig if you are choking your cpu by running it at 1080 instead of 4k? Why buy an expensive cpu when the only benefit is that it will run 170+ fps at 1080?

 

[SaiWa]

You not bottlenecked with a 5600x and better processors only yield a few frames of fps. You would be better not spending the extra money or just putting it into a better graphics card. You have to turn the resolution down a lot choke up a CPU. What is the point of having a nice rig if you are choking your cpu by running it at 1080 instead of 4k? Why buy an expensive cpu when the only benefit is that it will run 170+ fps at 1080?

CAUSE IT'S 170+ FPS BABY!!!!!

But you right... you right...

 

[jefferz]

You not bottlenecked with a 5600x and better processors only yield a few frames of fps. You would be better not spending the extra money or just putting it into a better graphics card. You have to turn the resolution down a lot choke up a CPU. What is the point of having a nice rig if you are choking your cpu by running it at 1080 instead of 4k? Why buy an expensive cpu when the only benefit is that it will run 170+ fps at 1080?

Anyone some what serious about competitive first person shooters like CS:GO, Valorant, R6 Siege, etc all run their game at 1080p high frame rates. Who do you think those 240hz monitors are made for?

 

[Prefect]

Anyone some what serious about competitive first person shooters like CS:GO, Valorant, R6 Siege, etc all run their game at 1080p high frame rates. Who do you think those 240hz monitors are made for?

There are not many people with 240 hz monitors. I would even go so far as to say that games aren't designed for 1080 in mind. We are on the cusp of ray tracing,4k and 8k gaming, and we are going to design games for shit tier resolutions? DLSS if anything showed that with some cheating, good frame rates can be had at higher resolutions with only marginal expense. DLSS and FidelityFX are going to make 1080 gaming pretty short lived. In my opinion, most gamers would choose 4k 120 fps over 180 1080 fps.

 

[rob mafia]

There are not many people with 240 hz monitors. I would even go so far as to say that games aren't designed for 1080 in mind. We are on the cusp of ray tracing,4k and 8k gaming, and we are going to design games for shit tier resolutions? DLSS if anything showed that with some cheating, good frame rates can be had at higher resolutions with only marginal expense. DLSS and FidelityFX are going to make 1080 gaming pretty short lived. In my opinion, most gamers would choose 4k 120 fps over 180 1080 fps.

ok, but those numbers are pretty arbitrary. 120 fps at 4k? that's barely happening now.

fwiw, i actually still play in 1080 and my next build will almost certainly just be 1440

 

[Satur9]

ok, but those numbers are pretty arbitrary. 120 fps at 4k? that's barely happening now.

fwiw, i actually still play in 1080 and my next build will almost certainly just be 1440

Yeah, high FPS gaming at 4K is only for hardcore enthusiasts at this point, and certainly won’t change for a decent bit. The price to do it is simply beyond most people’s budget, aside from those with crazy disposable income. 1440/144 is what most people I know either play, or wish to play at, due to budget restraints.

unfortunately, for the vast majority out there, it just isn’t in the cards…

 

[Prefect]

Yeah, high FPS gaming at 4K is only for hardcore enthusiasts at this point, and certainly won’t change for a decent bit. The price to do it is simply beyond most people’s budget, aside from those with crazy disposable income. 1440/144 is what most people I know either play, or wish to play at, due to budget restraints.

unfortunately, for the vast majority out there, it just isn’t in the cards…

It isn't really foro hardcore enthusiast. I was hitting 50-60 fps on Cybepunk at 4k with everything cranked up, DLSS balanced, and rtx turned off with a 2080. A 2080 is almost 3 years old now.

 

[Satur9]

It isn't really foro hardcore enthusiast. I was hitting 50-60 fps on Cybepunk at 4k with everything cranked up, DLSS balanced, and rtx turned off with a 2080. A 2080 is almost 3 years old now.

Yes, and to have RT on and at 144, that wouldn’t do it. And the monitor, and so on. It’s expensive. I don’t know many people that have it. Most are still consider 1080 at ultra high frame rates to be the better option. Though you’re right in a way. My post was more hyperbolic than reality.

 

[rob mafia]

It isn't really foro hardcore enthusiast. I was hitting 50-60 fps on Cybepunk at 4k with everything cranked up, DLSS balanced, and rtx turned off with a 2080. A 2080 is almost 3 years old now.

ok, but for starters... a decent monitor that's 4k/120 hz is generally about $1k, itself. that said, the conversation was kind of wonky and hard to pinpoint what he was aiming for (since 5950x and 3090 were mentioned). so... yeah, if one's going to run a 5950x/3090, sure. might as well pay $1200 or so for a good 4k/120 monitor. money's clearly not an issue.

otherwise, though... it gets subjective and largely depends on what someone wants, as there's going to be tradeoffs. gaming/multitasking/workstation/hybrid? frames or resolution? i mean, even the monitors have tradeoffs with response time/frames, colors, brightness, angles.

some people don't seem to notice a difference with fps above 60. shit, some don't seem to notice much of a difference above 30. others get migraines from slow response times/etc.

 

[jefferz]

There are not many people with 240 hz monitors. I would even go so far as to say that games aren't designed for 1080 in mind. We are on the cusp of ray tracing,4k and 8k gaming, and we are going to design games for shit tier resolutions? DLSS if anything showed that with some cheating, good frame rates can be had at higher resolutions with only marginal expense. DLSS and FidelityFX are going to make 1080 gaming pretty short lived. In my opinion, most gamers would choose 4k 120 fps over 180 1080 fps.

You don’t need a 240hz monitor to take advantage of high frame rates though.
By making the statement about games aren't designed for 1080 in mind shows that you know very little about the topic. Let's take a look at the Steam Hardware survey. The Steam Hardware survey is a monthly survey that collects data from gamers about what hardware and software they're running. Steam publishes those results and they can be found here. When looking at the data you can see 68% of people still use 1080p. The next closest, at 7.6%, are 720p laptop screens. Why would a company ignore the largest segment of the market?
You're ignoring a large segment of the gaming market, I mentioned it above, competitive first person shooters which are dominating the market. Apex Legends, Valorant, COD Warzone, CS:GO, R6 Siege, Fortnite, and Overwatch all get played at 1080p. Those people want 1080p resolution with as many frames as possible. When the next competitive FPS comes out, people are going to run it at 1080p as well.

 

[WhiteMousse]

It isn't really foro hardcore enthusiast. I was hitting 50-60 fps on Cybepunk at 4k with everything cranked up, DLSS balanced, and rtx turned off with a 2080. A 2080 is almost 3 years old now.

People who don't play with ray tracing make me SICK

 

[Prefect]

People who don't play with ray tracing make me SICK

It is such a frame rate dump. Like 30 fps. And conventional lighting effect get you 95 %way there.

 

[rob mafia]

It is such a frame rate dump. Like 30 fps. And conventional lighting effect get you 95 %way there.

your stance on frames seems strange.

 

[WhiteMousse]

It is such a frame rate dump. Like 30 fps. And conventional lighting effect get you 95 %way there.

I think there's something to this, but it is untrue when it comes to certain software, Cyberpunk being the most stark example. RT in that game is insane.
If you're talking about Resident Evil Village then yes, ray tracing is somewhat irrelevant.

FWIW I was being silly when I made the comment about RT.

Having said that I'm still trying to get an Aorus Xtreme 3090 because of RT. I believe it's very important for the incoming generation

 

[method115]

I think there's something to this, but it is untrue when it comes to certain software, Cyberpunk being the most stark example. RT in that game is insane.
If you're talking about Resident Evil Village then yes, ray tracing is somewhat irrelevant.

FWIW I was being silly when I made the comment about RT.

Having said that I'm still trying to get an Aorus Xtreme 3090 because of RT. I believe it's very important for the incoming generation

Yea Cyberpunk has incredible RT.

 

[Prefect]

I think there's something to this, but it is untrue when it comes to certain software, Cyberpunk being the most stark example. RT in that game is insane.
If you're talking about Resident Evil Village then yes, ray tracing is somewhat irrelevant.

FWIW I was being silly when I made the comment about RT.

Having said that I'm still trying to get an Aorus Xtreme 3090 because of RT. I believe it's very important for the incoming generation

I am not saying that it isn't incredible but it isn't always clear to the user when it is in play and the hardware we have struggles with the workload that it adds. I have a strong suspicion that it will never be fully excepted due to the horsepower could ready be put to other things that would more add to the enjoyment of the graphics and gameplay. If I were a betting man, I would guess that DLSS and Fidelity will incorporate superior light effects into their AI image enchancement.

This is where AI image enhancement is going.

 

[Madmick]

The new generation of Intel's "Canyon" NUCs that debuted back at Computex are available for pre-order with the 11th gen CPUs. This gen will be called "Beast Canyon". As was previously teased, the change from previous generation is that it will now support full-sized GPUs.
https://simplynuc.com/beast-canyon/
Teardown:
https://wccftech.com/intel-beast-ca...insane-sff-pc-core-i9-11900kb-tiger-lake-cpu/

Baseline configurations below. RAM and SSD can be upgraded when ordering. Everything else by the system board + CPU appear to be user replaceable including the case's mesh plate and the fans. SimplyNUC, who is offering it for pre-order, will even install Linux (Fedora or Ubuntu) as the OS for free if you select one of those.

Intel Beast Canyon NUC
Product Specs PDF

• CPU: i7-11700B ($1399) / i9-11900KB ($1599)
• GPU: not included
• RAM: 8GB (2x4GB) DDR4-3200 SODIMM [max 2x32GB support if upgrading]
• SSD: 256GB m.2 NVME
• WiFi: Intel 6E AX210 Networking Card; WiFi 6 + Bluetooth 5.2, 2x2, 2.4 Gbps
• PSU: FSP Dagger Pro 650W Gold Fully Modular ITX (FSP650-57SAB-A SFF)
• Cooling: 3 x 92mm Cooler Master case fans + 1 x Active Cooling fan trained on the PCIe 4.0 GPU slot
• OS: not included

Slot & Port Specifications:

• 1 x PCIe 4.0(x16) Slot [GPU Support: Dual Slot; up to 12" / 305mm]
• 3 x m.2 Slots [1x = PCIe 4.0 (x4) for Gen4 drives]
• 1 x HDMI 2.0b connector
• 2 x Thunderbolt 4 ports
• 1 x Intel 2.5Gb (1225-LM) and/or 10 Gb Ethernet ports
• 6 x USB 3.1 Headers (Gen2) + 2 x USB 2.0 Headers
• Front Panel Header: Reset, HDD LED, Power LEDs, power on/off

Dimensions

• Mechanical Chassis Size (H x W x D): 7.4" x 4.7" x 14.0" (189mm x 120mm x 357mm)
• Volume: ~8L*

*This is -1L less than the Playstation 5

So this line still carries a pretty stiff premium, but it's more justifiable than ever. This thing competes with the Corsair One series for builders who want more choice over their basic components, and greater potential for expansion. The sacrifice is no liquid cooling. The 8L volume is pretty incredible. The only case ever sold on the open SFF market that matched this case volume while still supporting a 300mm+ GPU is the Dr. Zaber Sentry, and you can't buy it anymore. The Dan A4 is the only one now that is a worthy mention.


Edit Update #1: Intel declares lower MSRPs for skinnier, more flexible versions
https://www.techspot.com/news/90600-intel-beast-canyon-nuc-11-extreme-kit-now.html

About a week ago, Simply NUC listed the Intel NUC 11 Extreme configurations for pre-order, available for $1,399 (i7-11700B) and $1,599 (i9-11900KB). However, Intel puts their MSRP below that mark, at $1,150 and $1,350, respectively, but they don't come with RAM nor a 256GB NVMe SSD.

Edit Update #2: Reviews
Anandtech: Intel Beast Canyon NUC Review: Desktop Tiger Lake Debuts in SFF Gaming Powerhouse
Tom's Hardware: Intel NUC 11 Extreme Kit (Beast Canyon) Review: Small Bare Bones, Big Gaming
Tweaktown: Intel NUC 11 Extreme "Beast Canyon" Review
PC Mag: Intel NUC 11 Extreme Kit ('Beast Canyon') Review
Engadget: Intel NUC 11 Extreme review: A tiny gaming desktop you may actually want

 

[WhiteMousse]

The new generation of Intel's "Canyon" NUCs that debuted back at Computex are available for pre-order with the 11th gen CPUs. This gen will be called "Beast Canyon". As was previously teased, the change from previous generation is that it will now support full-sized GPUs.
https://simplynuc.com/beast-canyon/
Teardown:
https://wccftech.com/intel-beast-ca...insane-sff-pc-core-i9-11900kb-tiger-lake-cpu/

Baseline configurations below. RAM and SSD can be upgraded when ordering. Everything else by the system board + CPU appear to be user replaceable including the case's mesh plate and the fans. SimplyNUC, who is offering it for pre-order, will even install Fedora or Ubuntu for free if you select those.

Intel Beast Canyon NUC
Product Specs PDF

• CPU: i7-11700B ($1399) / i9-11900KB ($1599)
• GPU: not included
• RAM: 8GB (2x4GB) DDR4-3200 SODIMM [max 2x32GB support if upgrading]
• SSD: 256GB m.2 NVME
• WiFi: Intel 6E AX210 Networking Card; WiFi 6 + Bluetooth 5.2, 2x2, 2.4 Gbps
• PSU: FSP Dagger Pro 650W Gold Fully Modular ITX (FSP650-57SAB-A SFF)
• Cooling: 3 x 92mm Cooler Master case fans + 1 x Active Cooling fan trained on the PCIe 4.0 GPU slot
• OS: not included

Slot & Port Specifications:

• 1 x PCIe 4.0(x16) Slot [GPU Support: Dual Slot; up to 12" / 305mm]
• 3 x m.2 Slots [1x = PCIe 4.0 (x4) for Gen4 drives]
• 1 x HDMI 2.0b connector
• 2 x Thunderbolt 4 ports
• 1 x Intel 2.5Gb (1225-LM) and/or 10 Gb Ethernet ports
• 6 x USB 3.1 Headers (Gen2) + 2 x USB 2.0 Headers
• Front Panel Header: Reset, HDD LED, Power LEDs, power on/off

Dimensions

• Mechanical Chassis Size: 14" x 7.4" x 4.7" (357 x 189 x 120 mm)
• Volume: ~8L

So this line still carries a pretty stiff premium, but it's more justifiable than ever. This thing competes with the Corsair One series for builders who want more choice over their basic components, and greater potential for expansion. The sacrifice is no liquid cooling. The 8L volume is pretty incredible. The only case ever sold on the open SFF market that matched this case volume while still supporting a 300mm+ GPU is the Dr. Zaber Sentry, and you can't buy it anymore. The Dan A4 is the only one now that is a worthy mention.

This looks sick. If it had more memory I'd grab it and then wait for a GPU snag

 

[jefferz]

ARM’s PlasticARM is a flexible microprocessor made from plastic rather than silicon

Most microprocessors are made using silicon. And most are rigid, which means that if you want to put them in flexible devices like folding phones or wearables, they’ll need to be placed in a section that doesn’t bend.
ARM has just unveiled a new PlasticARM chip that bucks both trends. It’s a natively flexible processor made with plastic instead of silicon.

The company says PlasticARM is the “first fully functional non-silicon ARM processor.” The first chip was manufactured last fall using PragmatIC’s FlexLogIC manufacturing system.

ARM says plastic could be much cheaper to produce, while their flexible nature would allow them to be used in different sorts of applications. They can be used with paper, plastic, or metal foil substrates. So not only are we looking at a chip technology that could be used for wearable devices like smartwatches and foldable phones, but also for food packaging, bandages or other wearable medical devices, and all sorts of other applications.

But while ARM’s new technology could eventually pave the way for cheaper, more flexible electronics, the first PlasticARM chip offers pretty barebones specs:

• 32-bit ARM Cortex-M0 SoC (system on a chip)
• ARMv6-M architecture
• 20 kHz clock during testing (Support for up to 29 kHz @ 3V or 40 kHz @ 4.5V)
• 128 bytes RAM
• 456 bytes ROM
• 0.8-μm process

ARM claims that despite those rather basic features, the chip is “twelve times more complex than the previous state-of-the-art flexible electronics.”

 

[Madmick]

This looks sick. If it had more memory I'd grab it and then wait for a GPU snag

The RAM and SSD are upgradeable at the pre-order phase. While the prices might appear to comically overcharge for upgrades, like with every other prebuilt desktop and laptops in existence, in fact, these upgrade fees are highly competitive for the RAM.
https://simplynuc.com/nuc11btmi9-full/
That's because you'll find SODIMM RAM rated to 3200MHz+ is very expensive:
https://pcpartpicker.com/products/m...68002,65536002&sort=price&U=4&h=0&S=3200,5100

On the other hand, those SSD upgrade premiums are criminal. One would take the 256GB option, since it's included, but then buy a larger, faster SSD separately. Move the included SSD to one of the lower priority m.2 bandwidth slots when it arrives, install your larger SSD to the primary slot. Install your OS to that larger SSD.