Tech Gaming Hardware discussion (& Hardware Sales) thread

I think its that for that much money I'd rather just spend a bit more and get a new generation cpu, mobo, ram, etc.
This parts confusing. Your saying its a steal but then second guessing yourself and saying "well for that much money I could spend a bit more " (it isn't that much money, a modern 1080 equivalent card + a copy of windows would cost almost what the entire computer cost).

It's not gonna be "a bit more for new generation", it's gonna be easily 2x the price of that PC.

I actually like that PC for that price. If it has Windows 10 you can just buy your own SSD for cheap (load windows for free since windows 10 is locked to the motherboard) and basically have a quad core cpu with modern SSD, plenty of ram, and a damn good graphics card for barely over $500. That PC you can use till the next generation of game consoles/game engines roll out in 2021 (this computer can basically be an affordable temporary gap until we have a better idea of what the future is actually gonna require/need).

If your a strong component of building a machine and sitting on for awhile then I'm actually not a huge fan of doing expensive new builds this late into a generation
 
Situation: current PC works for browsing/watching movies but is outdated and messed up, cant properly game on it. Tried every bit of trouble shooting I can and it just wont work. I will need to get a new PC eventually but it doesn't necessarily have to be right this moment.

There is a used one on craigslist or $460, it has

1080
i5 3570k
generic mobo
generic 700w psu
name brand 16g ram ddr3 2133 freq
old slow 1tb harddrive

would this be a steal at that price for the graphics card alone? I feel like it is but for some reason something is telling me to pass...

I think its that for that much money I'd rather just spend a bit more and get a new generation cpu, mobo, ram, etc.
Yes, that's a steal thanks in large part to the GPU. The GTX 1080 is roughly equivalent to the RTX 2060 in games as you can see from the Techpowerup chart on the previous page (and to the RTX 2060 Super in synthetics). So it's carrying a value in the range of $330-$450 (if it was new).

2fcb3c0d-bed1-43f7-b46a-d2acc64c6980_1.6acdb8316d374860f1634b729a468643.jpeg


On sheer hardware value you're not going to beat the Overpowered DTW3 above from Wal-Mart. It's $999, and when it originally released it was $1999. We did see this particular unit as low as $899 in June this year, so you might wait to see if they try to clear out the remaining inventory with a sale on Black Friday or Cyber Monday before the hardware ages out with the next major launches from the CPU and GPU manufacturers:
https://www.walmart.com/ip/66JOIO7GH9ZB
  • CPU: i7-8700
  • CPU Cooling: CooNong (3-pipe 120mm)
  • GPU: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 Ti
  • Motherboard: Gigabyte H370M DS3H
  • RAM: Adata 32GB (2x16GB) DDR4-2400 RAM
  • SSD: ADATA ISSS316 512GB (3D TLC NAND)
  • HDD: Toshiba 2TB 7200RPM HDD
  • PSU: Great Wall 650W Gold
  • Case: Mid ATX Tower with Windowing & 4x120mm fans
  • Dimensions: W: 8.1" H: 17.5" L: 16.0"

Carries a $1360 value on the self-builder market (RTX 2070 Super substituted for GTX 1080 Ti):
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/yzR4q3


Biggest drawbacks:
-- GPU thermals can exceed optimal range
-- 2400MHz RAM (slow relative to affordable sticks available in 2019)
-- SSD is not an ideal selection for OS, but still satisfactory

The price on these cratered because of the sheepish nature of YouTube consumers online who eagerly forward their regurgitated opinions about products they don't own. Beware these parrots. None of them critically assess the negative feedback in the first place. The truth is that there was very little criticism of substance even in those "reviews" (which were really hit jobs by a bunch of people whose businesses are threatened by extraordinary prebuild values like this). I was irritated by these histrionics. Linus obsessed over input latency, because it was the only thing he could find where his Overpowered unit lagged in benchmarks versus a far more expensive Alienware build, and also over hard drive partitions. Seriously...hard drive partitions. Who gives a shit? Just reformat the goddamn drive. The OS is on the SSD.

Take the Tom's Hardware review of the DTW3, specifically, as an example. You might notice they only gave it 3 stars. You also might notice none of the "cons" is substantial. Seriously, they tried wedging in "gaudy" as a critique. It's some real knuckle-dragging shit.
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/walmart-overpowered-gaming-desktop-dtw3,5627.html

The Great Wall PSUs were discovered to perform well. The CPU cooler has a weird, unfamiliar Chinese name, so the truth that it's far superior to the stock cooler that comes with non-K Intel CPUs eludes the neophytes. Only GPU thermals raise any meaningful concern, from the GN review, and those can be addressed by removing the front panel, or with tricks that allow for more airflow without completely removing it.

In fact, ignore the customer feedback rating on Wal-Mart. It's doesn't require verified purchase. I dug through comments in the past. Here was a gem I found for the DTW1 unit:
https://www.walmart.com/reviews/product/621888364
"As someone with their own pc business... Why? Cheap bare bones motherboard with only 1 slot for memory, ram stick looks like it's from the year 2003. Poor cable management. Missing screws. Poor quality power supply that would probably short within 6 months. Who designed this PC? Which QC person passed this? It's shocking. I had a customer bring one of these in for repair and I was shocked. I recommend they scrap it. 0/10 would NOT recommend."
The problem with that is the motherboard in that particular unit was the Gigabyte H310M S2, and it has 2-RAM slots. In fact, I don't know of a single contemporary motherboard built on a universal form factor that doesn't have at least 2 RAM slots. But hey, this guy is "someone with their own pc business."

Shit like that snowballs, and you get a bunch of know-nothings hating on these for reasons they either imagine or don't even understand.
 
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Yes, that's a steal thanks in large part to the GPU. The GTX 1080 is roughly equivalent to the RTX 2060 in games as you can see from the Techpowerup chart on the previous page (and to the RTX 2060 Super in synthetics). So it's carrying a value in the range of $330-$450 (if it was new).

2fcb3c0d-bed1-43f7-b46a-d2acc64c6980_1.6acdb8316d374860f1634b729a468643.jpeg


On sheer hardware value you're not going to beat the Overpowered DTW3 above from Wal-Mart. It's $999, and when it originally released it was $1999. We did see this particular unit as low as $899 in June this year, so you might wait to see if they try to clear out the remaining inventory with a sale on Black Friday or Cyber Monday before the hardware ages out with the next major launches from the CPU and GPU manufacturers:
https://www.walmart.com/ip/66JOIO7GH9ZB
  • GPU: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 Ti.
  • CPU: Intel Core i7-8700 6-core/12-thread.
  • Motherboard: Gigabyte H370M DS3H
  • RAM: Adata 32GB (2x16GB) DDR4-2400 RAM
  • Storage: Adata 512GB SSD, Toshiba 2TB HDD
  • PSU: Great Wall 650W Gold
  • CPU Cooling: CooNong
  • Dimensions: W: 8.1" H: 17.5" L: 16.0"

Biggest drawbacks:
-- 2400MHz RAM (slow relative to affordable sticks available in 2019)
-- GPU thermals can exceed optimal range

The price on these cratered because of the sheepish nature of YouTube consumers online who eagerly forward their regurgitated opinions about products they don't won. Beware these parrots. They don't even realize the DTW3 isn't the unit that was reviewed by most of the YouTubers like LTT & GN they regurgitate, and none of them critically assess the negative feedback in the first place. The truth is that there was very little criticism of substance even in those "reviews" (which were really hit jobs by a bunch of people whose businesses are threatened by extraordinary prebuild values like this). I was irritated by these histrionics. Linus obsessed over input latency, because it was the only thing he could find where his Overpowered unit lagged in benchmarks versus a far more expensive Alienware build, and also over hard drive partitions. Seriously...hard drive partitions. Who gives a shit? Just reformat the goddamn drive. The OS is on the SSD.

Take the Tom's Hardware review of the DTW3, specifically, as an example. You might notice they only gave it 3 stars. You also might notice none of the "cons" is substantial. Seriously, they tried wedging in "gaudy" as a critique. It's some real knuckle-dragging shit.
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/walmart-overpowered-gaming-desktop-dtw3,5627.html

The Great Wall PSUs were discovered to perform well. The CPU cooler has a weird, unfamiliar Chinese name, so the truth that it's far superior to the stock cooler that comes with non-K Intel CPUs eludes the neophytes. Only GPU thermals raise any meaningful concern, from the GN review, and those can be addressed by removing the front panel, or with tricks that allow for more airflow without completely removing it.

In fact, ignore the customer feedback rating on Wal-Mart. It's doesn't require verified purchase. I dug through comments in the past. Here was a gem I found for the DTW1 unit:
https://www.walmart.com/reviews/product/621888364

The problem with that is the motherboard in that particular unit was the Gigabyte H310M S2, and it has 2-RAM slots. In fact, I don't know of a single contemporary motherboard built on a universal form factor that doesn't have at least 2 RAM slots. But hey, this guy is "someone with their own pc business."

Shit like that snowballs, and you get a bunch of know-nothings hating on these for reasons they either imagine or don't even understand.
I think I'm going to pass on it. Just gonna go with my gut. For one I'm worried about the GPU dying a month or two down the road.

Also the idea of having ~2100 ram bothers me, even if it will have little to no impact on gaming. If rather just spend more to get a newer CPU with more cores that supports ddr4 3600 ram, along with an RTX card
 
i mean, if you're savvy... you could buy it for the gpu, build a new comp with it, and list the 2 old comps for sale on craigslist (especially if you happen to have a spare gpu, but even if one is lacking it)... might be a good idea to message him and offer $400.
 
Great news for AMD. TSMC and Digital Foundries dropped their lawsuits against each other. They have signed a cross-license agreement which will allow both companies to each other's patents, and those which are filed within the next ten years. This will allow Digital Foundries to catch up with their 7nm and be able to produce chips for AMD, ending their shortage.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...oundries-settle-patent-disputes-idUSKBN1X72BT
 
maybe. i'm not sure how long it would take GF to catch up, the shortage might be over by then. i have no idea how much progress gf made before they cancelled their 7nm node or etc, though.

regardless, more competition/supply should be good news for everyone... except maybe intel.
 
maybe. i'm not sure how long it would take GF to catch up, the shortage might be over by then. i have no idea how much progress gf made before they cancelled their 7nm node or etc, though.

regardless, more competition/supply should be good news for everyone... except maybe intel.

GF is owned by the government of Abu Dhabi so they have a pile of money they can throw at it. It also depends on where they decide to make them. They're currently building a fab in China so if they decide to use that location, they can spin it up pretty quick.
 
GTX 1660 Super was released today. Not bad, basically stock 1070/1660 Ti performance for $230 brand new.

<mma4>

Will be interested to see the 1650 Super. I'm interested because this has been the worst generation for entry level cards. A 6 year old 7870XT tahiti (which was only $135 this time in 2013) is faster than almost every single entry level card (GT 1030, GTX 1050 non Ti, GTX 750, GTX 950, RX460/560).

That's embarrassing, thats like the equivalent of a 2011 entry level card barely offering 8600 GT/GTS level performance
 
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GTX 1660 Super was released today. Not bad, basically stock 1070/1660 Ti performance for $230 brand new.

<mma4>

Will be interested to see the 1650 Super. I'm interested because this has been the worst generation for entry level cards. A 6 year old 7870XT tahiti (which was only $135 this time in 2013) is faster than almost every single entry level card (GT 1030, GTX 1050 non Ti, GTX 750, GTX 950, RX460/560).

That's embarrassing, thats like the equivalent of a 2011 entry level card barely offering 8600 GT/GTS level performance

Entry level cards have always been terrible for price to performance, this shouldn't surprise anyone.
The same dollar amount today, $135, will buy you a nice RX570 which is a killer price/performance card. If you want to adjust for inflation, $148, you're only $12 away from an RX580 8gb
 
Entry level cards have always been terrible for price to performance, this shouldn't surprise anyone.
Not true at all, that's why it's surprising.

2.5 years into last gen you could get near highend launch performance (X1900/7900GT level) and 10-15% faster performance than a 1 year old midtier (8600GTS level) on just an $89 dollar 9500GT.

Yes this is surprising. Entry level was of course not the #1 bang for your buck but is use to never be "terrible", it was always good or acceptable. Over half decade old performance for the same exact price is pathetic. Prices have gotten a little better recently with 570/580 price drops (dropping prices/inventory before the 5500/5500XT launch) but up until then it's been god awful
 
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Not true at all, that's why it's surprising.

2.5 years into last gen you could get near highend launch performance (X1900/7900GT level) and 10-15% faster performance than a 1 year old midtier (8600GTS level) on just an $89 dollar 9500GT.

Yes this is surprising. Entry level was of course not the #1 bang for your buck but is use to never be "terrible", it was always good or acceptable. Over half decade old performance for the same exact price is pathetic. Prices have gotten a little better recently with 570/580 price drops (dropping prices/inventory before the 5500/5500XT launch) but up until then it's been god awful
Yeah, don't know where that's coming from. The low-end cards were often the kings of value up until around 2013. That was back when you could get the lowest end gaming-class card for starting around $60 (ex. Radeon HD 6670). It went sideways sometime during the GTX 750 generation. That's when all of a sudden that entry price point pushed north of $100, and at times was as high as ~$120.
 


Looks like the "GIFV" file extension does not embed on Sherdog, but this is a animation that any who visit this thread will love, so follow the link to check it out.
 


Looks like the "GIFV" file extension does not embed on Sherdog, but this is a animation that any who visit this thread will love, so follow the link to check it out.


For GIFV you need to embed is as a media URL rather than image.

 
how long before the next generation of cards up from the RTX 2080's come out? I have a system with a GTX1080 32gb ram and a decent i7, this works fine for me as I game at either 1080p or 1440p. I'm looking at putting a new system together for my new gaming room, but thinking it's a better idea to skip the RTX 80''s generation and just wait for the new cards in 2020 as my current system is going pretty well.

Not been able to get much good detail on exactly the new cards will be out next year tho.
 
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