Media Free fight: Do Bronx vs FKL

The confidence of Oliviera was most impressive here, & he looked substantially more skilled in his kickboxing. He was still opened to being countered, but his pre-exchange defensive was solid with mostly slips but also managing distance well. Tony Ferguson-esq in his pressure as well, with more jumping & flying shit.

Lee landed a few counter rights from the orthodox stance(which I found odd but he looked clean in) that would have broken the Oliviera of old, but he fired back & landed without hesitation. Marching forward his footwork in cutting off the cage was great. He beat the best version of Kevin Lee, who looked leaner than ever & more skilled under Firas.

His grappling is as dangerous as ever if not more so, as he mostly outmaneuvered 'round one Lee' who even with staph was able to soundly beat up Ferguson in round 1. I think this version Oliviera beats current Tony, & maybe prime Tony.

EDIT: Oliviera got his 15th 'Performance of The Night' bonus & his 17th UFC win. Dude doesnt get enough respect.
 
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Joseph_McBride said:
The confidence of Oliviera was most impressive here, & he looked substantially more skilled in his kickboxing. He was still opened to being countered, but his pre-exchange defensive was solid with mostly slips but also managing distance well. Tony Ferguson-esq in his pressure as well, with more jumping & flying shit.

Lee landed a few counter rights from the orthodox stance(which I found odd but he looked clean in) that would have broken the Oliviera of old, but he fired back & landed without hesitation. Marching forward his footwork in cutting off the cage was great. He beat the best version of Kevin Lee, who looked leaner than ever & more skilled under Firas.

His grappling is as dangerous as ever if not more so, as he mostly outmaneuvered 'round one Lee' who even with staph was able to soundly beat up Ferguson in round 1. I think this version Oliviera beats current Tony, & maybe prime Tony.

EDIT: Oliviera got his 15th 'Performance of The Night' bonus & his 17th UFC win. Dude doesnt get enough respect.
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Charles looked extremely good in this fight, but to say he beat the best version of Kevin Lee is a silly thing to say.

Kevin Lee missed weight and looked horrid at the weigh in which was the result of a horrible weight cut which was very evident just by looking at him. Kevin Lee himself said he had a horrible weight cut due to the UFC not providing a nutritionist like they did in his previous fight (definitely something he should have made sure he was set on) and he essentially handled his own diet while in Brazil which was poor based on what he said he was eating.

Kevin also mentioned that while he was in Brazil he didn’t know if the fight was actually going to happen or not which doesn’t help when preparing from a mental standpoint. Wasn’t this also the first UFC event without a live crowd?

You can’t take anything away from Charles as his performance was phenomenal, but you also can’t say this was the best version of Kevin Lee when it very clearly wasn’t.
 
Joseph_McBride said:
The confidence of Oliviera was most impressive here, & he looked substantially more skilled in his kickboxing. He was still opened to being countered, but his pre-exchange defensive was solid with mostly slips but also managing distance well. Tony Ferguson-esq in his pressure as well, with more jumping & flying shit.

Lee landed a few counter rights from the orthodox stance(which I found odd but he looked clean in) that would have broken the Oliviera of old, but he fired back & landed without hesitation. Marching forward his footwork in cutting off the cage was great. He beat the best version of Kevin Lee, who looked leaner than ever & more skilled under Firas.

His grappling is as dangerous as ever if not more so, as he mostly outmaneuvered 'round one Lee' who even with staph was able to soundly beat up Ferguson in round 1. I think this version Oliviera beats current Tony, & maybe prime Tony.

EDIT: Oliviera got his 15th 'Performance of The Night' bonus & his 17th UFC win. Dude doesnt get enough respect.
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There's a strong argument that he lost the first two rounds though.

But I agree. Oliveira looked very polished both on the feet and ground.
 
Joseph_McBride said:
The confidence of Oliviera was most impressive here, & he looked substantially more skilled in his kickboxing. He was still opened to being countered, but his pre-exchange defensive was solid with mostly slips but also managing distance well. Tony Ferguson-esq in his pressure as well, with more jumping & flying shit.

Lee landed a few counter rights from the orthodox stance(which I found odd but he looked clean in) that would have broken the Oliviera of old, but he fired back & landed without hesitation. Marching forward his footwork in cutting off the cage was great. He beat the best version of Kevin Lee, who looked leaner than ever & more skilled under Firas.

His grappling is as dangerous as ever if not more so, as he mostly outmaneuvered 'round one Lee' who even with staph was able to soundly beat up Ferguson in round 1. I think this version Oliviera beats current Tony, & maybe prime Tony.

EDIT: Oliviera got his 15th 'Performance of The Night' bonus & his 17th UFC win. Dude doesnt get enough respect.
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U gotta give credit to both fighters in the grappling here.

Oliveira was a wizard in his fluid, creative transitions and he was just nonstop but for everything charles threw at him, he defended very well and showed a lot of grappling / positional iq. And he ended the first 2 rounds on top, doing damage.

Obviously not good enough as he got choked, but both fighters deserve credit here.
 
Hitto said:
{<jordan}


Lee did nothing besides lay and pray, he landed nothing and was technically outskilled by Oliviera badly
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He landed quite a few shots on the feet in the first. It was fairly even on the feet. In the grappling, oliveira threw everything at him and Lee defended, countered effectively and ended up in advantageous positions of his own. The activity and danger of Oliveira's grappling from the bottom made it difficult to land effective shots, but he landed a few. A few big shots near the end of the round followed by 2 minutes of control stole the round.

Oliveira looked to be pressuring in the second, landed some solid shots and was looking dangerous, but he was taken down, controlled and trapped in half gaurd for half the round taking shots and elbows.

In terms of damage you can certainly argue Oliveira won the second, although it's always gonna be uncommon to give a round to a fighter who's controlled for the last 2 and a half minutes of a round taking strikes.

It was a competitive fight.
 
I remember just a few years back people thought Kevin Lee was the next GOAT lol.
 
Rewatching this made me realize Oliveira would have been the toughest fight for Khabib
 
MescalineDreams said:
He landed quite a few shots on the feet in the first. It was fairly even on the feet. In the grappling, oliveira threw everything at him and Lee defended, countered effectively and ended up in advantageous positions of his own. The activity and danger of Oliveira's grappling from the bottom made it difficult to land effective shots, but he landed a few. A few big shots near the end of the round followed by 2 minutes of control stole the round.

Oliveira looked to be pressuring in the second, landed some solid shots and was looking dangerous, but he was taken down, controlled and trapped in half gaurd for half the round taking shots and elbows.

In terms of damage you can certainly argue Oliveira won the second, although it's always gonna be uncommon to give a round to a fighter who's controlled for the last 2 and a half minutes of a round taking strikes.

It was a competitive fight.
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Correction it was not 2 minutes of control.

It was 1 minute at the very end.

Still, I think it was a very close round. Striking was even, Oliveira was active as fuck with his jiu jitsu but lee defended well. Then he landed 4 solid punches from the top, some of the best of the round and ended the round in a dominant position.

But I could see how some might give the first to Oliveira. It was close
 
shogobruh said:
Charles looked extremely good in this fight, but to say he beat the best version of Kevin Lee is a silly thing to say.

Kevin Lee missed weight and looked horrid at the weigh in which was the result of a horrible weight cut which was very evident just by looking at him. Kevin Lee himself said he had a horrible weight cut due to the UFC not providing a nutritionist like they did in his previous fight (definitely something he should have made sure he was set on) and he essentially handled his own diet while in Brazil which was poor based on what he said he was eating.

Kevin also mentioned that while he was in Brazil he didn’t know if the fight was actually going to happen or not which doesn’t help when preparing from a mental standpoint. Wasn’t this also the first UFC event without a live crowd?

You can’t take anything away from Charles as his performance was phenomenal, but you also can’t say this was the best version of Kevin Lee when it very clearly wasn’t.
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Lee didnt even try to cut all the weight, he didn't have to suffer those last few pounds which helped him if anything.
 
MescalineDreams said:
He landed quite a few shots on the feet in the first. It was fairly even on the feet. In the grappling, oliveira threw everything at him and Lee defended, countered effectively and ended up in advantageous positions of his own. The activity and danger of Oliveira's grappling from the bottom made it difficult to land effective shots, but he landed a few. A few big shots near the end of the round followed by 2 minutes of control stole the round.

Oliveira looked to be pressuring in the second, landed some solid shots and was looking dangerous, but he was taken down, controlled and trapped in half gaurd for half the round taking shots and elbows.

In terms of damage you can certainly argue Oliveira won the second, although it's always gonna be uncommon to give a round to a fighter who's controlled for the last 2 and a half minutes of a round taking strikes.

It was a competitive fight.
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charles-oliveira-def-kevin-lee-ufc-brasilia-scorecard.jpg



Every judge gave Oliviera the first two rounds and then he finished Lee in the third

Lee also came in heavy and looked way bigger than him

Wasn’t close or competitive at all
 
Hitto said:
charles-oliveira-def-kevin-lee-ufc-brasilia-scorecard.jpg



Every judge gave Oliviera the first two rounds and then he finished Lee in the third

Lee also came in heavy and looked way bigger than him

Wasn’t close or competitive at all
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If you look at all the news outlets

Most gave Lee the second.

The first was very close. The striking was even. Both landed very good shots. lee landed better counters and clean shots. Oliveira was a wizard with his creative transitions and attacks, but Lee defended well and himself showcased some strong grappling and positional IQ in the face of a solid black belt in Oliveira.

I could see why you might give the first to Oliveira. But I think ending the last minute in a dominant position position and those 3-4 punches to the head from the top were probably the best of the round and I think you could easily argue stole it.

But yeah. It was competitive in many respects. Which I myself didn't even realize until rewatching just now. Hindsight is 20/20.

You're entitled to your opinion. But you've made it clear you don't like Lee for a long time. You aren't exactly the picture of objectivity.
 
SHAZAM said:
Lmfao at anyone thinking Lee won the first 2, specially round 1.
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Most news outlets gave Lee the second. He was on for 50% of the round throwing short shots and elbows.

Lee landed the better strikes on the feet and the 3 shots he landed at the very end were probably the best of the round. On top of ending the last minute of the fight on top.

Like I said I could understand why people would give Oliveira the nod. His technique, fluid transitions and creativity in attacks were nasty and nonstop. But for every attack I think Lee also showed very solid defense, grappling and positional iq and counters of his own.

At the very least, it was competitive. If Lee wasn't competently handling himself on the ground, it would have very quickly considering how on point Oliveira was.
 
SHAZAM said:
Lmfao at anyone thinking Lee won the first 2, specially round 1.
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MescalineDreams said:
Most news outlets gave Lee the second. He was on for 50% of the round throwing short shots and elbows.

Lee landed the better strikes on the feet and the 3 shots he landed at the very end were probably the best of the round. On top of ending the last minute of the fight on top.

Like I said I could understand why people would give Oliveira the nod. His technique, fluid transitions and creativity in attacks were nasty and nonstop. But for every attack I think Lee also showed very solid defense, grappling and positional iq and counters of his own.

At the very least, it was competitive. If Lee wasn't competently handling himself on the ground, it would have very quickly considering how on point Oliveira was.
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This was describing the first round. Not the second. Can't edit.
 
MescalineDreams said:
Lee actually did a lot better than I remember

Looks like he won the first 2 rounds.

Oliveira Is definitely a beast though. He fought like a note technical and refined tony ferguson.
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How on Earth could you give round 1 to Lee? He got lit up on the feet then had to defend sub after sub untill the last 30 seconds where he hit 3 gnp punches.
 
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