Media Free fight: Do Bronx vs FKL

[MescalineDreams]

How on Earth could you give round 1 to Lee? He got lit up on the feet then had to defend sub after sub untill the last 30 seconds where he hit 3 gnp punches.

lee landed some good shots on the feet as well in that first minute and a half before they hit the ground.

On the ground, Oliveira showcased incredibly fluid, technical jiu jitsu, transitions, creativity and attacks, used his length well. But for every attack Lee also defended and countered very well and showcased very strong grappling and positional IQ as well.

Even with all those attacks, Lee still had the advantageous position in the last 2 minutes of the round, passed to half guard, landed 3 of the best punches of the round and ended on

Oliveira attacked but wasn't able to make anything of it, while his opponent was competently defending and avoiding every attack and trap set. In spite of those attacks, Lee was still able to defend and end up in advantageous positions and ended the last 2 minutes on top. That's a close, back and forth battle.

 

[MescalineDreams]

How on Earth could you give round 1 to Lee? He got lit up on the feet then had to defend sub after sub untill the last 30 seconds where he hit 3 gnp punches.

I guess it was ending the last 2 minutes on top and landing 3 of the best shots of the round at the end.

But I could see why you would give it to Oliveira.

 

[MescalineDreams]

How on Earth could you give round 1 to Lee? He got lit up on the feet then had to defend sub after sub untill the last 30 seconds where he hit 3 gnp punches.

All in all think my point stands that it was a competitive round and Lee did a lot better than even I gave him credit for in the fight.

That said, Oliveira Is a beast and is truly hitting his prime. He fought like a more technical, defined and dangerous version of Tony Ferguson.

 

[Myfryfroallfrizzy]

That was fun to rewatch.

 

[Steve-French]

FKL?

Fuckin' Kevin Lee?

 

[Brom Bones]

EXACTLY what we need in the Heavies. Moar Fighter Kevin Lee!

FKL FTW!

PS Anybody come up with pics of Mike Chiesa's mom yet?

 

[MrFeeny]

If you look at all the news outlets

Most gave Lee the second.

The first was very close. The striking was even. Both landed very good shots. lee landed better counters and clean shots. Oliveira was a wizard with his creative transitions and attacks, but Lee defended well and himself showcased some strong grappling and positional IQ in the face of a solid black belt in Oliveira.

I could see why you might give the first to Oliveira. But I think ending the last minute in a dominant position position and those 3-4 punches to the head from the top were probably the best of the round and I think you could easily argue stole it.

But yeah. It was competitive in many respects. Which I myself didn't even realize until rewatching just now. Hindsight is 20/20.

You're entitled to your opinion. But you've made it clear you don't like Lee for a long time. You aren't exactly the picture of objectivity.

who gave Kevin lee the first besides you? It was clear

 

[ExitLUPin]

Lee is one of the most overrated prospects ever

Good fighter but nothing special. So many ppl thought he was champ caliber lmaooo

also i forgot about him furiously tapping and then pretending he didnt to try to continue. Weak

 

[MescalineDreams]

Lee is one of the most overrated prospects ever

Good fighter but nothing special. So many ppl thought he was champ caliber lmaooo

also i forgot about him furiously tapping and then pretending he didnt to try to continue. Weak

And yet still, at 28, he still has more potential than anyone in the current top 10.

Lee is one of the most overrated prospects ever

Good fighter but nothing special. So many ppl thought he was champ caliber lmaooo

also i forgot about him furiously tapping and then pretending he didnt to try to continue. Weak

If you asked a room full of the best fighters , coaches and analysts how they rate lee

I'd bet my entire net worth that they would heavily disagree with you.

Every one of Lee's losses were competitive. Even his fight against RDA, where RDA himself said he didnt think Lee would be able to handle the difference in weight and it even took him a long time before he felt comfortable at welterweight.

This is a RDA who just came off 3 fights with the toughest guys at WW.

Skill wise, he was not out of place at all in that fight. Nor was he in the Bronx fight. It was competitive and he got choked by a high level black belt.

Now, if this were a case where Lee was losing dominantly, I would fully agree. But hes demonstrating, even in his losses that the skill is there in every area.

I think Oliveira is probably one of, if not his toughest fight in the division. A tall, lanky fighter with excellent striking and a wizard off his back.

I think we need to establish that Lee does have the skills to compete with the best in the division. And with more adjustments and continued improvement, along with continuing to put the pieces together under a proper head coach which he didnt have for the last few years, his potential is still very much there.

People forget that he just turned 28. He hasn't even hit his prime yet.

Charles Oliveira is 31. 3 years older than Lee and hes been fighting for 4 years longer. When he was 28, he was losing to Ricardo Lamas and Paul Felder.

If I'm not mistaken, Lee is the youngest fighter in the top 15.

All that said, I think a lot of people are heavily influenced by recency bias, see losses but context and overall miss the bigger picture.

GSP himself said he thinks Lee will end up being the best. This may or may not be true, but I think most fans would be surprised just how far fighter opinions on Lee differ from their own.

 

[MescalineDreams]

Lee is one of the most overrated prospects ever

Good fighter but nothing special. So many ppl thought he was champ caliber lmaooo

also i forgot about him furiously tapping and then pretending he didnt to try to continue. Weak

Some of the greatest minds in the sport believed be was champ caliber and still do. Largely because he is among the youngest fighters competing at that level.

A loss to Oliveira, a competitive one at that where he wasn't dominated but lost by choke is enough to make many ignore all the other available information.

Which speaks volumes about how short sighted even intelligent fans can be when it comes to assessing skillset and potential.

 

[MescalineDreams]

who gave Kevin lee the first besides you? It was clear

I think if you asked a room full of jiu jitsu people how they rated the grappling, most would deem it a lot closer than it was scored.

Reason being, while Oliveira was nonstop attacking, Lee was defending everything thrown at him and countering effectively and consistently establishing advantageous positions of his own. Not only that but he ended the last two minutes on his back with lee landing 3 of the most significant shots of the fight and ending the round with short punches and elbows

Oliveira attacked throughout the round, yes. But everything he did was effectively nullified and Lee was overall more effective and caused more damage.

I myself seen that round as a lot more dominant for Charles the first time around than it actually was and I suspect this was the case for many.

I don't necessarily think anyone is wrong for thinking Oliveira won the round but I think it was competitive and closer than most people think.

 

[MyFavSport]

Kind of a sloppy fight. If Lee would of trusted his hands and not let Do Bronx lead the dance than he could of KOd him.

Chuck has holes but is also a bad ass and I wont be surprised if he beats Tony

 

[LoneStalker]

"I clearly didn't feel a tap" Kevin Lee.

Bonus Khabib vs Tony poster in the cage to torture us a bit more.

Oliveira is extremely good on the mat.
But in this fight, in particular, his standup technique was crisp and precise. I feel that his confidence in the stand up broke Lee.

 

[MescalineDreams]

Kind of a sloppy fight. If Lee would of trusted his hands and not let Do Bronx lead the dance than he could of KOd him.

Chuck has holes but is also a bad ass and I wont be surprised if he beats Tony

It's kinda awkward throwing on lanky, long guys when you're used to a certain range.

Conor for example is masterful at controlling the distance and using the potential of his length extremely well but when he fought Nate, you could see that length was giving him some issue and changing the way he typically fights.

There's obviously a way to fight longer guys but it's definitely a stylistic challenge if you're not used to it.

 

[MescalineDreams]

At this point, after being bored and watching this fight like half a dozen times.. Im absolutely convinced Lee won the first round.

People want to give Oliveira the edge on the ground just because he was going for a lot of submissions. Ignoring the fact that Lee was defending, nullifying, countering every single one of his attacks and assuming a more advantageous position for most of the round.. on top of landing some of the most significant strikes of the round while on top.


People don't realize how good Lee's grappling is. Their only understanding of jiu jitsu is blatant offense but ignore the rest.

If their ground work were judged by the jiu jitsu community, Lee would have edged him. Lee almost had mount, swept him, passed to half gaurd and maintained. Positional advantage for almost the entirety of the second half of the round. Just the fact that Oliveira was attacking with submissions means nothing, they were defended and he was ultimately nullified.

 

[Assman66]

I hope FKL never changes. He's the gift that keeps on giving.

 

[The Chosen]

lee landed some good shots on the feet as well in that first minute and a half before they hit the ground.

On the ground, Oliveira showcased incredibly fluid, technical jiu jitsu, transitions, creativity and attacks, used his length well. But for every attack Lee also defended and countered very well and showcased very strong grappling and positional IQ as well.

Even with all those attacks, Lee still had the advantageous position in the last 2 minutes of the round, passed to half guard, landed 3 of the best punches of the round and ended on

Oliveira attacked but wasn't able to make anything of it, while his opponent was competently defending and avoiding every attack and trap set. In spite of those attacks, Lee was still able to defend and end up in advantageous positions and ended the last 2 minutes on top. That's a close, back and forth battle.

Your posts read like it’s from a parody account. Get help please

 

[Kalmah]

Oliveira is like the poster boy for fighters plagued by inconsistency.

When he's on he is a top lightweight, and when he isn't he's still a legit gatekeeper and one of the most dangerous submission fighters.

 

[MescalineDreams]

At this point, after being bored and watching this fight like half a dozen times.. Im absolutely convinced Lee won the first round.

People want to give Oliveira the edge on the ground just because he was going for a lot of submissions. Ignoring the fact that Lee was defending, nullifying, countering every single one of his attacks and assuming a more advantageous position for most of the round.. on top of landing some of the most significant strikes of the round while on top.


People don't realize how good Lee's grappling is. Their only understanding of jiu jitsu is blatant offense but ignore the rest.

If their ground work were judged by the jiu jitsu community, Lee would have edged him. Lee almost had mount, swept him, passed to half gaurd and maintained. Positional advantage for almost the entirety of the second half of the round. Just the fact that Oliveira was attacking with submissions means nothing, they were defended and he was ultimately nullified.

I could be wrong on the scoring thing. Would be interested in the opinion of higher level jiu jitsu people.

It just seemed like Lee edged it when he passed to half gaurd, got the knee on his face and landed 3 of the hardest strikes of the round and ended with elbows and short punches.

 

[MescalineDreams]

Your posts read like it’s from a parody account. Get help please

Feel free to let me know exactly what it was you disagreed with.

And also provide your own assessment of what happened.

Otherwise, it's just empty words.