Opinion For the lefties out there, what issue would you sacrifice?

[moosaev]

With how divided our country is, it's pretty clear that the left won't get everything we want, practically speaking if you have to abandon any single issue to peel off more voters to gain the edge, what would you sacrifice?

Personally, I think we need to ditch gun control as an issue. The juice isn't worth the squeeze. Focus on healthcare and financially shoring up the poor/middle class, and reforming the justice system and policing. The 2nd amendment is there to stay, all we're doing with anti-gun rants is pissing a lot of people off, there is no viable path to materially change this.

 

[K1levelgrappler]

Guns

Just fucking leave it alone. It’s a lost cause anyway and you’re gonna need them when roving gangs of chuds start ethnic cleansing in a decade or two.

 

[idrankyourbeer]

i would give my left nut to see donald trump have a shred of human decency and concede

 

[moosaev]

Guns

Just fucking leave it alone. It’s a lost cause anyway and you’re gonna need them when roving gangs of chuds start ethnic cleansing in a decade or two.

Agreed man, its really not worth the effort. And there are probably tons of gun owners out there that really have no opposition to healthcare expansion, student debt relief etc, they just wanna shoot their guns and live their lives. But they're single issue voters right now.

 

[TUFNewb]

I always thought the left should just give em the damn wall.

 

[Peli]

With how divided our country is, it's pretty clear that the left won't get everything we want, practically speaking if you have to abandon any single issue to peel off more voters to gain the edge, what would you sacrifice?

Personally, I think we need to ditch gun control as an issue. The juice isn't worth the squeeze. Focus on healthcare and financially shoring up the poor/middle class, and reforming the justice system and policing. The 2nd amendment is there to stay, all we're doing with anti-gun rants is pissing a lot of people off, there is no viable path to materially change this.

I'm pro gun even though I lean left. The protests/riots convince me people should have guns. Cops and militia groups would never pick on armed people but unarmed people walking to their cars and old people get pushed down by cops or militia groups. Armed deterrence is a thing.

I'd like no mass shootings but damn I don't want the gvt to just pick on unarmed people like that either. Make the gun checks more stringent if you have to . Just don't take shit away.

 

[moosaev]

I always thought the left should just give em the damn wall. Like, who cares really?

The problem with the wall is that its a stupid waste of money, and people that really want the wall will never vote for Dems anyway. There are lots of people that would be open to voting Dems if it weren't for the gun issue.

 

[bigkick]

I agree - guns. Most gun owners are responsible and feel very strongly about their rights. There are so many guns in the country as well; no way anyone can do anything about them...

 

[koquerelle]

I would sacrifice the antifas. It would appease the right and it would make me happy.

 

[moosaev]

I would sacrifice the antifas. It would appease the right and it would make me happy.

Can't sacrifice something that is mostly a figment of the right's imagination.

 

[TUFNewb]

The problem with the wall is that its a stupid waste of money, and people that really want the wall will never vote for Dems anyway. There are lots of people that would be open to voting Dems if it weren't for the gun issue.

Eh gun control is a pretty big issue for the left.
Wall doesn't really hurt anyone always seemed like a relatively easy bone to throw them to me if you are looking for something to compromise on.

 

[Senzo Tanaka]

Guns.

I think the left is extremely naive on gun issues. We absolutely have a problem with gun violence in our country but I think it's bigger than guns. Canada has a ton of guns but they aren't killing people anywhere near the rate we are. Yes, banning "assault" rifles and high capacity clips will help reduce the number of lives lost in mass shootings but I would rather get to the problem of why someone would be involved in a mass shooting instead of going after the tool they used. It just seems like a bandaid approach and an appeal to emotion rather than fixing the issue.

To me, the genie is out of the bottle with guns. You can't undo the technology. You can ban them but they are still out there and people will always get them. A quick look to UK tells you what happens when people don't have access to guns but still want to kill each other. They use knifes, swords, cars, bombs, etc.

The guns restrictions currently in place I feel are good enough. There's only so much you can do before it gets heavy handed. It's like murder or drunk driving. It's illegal to murder someone or drive drunk. You go to jail for either yet people still murder and drive drunk. There's not much else you can do at that point other than to educate and discourage people. You don't ban cars because that's what they use to drive drunk.

Most of the gun violence is coming from poverty, gangs and domestic issues. Focus on those issues if you want to stop the mass majority of gun violence. You are never going to solve it all though and I think that's where the left is extremely naive.

 

[moosaev]

Guns.

I think the left is extremely naive on gun issues. We absolutely have a problem with gun violence in our country but I think it's bigger than guns. Canada has a ton of guns but they aren't killing people anywhere near the rate we are. Yes, banning "assault" rifles and high capacity clips will help reduce the number of lives lost in mass shootings but I would rather get to the problem of why someone would be involved in a mass shooting instead of going after the tool they used. It just seems like a bandaid approach and an appeal to emotion rather than fixing the issue.

To me, the genie is out of the bottle with guns. You can't undo the technology. You can ban them but they are still out there and people will always get them. A quick look to UK tells you what happens when people don't have access to guns but still want to kill each other. They use knifes, swords, cars, bombs, etc.

The guns restrictions currently in place I feel are good enough. There's only so much you can do before it gets heavy handed. It's like murder or drunk driving. It's illegal to murder someone or drive drunk. You go to jail for either yet people still murder and drive drunk. There's not much else you can do at that point other than to educate and discourage people.

Most of the gun violence is coming from poverty, gangs and domestic issues. Focus on those issues if you want to stop the mass majority of gun violence. You are never going to solve it all though and I think that's where the left is extremely naive.

And even if the left was correct on the efficacy of gun control, the Constitution makes it practically impossible to restrict gun ownership to the degree that liberals fantasize about. It will literally never happen, particularly with a conservative Supreme Court like we have now. It's pointless to spend energy on this imo.

 

[Falsedawn]

Gun control is a low hanging fruit that would widen the Democratic coalition significantly, so I'll say that.

The far left doesn't support gun control anyway, it's the centrists and center-left driving that train.

 

[moosaev]

Eh gun control is a pretty big issue for the left.
Wall doesn't really hurt anyone always seemed like a relatively easy bone to throw them to me if you are looking for something to compromise on.

Honestly i think gun control is overrated in terms of how big it is for Dem voters, its really only a pet topic for the very far left elites. I don't think the working class base of the Dems care that much about it, and like i said abandoning gun control as an issue would probably peel off votes from the GOP. The gun owning constituency in this country is much broader, older, larger and more passionate than the "build the wall" constituency. Its not even close.

 

[PolishHeadlock2]

Guns has always been an easy call imo

I think overall "common sense" gun control has broad support but nobody can define what that is and keep the broad support.

When it comes to people that are either hardcore no gun control outnumber the people that are hardcore for gun control.

As a trade off the Dems should be addressing mental healthcare since the pro gun crowd says mass shootings are more of a mental health issue than a gun issue.

Also mass shootings aren't stopping anytime soon so the outcry for gun laws won't stop at all.

 

[RightToBareKnuckles]

I always thought the left should just give em the damn wall.

exactly, i never voted for Trump but way too much of a hissy fit was thrown over the wall. we already have a damn wall, it was just being expanded. might even be more effective to add more border guards and some drones to patrol? i don't know the best way

 

[TUFNewb]

Honestly i think gun control is overrated in terms of how big it is for Dem voters, its really only a pet topic for the very far left elites. I don't think the working class base of the Dems care that much about it, and like i said abandoning gun control as an issue would probably peel off votes from the GOP. The gun owning constituency in this country is much broader, older, larger and more passionate than the "build the wall" constituency. Its not even close.

You're probably right. Lefties need to get a grip with reality that most of america is not ready for many of their ideals. This election makes it obvious. Not sure about ditching gun control tho I think most people want some sensible stuff there.

I just always thought the wall could be an easy one to sell to basically anyone so long as it was framed properly (the opposite of how Trump did it).

 

[Falsedawn]

exactly, i never voted for Trump but way too much of a hissy fit was thrown over the wall. we already have a damn wall, it was just being expanded. might even be more effective to add more border guards and some drones to patrol? i don't know the best way

For me, the big issue with the wall is that it was portrayed as "set and forget" when it's literally never that way. I never heard one peep about maintenance, and securing nearly 2000 miles of border with a 50 foot wall is just begging for 100 years of dumping money into maintaining a money pit.

I've never been opposed to increased staffing or technical enhancements because that's smart. It's building a big dumbass wall that I had a problem with. Hell, the wall we have now is in horrid state, and we wanted to slap up more. The juice just isn't worth the squeeze, know what I mean?

 

[moosaev]

exactly, i never voted for Trump but way too much of a hissy fit was thrown over the wall. we already have a damn wall, it was just being expanded. might even be more effective to add more border guards and some drones to patrol? i don't know the best way

Symbolically it would have been very damaging to play into the "build the wall" narrative. Also, the people that care so much about the wall were never gonna vote Dem anyway. You literally get nothing from giving them the wall. Zilch. With switching positions on guns, you can actually gain votes.