Media DW doesn't like the way 10-8 rounds are scored in 2021

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https://www.mmafighting.com/2021/3/...israel-adesanya-scoring-at-ufc-259-was-insane

I thought the increased usage of 10-8 was proof of evolution of judging and actually an update. Getting more 10-8 rounds also opening up scoring in generally.

I remember a time when 10-8 rounds were given out rarely at best and people complained. Like in the Condit vs Lawler fight. So judging decided to adapt and I think everyone could agree that judges have indeed been giving out more 10-8 round over the last 3 years now. And now the judges are wrong and we should take it back to an earlier interpretation of scoring rounds?

“The scoring was insane,” White said at the post-event press conference on Saturday in Las Vegas. “These guys are giving out 10-8 rounds like f*cking... there were two rounds in that fight that they gave a 10-8. When I came up in the fight business, a 10-8 was an ass-whupping. You got your ass whupped. You didn’t do sh*t in that round and got beat down if it was a 10-8.

“This 10-8 sh*t’s is out of control right now. So hopefully, we can get this fixed. They’re going to screw up a lot of fights, they’re handing out 10-8s like that. There was no 10-8 in that fight.”

 

[Substance Abuse]

I don't either. A guy having ground control without much damage or back control without damage or who is just failing on sub attempts should not be receiving 10-8s. I hate it as well. Control shouldn't be enough to receive a 10-8 without damage. We can all agree to disagree when you guys quote me, lol.

In three and five rounds fights, a 10-8 should not be given liberally when it puts a guy at that much of a disadvantage in such a short fight.

 

[Satan's Daddy.]

I don't like the 10 point metric system at all when the only numbers that are used are 10-8, might be a miracle if you see a 7, judge might lose his job giving a number like that out.

 

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I don't either. A guy having ground control without much damage or back control without damage or who is just failing on sub attempts should not be receiving 10-8s. I hate it as well. Control shouldn't be enough to receive a 10-8 without damage. We can all agree to disagree when you guys quote me, lol.

How would score a Maia fight where he immediately takes his opponent down within 30 seconds of the fight and by 1 minute in he has back control, then spends the next 4 minutes not inflicting damage but fishing for a RNC that he attempts like 8 times but never gets?

10-9 or 10-8?

Not one strike was thrown.

 

[Substance Abuse]

How would score a Maia fight where he immediately takes his opponent down within 30 seconds of the fight and by 1 minute in he has back control, then spends the next 4 minutes not inflicting damage but fishing for a RNC that he attempts like 8 times but never gets?

10-9 or 10-8?

10-9.

What did Maia do outside of control his back and fail at sub attempts? He inflicted no damage. He failed at subs while his opponent defended the subs. Maia had opportunity to inflict damage. He didn't.

10-8s should not be given out liberally. Control alone without anything else isn't enough, especially in a three round fight.

It's even more glaring when you have to consider that if the opponent wins the next two by outstriking him he can only earn a draw.

 

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I don't like the 10 point metric system at all when the only numbers that are used are 10-8, might be a miracle if you see a 7, judge might lose his job giving a number like that out.

There a couple fights that should've been 10-7 that weren't scored properly imo.
Glover vs Smith being one that jumps immediately to mind.

Val some has probably earned a 10-7 round she never got.

 

[Bamboozled]

Good thing he's a fucking promoter and not the athletic commission.

 

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10-9.

What did Maia do outside of control his back and fail at sub attempts? He inflicted no damage. He failed at subs while his opponent defended the subs. Maia had opportunity to inflict damage. He didn't.

10-8s should not be given out liberally. Control alone without anything else isn't enough, especially in a three round fight.

Interesting.

If we were both judges we would have scored that scenario completely different. I would have seen a TD, dominant control, aggression (multiple sub attempts), ringmsanship (attempting to end the fight multiple times which is different then just laying on top of your opponent and not attempting to finish the fight) vs a guy that got taken down and had to play defense and, most importantly, survive. He didn't defend all that sub attempts because he wanted to be in that position. He was forced to defend those subs because his opponent was attempting them in the first place and imo you don't earn points for defense.

 

[Substance Abuse]

Interesting.

If we were both judges we would have scored that scenario completely different. I would have seen a TD, dominant control, aggression (multiple sub attempts), ringmsanship (attempting to end the fight multiple times which is different then just laying on top of your opponent and not attempting to finish the fight) vs a guy that got taken down and had to play defense and survive. He didn't defend all that sub attempts because he wanted to be in that position. He was forced to defend those subs because his opponent was attempting them in the first place and imo you don't earn points for defense.

So control for four minutes with nothing else being done effectively is enough to erase the other guys chance at winning?

I've seen rounds where a guy is outstruck by double his own success rate and his opponent received a 10-9 but then he controls him on the ground and does nothing else and receives a 10-8. If it's a three round fight, he now cannot win it if he isn't a wrestler or grappler who can control a round for four minutes since the striking he's obviously winning isn't enough for him to score a 10-8 without serious damage.

The discrepancy in the way that is scored is mind boggling. It needs some consistency more than anything else.

 

[Linelo]

No, 10-8 in Jan/Izzy for me.

I don’t have a problem with judges being more liberal with 10-8s overall since the change to language in the unified rules however.

Completely even round, 10-10.
Close round edged by one fighter, 10-9.
Dominant round in grappling and/or striking, 10-8.
4-5 minute ass whooping, 10-7.
Murder; investigate the fighter’s corner, ref, ringside doctor, matchmakers.

 

[Dorkman]

Yes, cause listening to a promoters opinion who has a clear bios towards one guy(who lost) is a good idea. I'm sure if you look hard enough you could probably find examples of him complaining about there not being enough 10-8 rounds to differentiate between a razor close round, and a clear round win thats not completely dominant.

 

[ExitLUPin]

I don't either. A guy having ground control without much damage or back control without damage or who is just failing on sub attempts should not be receiving 10-8s. I hate it as well. Control shouldn't be enough to receive a 10-8 without damage. We can all agree to disagree when you guys quote me, lol.

In three and five rounds fights, a 10-8 should not be given liberally when it puts a guy at that much of a disadvantage in such a short fight.

I prolly wouldn't have given the 5th a 10-8 but it was getting close. Jan pieced him up the feet, snapped his head back multiple times and bodied him on the mat. Remember the end of the round/fight saw Jan getting mount and raining GNP. Bell saved Izzy from getting finished

 

[Substance Abuse]

I prolly wouldn't have given the 5th a 10-8 but it was getting close. Jan pieced him up the feet, snapped his head back multiple times and bodied him on the mat. Remember the end of the round/fight saw Jan getting mount and raining GNP. Bell saved Izzy from getting finished

It was getting there, but wasn't enough, imo. My posts in here are generalities for the most part. Overall, I really think they need give out 10-8s less frequently.

 

[IndyCovaHart]

He’s right.

they went from never giving them out to giving them out like hot cakes.

find the fucking balance for gods sake

 

[SeattleFightFan]

I said the same thing as TS here

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/...-too-many-10-8s.4168263/page-2#post-163941409

“Dana is now just saying the overcorrection has gone a bit too far. Last night he was correct but generally I disagree with him. The last few years of slightly more liberal 10-8s have been much better than the prior 18 years of almost impossible to get a 10-8.”​

 

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So control for four minutes with nothing else being done effectively is enough to erase the other guys chance at winning?

I've seen rounds where a guy is outstruck by double his own success rate and his opponent received a 10-9 but then he controls him on the ground and does nothing else and receives a 10-8. If it's a three round fight, he now cannot win it if he isn't a wrestler or grappler who can control a round for four minutes since the striking he's obviously winning isn't enough for him to score a 10-8 without serious damage.

The discrepancy in the way that is scored is mind boggling. It needs some consistency more than anything else.

Who says I wouldn't score the fight where the guy out strikes his opponent 2 to 1 a 10-8? That's most likely aggression, damage, control and ringmsanship. I'm very well might score it a 10-8 rounds.

But I will also say that not every punch is equal and sometime numbers don't tell the entire story. I specifically said that Maia in his situation had back control for 4 minutes which is a very, very dominant position. Just because a fighter out strikes his opponent doesn't mean he necessarily won the round. Not every strike is equal. It's really about effectiveness not numbers.

If a guy has to eat 2 or 3 strikes to land 1 significant strike and ends up landing 22 punches to his opponents 39 but he drops his opponent once, visibly damages his opponent and it's constantly walking forward I'd give him the 10 points even though his opponent landed more strikes.

The scoring criteria clearly says effective striking (and grappling).

 

[Domitian]

Two more judges please.

 

[I WILL CUT YOU]

If you dominate more than half the round with your opponent doing literally zero, that's a 10-8.

Izzy was waaaaaay overhyped. Bobby Knuckles probably regrets not taking the simple takedowns when Izzy leaned back farther than Fat Joe.

Israel is a regression from earlier middleweights. Guys like Franklin were much more well rounded. Anderson at his best was several levels above Izzy. Izzy is Striking's Demian Maia.

 

[2004 account]

Exactly fuck Dana's opinion.

 

[Bend NvR Break]

No, 10-8 in Jan/Izzy for me.

I don’t have a problem with judges being more liberal with 10-8s overall since the change to language in the unified rules however.

Completely even round, 10-10.
Close round edged by one fighter, 10-9.
Dominant round in grappling and/or striking, 10-8.
4-5 minute ass whooping, 10-7.
Murder; investigate the fighter’s corner, ref, ringside doctor, matchmakers.

I actually agree with your scoring criteria. Close rounds are 10-9 and rounds where one fighter easy clearly the dominant fighter 10-8.

 

[Rorschachxx]

10-8's to me always have been a fighter whooping another fighters ass to the point where the ref took a few close looks. Should we award Cyril Gane 5 10-8 rounds against Rozenstruik, just because he dominated the fight?

I have no horse in this race since I like both fighters a lot and just prayed the fight doesn't end in some bullshit. But if I'm being honest I have a hard time seeing Jan getting two 10-8's in a row for the fourth and fifth round. I had him 3-2 and winning but the judges handed these 10-8's out way too easily. Jan didn't even try to get Izzy out of there once they hit the ground.

EDIT: Actually I'm wrong, Jan went into mount and rained some punches on Izzy at the end of the fifth, so maybe I have to reevaluate my thoughts for that specific fight. Either way I believe 10-8's should be given out more but need to be deserved. A fighter simply being ahead is bot enough for a 10-8. A fighter dominating and whooping ass certainly is.