Does Andrew Tate's performance reflect poorly on kickboxing?

[ShaggyDoyle]

Andrew Tate is a man that for many years stated he is a 4x world champion kickboxer and used his alpha, masculine personality to promote his business. However, in his recent boxing match against Chase Demoor, he looked awful. Now, people might start thinking, if this guy is suppose to be a top tier level in kickboxing and is this bad then what does that say about other fighters in this sport who aren't champs. Do you think Andrew Tate has indirectly caused damage to the kickboxing sport?

 

[Iactus Inferus]

Andrew Tate was never a high level Kickboxer and has never mattered to the sport. His best win was KO'ing Jamie Bates in a Full Contact fight in 2010; not even the same ruleset that the more popular form of Kickboxing uses and long before Bates grew into the fighter he is now. He spent most of his career fighting regional level talent, many of the guys either making their debut, within their first five fights, or having records with 50% win rates or less. The only way he has really affected the sport of Kickboxing is through the slow drip of his redpilled fans making their way to watching it. Fortunately MMA serves as the sponge that absorbs most of those types, but I have seen them cropping up in Kickboxing circles more and more over the years.

So no, Andrew Tate losing to some random guy is not a bad look for Kickboxing and will not indirectly make the sport look bad. If anything, there's actually been a lot of Kickboxers making the sport look great over the last 10 years or so. Israel Adesanya, Alex Pereira, Tenshin Nasukawa, Yoshiki Takei, Giga Chikadze, Cedric Doumbe, and hell I'll even throw Caleb Plant in there since he competed in the Full Contact amateur circuit a lot before going to Boxing. Rico just retired from Kickboxing and seems to be looking for opportunities in MMA and Boxing, would be really cool if we had another guy representing the sport making it look good on bigger stages.

 

[CaptainRomania]

Enfusion didn't have a good light heavyweight division at the time. If Andew Tate fought in Glory he would have been destroyed

 

[shunyata]

This is like asking if Tate makes men look bad.

The answer is no.

Tate's performance reflected poorly on Tate and that is all.

On his knees, sniffing another man's groin, IN A BOXING MATCH?!?!?!

 

[Stoic1]

He got old and rich. Thought he still had it. He didn't. End of story. It does nothing to the sport of kickboxing.

 

[Trabaho]

Tate doesn´t represent kickboxers. He isn´t elite. He didn´t fight for the big leagues. I never heard of him before his online fame. I´m a huge kickboxing fan and was a kickboxing fan before MMA. Tate is basically a B+ level kickboxer. He wasn´t in the A leagues. No Glory, K1, One FC nothing. No Muay Thai championships. I think he even fought guys with 2 fights when he already had 70. He´s not bad but not the elite or representitive of kickboxers.

 

[MRudi]

Tate doesn´t represent kickboxers. He isn´t elite. He didn´t fight for the big leagues. I never heard of him before his online fame. I´m a huge kickboxing fan and was a kickboxing fan before MMA. Tate is basically a B+ level kickboxer. He wasn´t in the A leagues. No Glory, K1, One FC nothing. No Muay Thai championships. I think he even fought guys with 2 fights when he already had 70. He´s not bad but not the elite or representitive of kickboxers.

Then you didnt follow closely. He fought in It's Showtime, when it was THE A league and moreover he fought for world title there, losing against one of the best then Sahak in close fight.
Tate was elite and for me it is bemusing he looked so awful. I saw some his fight and he was very good. Not the best obviously, but still elite.

 

[Iactus Inferus]

Then you didnt follow closely. He fought in It's Showtime, when it was THE A league and moreover he fought for world title there, losing against one of the best then Sahak in close fight.
Tate was elite and for me it is bemusing he looked so awful. I saw some his fight and he was very good. Not the best obviously, but still elite.

Look man, I'm not gonna hate on the guy and say he sucked or anything. But do you really think this is what elite level Kickboxing looks like?



Because if you do, I'm not sure we're going to be able to have a productive conversation

 

[PrideNverDies]

Andrew Tate was never a high level Kickboxer and has never mattered to the sport. His best win was KO'ing Jamie Bates in a Full Contact fight in 2010; not even the same ruleset that the more popular form of Kickboxing uses and long before Bates grew into the fighter he is now. He spent most of his career fighting regional level talent, many of the guys either making their debut, within their first five fights, or having records with 50% win rates or less. The only way he has really affected the sport of Kickboxing is through the slow drip of his redpilled fans making their way to watching it. Fortunately MMA serves as the sponge that absorbs most of those types, but I have seen them cropping up in Kickboxing circles more and more over the years.

So no, Andrew Tate losing to some random guy is not a bad look for Kickboxing and will not indirectly make the sport look bad. If anything, there's actually been a lot of Kickboxers making the sport look great over the last 10 years or so. Israel Adesanya, Alex Pereira, Tenshin Nasukawa, Yoshiki Takei, Giga Chikadze, Cedric Doumbe, and hell I'll even throw Caleb Plant in there since he competed in the Full Contact amateur circuit a lot before going to Boxing. Rico just retired from Kickboxing and seems to be looking for opportunities in MMA and Boxing, would be really cool if we had another guy representing the sport making it look good on bigger stages.

Rico signed to the UFC

 

[Trabaho]

He got old and rich. Thought he still had it. He didn't. End of story. It does nothing to the sport of kickboxing.

also true.

Kickboxing is a sport and ruleset.

Tate is not kickboxing.

He is also retired.

He is not bad but not the elite or in his prime.

Nothing wrong with kickboxing. Kicks and punches work fine. And the guys doing it full time for 1-3 decades are the best in the world at it. I don´t see why anyone ever wants to disregard kickboxing. Like what do you wanna say ? Kicking and punching doesn´t work ? The worlds athletes who kick and punch full time and are the best in the world at it, aren´t good ? What is your point even.

 

[MRudi]

Look man, I'm not gonna hate on the guy and say he sucked or anything. But do you really think this is what elite level Kickboxing looks like?



Because if you do, I'm not sure we're going to be able to have a productive conversation

Ok, then just write me top10 kickboxers from MW class in 2012, I am interested in your list.

 

[Burd]

He’s pretty old now

 

[ChessJitsu]

I think what we see in kickboxing/boxing/MMA and probably everything else is that athletic condition is paramount and a gap in age+size+conditioning can be more significant than a skill/experience gap.

That's why you can see former world champions & legends (not that Tate is either of that) get beaten by vloggers if there's like a 20 year gap between them.

 

[Mr.Maelstrom]

We just saw a gold medalist in Cejudo get scooped and dumped on his ass several times vs. Talbot.

Accolades don't stay accolades, if that makes sense? Achievements from a decade+ ago don't necessarily factor into what happens this year, what happens today.

He held belts you probably couldn't name any other detail about, he was never a world class kickboxer and after he gassed out, he got out-hustled and blasted on by an opponent that was supposed to be a lay up.

He even bought a majority stake in Misfits lol, he figured this was meant to be a synergistic investment of sorts.

He only made himself look bad, not the end of the world but could definitely force him to make a much needed pivot lol

 

[Iactus Inferus]

Ok, then just write me top10 kickboxers from MW class in 2012, I am interested in your list.

85kg barely existed as a stable weight class in 2012, cobbling together even a top five of true MWs competing at the time would require hours of research. Most people who fought at 85kg in 2012 were WWs and LHWs moving up/down so they could get more fights; fighters in general were jumping around weight classes more often. Hell, even Luis Tavares was fighting at 85kg in 2012. A top 10 MWs of 2012 list, if you could even assemble a coherent one that made sense, would not "prove" Tate having elite level skill even in the event that he were to appear on it. The proof is in the pudding, your performances in the ring are what matter when your resume is lacking elite wins. So again, I will ask you: did Tate's performance against Sahak, in your view, appear to be the performance of an elite Kickboxer?

 

[spastikbecher]

Andrew Tate's existence reflects poorly on mankind

 

[TheMaster]

Andrew Tate is a man that for many years stated he is a 4x world champion kickboxer and used his alpha, masculine personality to promote his business. However, in his recent boxing match against Chase Demoor, he looked awful. Now, people might start thinking, if this guy is suppose to be a top tier level in kickboxing and is this bad then what does that say about other fighters in this sport who aren't champs. Do you think Andrew Tate has indirectly caused damage to the kickboxing sport?

The short answer is : yes, it absolutely does embarrass the sport.

Tate is not that old, 39, and it gives the impression that a basically untrained, in shape dude can whoop a former high level fighter a few years past his best who doesnt keep in great condition. Which is basically what this was.

Tate holds a KO win over this dude, former kickboxing world champion Jamie Bates.


Yet he is now being remembered for losing to this dude



How can it not be damaging?

 

[MrBean]

These threads are absurd to me.
What difference does it make as to the impression of... a few hundred?

Some beer drinking casuals who will pay to watch misfits make no difference to the perception of kickboxing.

The sport doesn't need a PR rep.

 

[Kung Fu Kowboy]

Didn't JCVD get knocked out by Chuck Zito ? It didn't reflect poorly on the Kumite.

 

[MRudi]

85kg barely existed as a stable weight class in 2012, cobbling together even a top five of true MWs competing at the time would require hours of research. Most people who fought at 85kg in 2012 were WWs and LHWs moving up/down so they could get more fights; fighters in general were jumping around weight classes more often. Hell, even Luis Tavares was fighting at 85kg in 2012. A top 10 MWs of 2012 list, if you could even assemble a coherent one that made sense, would not "prove" Tate having elite level skill even in the even that he were to appear on it. The proof is in the pudding, your performances in the ring are what matter when your resume is lacking elite wins. So again, I will ask you: did Tate's performance against Sahak, in your view, appear to be the performance of an elite Kickboxer?

I didn't heard about Tate before his internet fame, but since I am watching all glory events, I have seen Sahak before knowing about his fight with Tate. Sahak for me was the elite performer - Artem is my of favourite kickboxers AT and everyone, who could force him into extra time is elite performer. And if Tate could win rounds against Sahak, he is therefore elite performer.
Maybe the problem is the definition. For me every true UFC fighter is elite performer, every top challanger of KSW, RIZIN or Octagon.
Tate probably was the best kickboxers of England in some point, and for me it is pretty good accomplishment in terms of sport and good enough to call him elite. The best sprinter in my country is elite performer for me, even if he doesn't even qualify for Olympic.