Differences between Wrestling and BJJ?

[mwanafalsafa]

So I understand they're both grappling martial arts and that they developed in different parts of the world.

How do they differ in terms of their philosophy about grappling and the particular techniques that are used?

What would an fight look like between a pure wrestler and a pure BJJ artist?

 

[CyberFreq]

It would end with an armbar or triangle from the BJJ guy.


The fight would go one of three ways:

Wrestler shoots, gets the double/single; BJJ guy gets guard. Armbar or triangle.

-or-

Wrestler ties up, throws/trips, BJJ guy gets guard. Armbar or triangle.

-or-

BJJ guys pulls guard. Armbar or triangle.

 

[Jagcorps_esq]

A true pure wrestler?

It depends on what you mean by grappling match. If submissions were taken into account and the wrestler truly had no submissions training, the BJJ guy would win most of the time....especially with no time limit.

 

[Nino is a snake]

watch royce gracie vs sakuraba to understand the difference between wrestling and brazilian jiu jitsu.

 

[CyberFreq]

watch royce gracie vs sakuraba to understand the difference between wrestling and brazilian jiu jitsu.

Not the best example. Yes it showcases the difference in BJJ and Catch, but not pure Wrestling.

I'm assuming he's referring to a Greco/Free guy against a BJJ guy, nogi style.

 

[chunglii]

It would end with the BJJ practioner submitting the wrestler. Because wrestling contains zero submissions, the wrestler would not be able to win the fight.

 

[juji gatame**]

*in before Wrestlers lay n pray and BJJ guys finish fights*

 

[mwanafalsafa]

OK so that's one thing I learned.

Besides a lack of submissions in wrestling, both arts are basically just after getting a dominant position...

Do practitioners of those arts basically just do the same sorts of 'moves' but call them different names?

 

[fourfif**]

All you guys saying zhu zhitsu by sub(!) in a 'fight' are obviously not taking into account several variables....

1) Striking. I can't believe we're entertaining this kind of discussion in f12, but with 5-0 on this page saying bjj>>wrestling in a "fight" ...uhg... I just feel I have to defend my art a little with some perspective. Think rampage/arona, kaufman/modaferri... and many other examples... On concrete.

We know wrestling does just FINE in mma. so you all must be talking about teh meen streetz! Headbutt, knees to a downed opponent, etc are all on the table.

We've all heard the saying, hit a blackbelt once he becomes a brown belt, twice and he becomes a purple, etc... If the wrestler has some nice GnP, it's going to be a short night for the bjj guy.

2) Slams are allowed.

This ain't yer point BJJ. Got a nice armbar/triangle locked in from the guard?? You better hope this fight is taking place on a MAT of some kind, or your life might end there on the spot.

3) On a mat or in the mean streetz?

Again ya better pray it's on a mat. If the wrestler decides to adjust your trajectory in mid air and spike you on your head.... well let's just say it'll leave a mess on the sidewalk.

4) Whos got the better stand up.

If the bjj guy has the better stand up the wrestler can take his chances with his GnP. If the wrestler has the better stand up, the bjj guy is teh fucked.

 

[kung fu kenny]

I think, depending once again what type of wrestling you are talking about, there is a fair bit of cross over between the two. I have done way more BJJ than catch wrestling and I'm no expert on either, but in my limited BJJ experience there is a lot to learn from the catchers, and probably vice versa. That said I think BJJ is more technical and is more focused on ending the fight rather than winning the match. But this is really what MMA is all about man, you have to be able to bring an effective blend of both to win.

 

[biggspc]

*in before Wrestlers lay n pray and BJJ guys finish fights*

too late...

 

[VeryMuch]

All you guys saying zhu zhitsu by sub(!) in a 'fight' are obviously not taking into account several variables....

1) Striking. Headbutt, knees to a downed opponent, etc are all on the table.

We've all heard the saying, hit a blackbelt once he becomes a brown belt, twice and he becomes a purple, etc... If the wrestler has some nice GnP, it's going to be a short night for the bjj guy.

2) Slams are allowed.

This ain't yer point BJJ. Got a nice armbar/triangle locked in from the guard?? You better hope this fight is taking place on a MAT of some kind, or your life might end there on the spot.

3) On a mat or in the mean streetz?

Again ya better pray it's on a mat. If the wrestler decides to adjust your trajectory in mid air and spike you on your head.... well let's just say it'll leave a mess on the sidewalk.

stopped reading after you used pinyin to spell jiu jitsu. What a loser.

 

[newerest]

All you guys saying zhu zhitsu by sub(!) are obviously not taking into account several variables....

1) Striking. Headbutt, knees to a downed opponent, etc are all on the table.

We've all heard the saying, hit a blackbelt once he becomes a brown belt, twice and he becomes a purple, etc... If the wrestler has some nice GnP, it's going to be a short night for the bjj guy.

2) Slams are allowed.

This ain't yer point BJJ. Got a nice armbar/triangle locked in from the guard?? You better hope this fight is taking place on a MAT of some kind, or your life might end there on the spot.

3) On a mat or in the mean streetz?

Again ya better pray it's on a mat. If the wrestler decides to adjust your trajectory in mid air and spike you on your head.... well let's just say it'll leave a mess on the sidewalk.

on the streets pure wrestling will always try and slam on concrete. if the bjj guy hooks the ankle in time it's nullified. I just don't see someone with less than 2 years of training being able to reflexively hook the ankle in time.

most bjjers won't have the killer instinct to go for the arm break either. triangle would be preferable.

 

[fourfif**]

stopped reading after you used pinyin to spell jiu jitsu. What a loser.

I'm on an iPhone you fuckin DEE BAG.

 

[fourfif**]

on the streets pure wrestling will always try and slam on concrete. if the bjj guy hooks the ankle in time it's nullified. I just don't see someone with less than 2 years of training being able to reflexively hook the ankle in time.

most bjjers won't have the killer instinct to go for the arm break either. triangle would be preferable.

Arona, Modafari and many others neglected to hook. It happens.

 

[fourfif**]

Also what it might depend on who has the better stand up. It's a stupid topic but you just can wrestling such short thrift.

Oh and you can interchange "Judoka" or Sambo player or cacc wrestler. All of those have a slightly better chance against a BJJ player because they can look out for and use subs of their own.

One thing is certain, the other grappler will always be on top.

 

[lts5025]

The problem with BJJ against a wrestler is that BJJ views the closed guard as a neutral position. That's fine in a grappling contest, but with fists and elbows coming towards your face, being on your back against a wrestler is hardly a neutral position.

Sure, you can submit a guy off your back, but how much damage are you going to take in the process? What if you never get the sub? BJJ guys always talk about "position before submission" and they're right, but they would have more success if they didn't just lay down and pretend that the guard is a neutral position. Use your guard to sweep, then pass, then submit. That's when BJJ beats wrestling.

 

[newerest]

Arona, Modafari and many others neglected to hook. It happens.

I saw it happen with one blue belt. he was a pledge in my fraternity, got drunk, don't remember how it happened but some dude slammed him on his head in an armbar attempt

I realize being drunk doesn't mean shit, but he even said that "they cant slam in competition" afterwards to me.

shit happens

 

[dazed863]

these discussions are so stupid.

against a pure wrestler BJJ wins most of the time. both guys will probably look to get the fight there and once it does the pure wrestler will have no sub defense and more than likely turn on their belly when threatened to escape from bottom.... it's game over.. you see it time and time again when a wrestler comes in to train BJJ for the first time.

it's so funny to see the BJJ hate in this forum... especially since 99% of the top level fighters today train it. going into an MMA fight without any wrestling skills is dumb but without BJJ it's suicide.

also please stop using top level MMA fighters who have spent years cross training as your example of why BJJ won't work in the streetz (Rampage Jackson for one).

 

[Supereem]

All you guys saying zhu zhitsu by sub(!) in a 'fight' are obviously not taking into account several variables....

1) Striking. I can't believe we're entertaining this kind of discussion in f12, but with 5-0 on this page saying bjj>>wrestling in a "fight" ...uhg... I just feel I have to defend my art a little with some perspective. Think rampage/arona, kaufman/modaferri... and many other examples... On concrete.

We know wrestling does just FINE in mma. so you all must be talking about teh meen streetz! Headbutt, knees to a downed opponent, etc are all on the table.

We've all heard the saying, hit a blackbelt once he becomes a brown belt, twice and he becomes a purple, etc... If the wrestler has some nice GnP, it's going to be a short night for the bjj guy.

2) Slams are allowed.

This ain't yer point BJJ. Got a nice armbar/triangle locked in from the guard?? You better hope this fight is taking place on a MAT of some kind, or your life might end there on the spot.

3) On a mat or in the mean streetz?

Again ya better pray it's on a mat. If the wrestler decides to adjust your trajectory in mid air and spike you on your head.... well let's just say it'll leave a mess on the sidewalk.

4) Whos got the better stand up.

If the bjj guy has the better stand up the wrestler can take his chances with his GnP. If the wrestler has the better stand up, the bjj guy is teh fucked.

This is retarded. Alot of BJJ is about preventing people from slamming you. A proper triangle should prevent this and in a worst case scenario you can just LET GO.


In a street fight a BJJ can just lay on his back and wait for the wrestler to engage and lose.

Also stop trolling, you know your argument is retarded, obviously wrestlers with no submission experience or knowledge will lose against a pure BJJ guy on the ground, probably even with your street rules. In guard hed probably triangle himself ffs....(Unless he watched lethal weapon).