Definitive 205 All-Time Ranking

OneOfOne said:
On what basis do you have Shogun #2 let alone on a tier by himself? What has he done to earn that postion?

I keep asking this question and no one can answer it. Maybe you will.
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The volume and quality of ranked victories, and longevity of being a ranked fighter himself

#4 Quinton Jackson
#7 Antonio Rogerio Nogueira
#5 Alistair Overeem
#10 Alistair Overeem
#6 Chuck Liddell
#1 Lyoto Machida
#5 Forrest Griffin
#10 Antonio Rogerio Nogueira

To put it in perspective for you, Wand has 6 ranked victories. Also Shogun was ranked from 2005-2018... that's 13 years.
 
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OneOfOne said:
Well I think Wanderlei's wins over Rampage 2x, Henderson, Arona, Mezger, and Sakuraba 3x are at least comparable. I don't think Shogun's are definitely better. How do you factor in Wanderlei's 5-year, 18-0-2 run of dominance at 205 that included the GP championship, the Pride 205 championship, and 4 title defenses? Isn't that a more accomplished resume and a better run of dominance than anything Shogun as had?
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Rampage wins are impressive no doubt

Henderson and especially Sakuraba during that time frame were not true 205 pound guys, they were significantly and visibly smaller than wanderlei

Mezger was a good win

Arona in my opinion beat Wanderlei twice, even if you count it as a split, wanderlei was not very impressive in that win

Shogun beat guys at their peak in spectacular fashion, Overeem, Arona, Lil Nog and then he went on to UFC to beat Machida (who i personally think is the most skilled 205 ever)
 
GreatSaintGuillotine said:
I don't think anyone on that list beats DC even in his later years other than Jon. DC gets insane amounts of disrespect for no reason
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It's not because of disrespect. GOAT lists are determined by accomplishments, not by ability. Big difference. There's no Rumble or Gus, for example, in anyones top15 for the same reason.
 
Taric said:
The volume and quality of ranked victories, and longevity of being a ranked fighter himself

#4 Quinton Jackson
#7 Antonio Rogerio Nogueira
#5 Alistair Overeem
#10 Alistair Overeem
#6 Chuck Liddell
#1 Lyoto Machida
#5 Forrest Griffin
#10 Antonio Rogerio Nogueira

To put it in perspective for you, Wand has 6 ranked victories. Also Shogun was ranked from 2005-2018... that's 13 years.
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Well, I think you're missing a few ranked wins for Wanderlei:

Mezger
Henderson
Sakuraba 1
Sakuraba 2
Rampage 1
Rampage 2
Nakamura
Arona
Jardine

And FightMatrix Generated Rankings put Yuki Kobdo in the top 10 as well. So that's 10 ranked wins. Wanderlei also went 5 years and 20 fights undefeated in Pride. He had 4 title defenses as well.

None of that do anything for ya?
 
Melas Chasma said:
It's not because of disrespect. GOAT lists are determined by accomplishments, not by ability. Big difference. There's no Rumble or Gus, for example, in anyones top15 for the same reason.
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Lol if you don't consider ability when talking about the goat then the only thing you're arguing is popularity
 
OneOfOne said:
Chuck & Wanderlei should get the #2 & #3 spots. They both had dominant runs at 205 including 4 title defenses each. Wanderlei dominated Pride and Chuck dominated the UFC. Shogun and Rampage lost too often and DC barely had any fights.
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Shogun went 12-1 in PRIDE with his only loss being to a HW Coleman. He also won the 205 GP beating the likes of Rampage, Nog, Overeem, and Arona.
 
GreatSaintGuillotine said:
Lol if you don't consider ability when talking about the goat then the only thing you're arguing is popularity
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I'm not sure you understand. Ability has nothing to do with GOAT rankings and accomplishments have nothing to do with popularity. For example, Cain at his best might have been the best HW there has ever been based on ability, but he is no where near Fedor in the GOAT rankings, because he lacks accomplishments compared to Fedor. It has nothing to do with Cain's popularity. He just didn't have enough ranked wins.

GOAT = Greatest Of All Time, not "the most skilled of all time". If it was the latter you could argue that Chimaev should be above GSP in the GOAT ranking if you think he is better WW by ability and therefore would beat prime GSP in a fight, or something other nonsense like that. Now you have learned the difference, you are welcome. Cheers.
 
arcadeperfect said:
Shogun went 12-1 in PRIDE with his only loss being to a HW Coleman. He also won the 205 GP beating the likes of Rampage, Nog, Overeem, and Arona.
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And that was great. But Wanderlei went 20-2-2 while also winning the 205 GP along with the Pride belt. He then went on to defend that belt 4 times. He also beat Rampage and Arona along with Henderson, Mezger, and Sakuraba 3x. Wanderlei's run was longer, more dominant, and more decorated.
 
CashMoney1991 said:
It's hard to do a top 10 cus half of them fought in PRIDE during their primes, but here's what I would have:
1) Jones- basically a fact at this point
2) DC - I hate DC but Jones was the only man that could beat him at 205 and did it twice, DC crushes everyone else on this list without question and he defended the belt a couple times and he was a monster at HW, dual champ at one point
3) Shogun - his 05 run was legendary and his resume was impressive and also held a UFC belt
4) Chuck
5) Wandy
6) Rampage
7) Randy
8) Tito
9) Forrest
10) Machida

Would be interesting if 3-10 had a fantasy round robin tournament, very hard to rank after Jones and DC imo
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This is a very sensible list. I could tweak 4-10 to my liking but you have the right names and like you said, it’s top heavy and gets murky. I’m confident that Shogun solidly has the #3 spot. He never had a streak like Wanderlei but his GP run and the conquering of Machida give him the nod in my book.

I’ll give my list for shits and giggles

1. Jones
2. DC - maybe lacking in resume but undoubtedly beats 3-10.
3. Shogun
4. Wanderlei
5. Rampage
6. Liddell
7. Machida
8. Randy
9. Glover
10. Ortiz
 
Jonah Raine said:
I believe the 205 GOAT ranking is the most difficult to rank. The reason being is because most 205 fighters have fought in 185 and/or 265 sometime in their careers.

1. Jones
2. Rua
3. Jackson
4. Liddell
5. Wanderlei
6. Ortiz
7. Teixeira
8. Machida
9. Evans
10. Griffin
11. Cormier
12. Blachowicz
13. Henderson
14. Couture
15. Noguiera/Belfort
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Wanderlei and Liddell should be higher than Rampage
 
Melas Chasma said:
I'm not sure you understand. Ability has nothing to do with GOAT rankings and accomplishments have nothing to do with popularity. For example, Cain at his best might have been the best HW there has ever been based on ability, but he is no where near Fedor in the GOAT rankings, because he lacks accomplishments compared to Fedor. It has nothing to do with Cain's popularity. He just didn't have enough ranked wins.

GOAT = Greatest Of All Time, not "the most skilled of all time". If it was the latter you could argue that Chimaev should be above GSP in the GOAT ranking if you think he is better WW by ability and therefore would beat prime GSP in a fight, or something other nonsense like that. Now you have learned the difference, you are welcome. Cheers.
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Any situation where you ignore a fighter's skill when examining their greatness is a fantasy. You can delude yourself into pretending that your asinine logic makes sense to anyone with basic logic and reasoning but it'll be just that, pretend. If you're not the best fighter, you are not the greatest of all time. The base requirement is being better than the rest. It's not "most accomplished of all time". It's the best fighter

Cheers
 
CashMoney1991 said:
It's hard to do a top 10 cus half of them fought in PRIDE during their primes, but here's what I would have:
1) Jones- basically a fact at this point
2) DC - I hate DC but Jones was the only man that could beat him at 205 and did it twice, DC crushes everyone else on this list without question and he defended the belt a couple times and he was a monster at HW, dual champ at one point
3) Shogun - his 05 run was legendary and his resume was impressive and also held a UFC belt
4) Chuck
5) Wandy
6) Rampage
7) Randy
8) Tito
9) Forrest
10) Machida

Would be interesting if 3-10 had a fantasy round robin tournament, very hard to rank after Jones and DC imo
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In what universe was Griffin better than Machida?
 
Randy always gets ranked too low on these. But he absolutely dominated prime Vitor, Chuck, and Tito.
 
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