CroCop In The UFC , Exposed ? or Injures ?

Discussion in 'UFC Discussion' started by MMAlover123, Jan 10, 2015.

  1. MMAlover123

    MMAlover123 Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2013
    Messages:
    369
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    London
    Was CroCop exposed as someone that wouldn't of cut it as someone that could become champ in the UFC or was the time he signed in the UFC in 2007 that he was past it , wear and tear , years of injuries from kickboxing and MMA accumulated ? ( the guy had been fighting since he was 22 years old)

    It wouldn't seem so to me as the year before became the PRIDE grand prix champion ( which arguably was the peak of his MMA career ) after beating Barnett ... what do you guys think ?.
     
  2. jeremyhi09

    jeremyhi09 Blue Belt

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    Messages:
    615
    Likes Received:
    0
    he was burnt out.
     
  3. ironball

    ironball Brown Belt

    Joined:
    May 12, 2012
    Messages:
    3,269
    Likes Received:
    4,753
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    many factors

    1) better competition, more grapplers
    2) PED testing
    3) cage & elbows

    I believe he was only like 31 or so at the time. The age/injury/longevity in kickboxing/mma excuse is bullshit. guys like semmy schilt & peter aerts, mark hunt have been through much worse and won titles at 37+ in kickboxing (except hunt). HWs usually last the longest out of all classes because the only real detrimental factor is speed and durability, which until 35 would not be noticeably different



    Even right now at LHW/HW, belfort, rashad, rampage, teixera, machida, frank mir, bigfoot, DC, gonzaga there all pushing 34-36 and there prime was when they were around the same age cro-cop entered the UFC (30-33) just a few yrs later. liddell & silva were both champs at 36 & 37, hughes at 34

    guys like tex, shad, machida, DC, belfort .etc, there all still revalent in the top 5 despite being about 35 or 36
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2015
  4. Th3Sav4ge

    Th3Sav4ge "What the fuck is happening!?"

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2014
    Messages:
    13,975
    Likes Received:
    14,539
    Location:
    earth
    He was older. Nog coture, mir,fedor, shogun,wand,liddell bj penn, gomi,,.........................they are old man. not bad fighters
     
  5. beefcake180

    beefcake180 Aces Wild

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2009
    Messages:
    13,888
    Likes Received:
    11,202
    Location:
    Spanaway, Washington
    You can't act like just because one fighter wasn't shot after a certain amount of damage doesn't mean another one won't be.

    Not saying Cro Cop was shot but each fighter is subjective man.
     
  6. crofighter

    crofighter Green Belt

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2014
    Messages:
    1,139
    Likes Received:
    2,088
    He achieved the goal he had in his mind for years. Lack of motivation, injuries, cage, different rules which took some of his most lethal weapons etc.
     
  7. wake_me

    wake_me Black Belt

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2005
    Messages:
    5,842
    Likes Received:
    9,067
    Location:
    Hamilton, Ontario
    I don't know...he was arguably the 2nd best HW at the time. I think over confidence may have been a factor. IIRC he never even bothered training in a cage.
     
  8. L0ki

    L0ki Silver Belt

    Joined:
    May 29, 2009
    Messages:
    11,704
    Likes Received:
    5,981
    Location:
    Asgard
    Cro Cop absolutely belongs in UFC.

    There was numerous proponents on SD asking for Iishi's admission in UFC.

    Now? Back to back losses to Mirko.

    Cro Cop now has learned to elbow off his back, should he be taken down.

    New tricks for an old dog.

    Do you mean to tell me he wouldn't beat such fighters as Mitrione, Jordan, etc.?
     
  9. Finnish Fan

    Finnish Fan Brown Belt

    Joined:
    May 9, 2007
    Messages:
    4,390
    Likes Received:
    3,341
    Long career before getting to the UFC.

    Game had passed him by.

    Didn't want to learn how to utilize the octagon and related skills.

    Lack of motivation resulted in what we got to see.
     
  10. FishinWithFredo

    FishinWithFredo Purple Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2010
    Messages:
    2,391
    Likes Received:
    16
    Location:
    4th Chamber
    I think the cage messed with his game a LOT
     
  11. sadclown

    sadclown Banned Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2014
    Messages:
    4,279
    Likes Received:
    2,367
    Were Chuck Liddell and randy couture exposed after the pride fighters came to the UFC and beat them?
     
  12. PorkPiePusher

    PorkPiePusher Loro Piana cashmere belt

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,416
    Likes Received:
    672
    Location:
    Tlön, Uqbar, Orbis Tertius
    Biggest factor was shape and size of the Octagon. Look at the Eddie Sanchez fight. Someone as shite as Sanchez was getting away from him all night and CC was missing every kick. Then look at his highlight reel from PRIDE, cutting off opponents in the ring and catching them in the corner was his speciality. He was a real bully in the ring.

    I believe that gave him a shot to the ego, not being able to force opponents to the corner anymore, that and PED withdrawal, ofc.

    I don't believe the step up in opposition was anything real, PRIDE had a much better HW div than UFC ever did, and regarding grapplers, CC was able to take care of grapplers like Barnett and Coleman.

    But also, by the time he was in the UFC, he had close to 30 MMA fights and 'round 25 kickboxing fights. That will wear you down, if not by injuries than mental fatigue.
     
  13. crofighter

    crofighter Green Belt

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2014
    Messages:
    1,139
    Likes Received:
    2,088
    And by the way, who says that he was at his peak in 2006? He showed his best performance, but that doesnt mean that he was physically at his peak. On that day in 2006 Cro Cop was unstoppable because he was ready to die. He said that he would stop fighting if he had not won that belt. That was his day and i belive that he would have smashed anyone.
     
  14. Jermei

    Jermei Steel Belt Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2008
    Messages:
    25,389
    Likes Received:
    23,499
    UFC CroCop kept his LHK foot on the mat so who knows. Nobody knows why he didn't unleash his best weapon in the UFC.
     
  15. FaTaL FaTaL

    FaTaL FaTaL Purple Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2011
    Messages:
    2,161
    Likes Received:
    1,033
    dude was roiding in pride like many other fighters

    he obviously didnt look the same in the ufc, much slower and tentative
     
  16. RagingBeringola

    RagingBeringola Purple Belt

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2007
    Messages:
    1,894
    Likes Received:
    903
    Location:
    Luxembourg
    As much as Crocop was a dangerous fighter, we also know he had ups and downs, and had quite some holes in his game.

    The rules and the cage in the UFC favour grapplers a lot more than the ring in PRIDE, wehre people just couldn't spend much time there.

    If you add the fact that in PRIDE you can kick/knee the head of a downed opponent and make grapplers pay cash for a faled attempted takedown, you can imagine that the cage is quite a different world for a fighter who spent his life in a ring.

    Other factors might enter the equation, like slowly being shot, overconfidence, lack of motivation, lack of adaptation to the new environment and so on...

    Also. at the PRIDE 2006 OWGP, Crocop had a quite "easy" run. Minowa, Yoshida, and then the night of the final, he made quick work of an undersized Wanderlei (but always dangerous) before facing Barnett that was coming from a 15min war againt Minotauro earlier that evening.
     
  17. crofighter

    crofighter Green Belt

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2014
    Messages:
    1,139
    Likes Received:
    2,088
    Wrong, Wand was bigger than CC in that fight!
     
  18. countswagula

    countswagula Gold Belt

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2012
    Messages:
    15,409
    Likes Received:
    2,342
    Different athletes age very differently. Fedor hit a physical decline in his early 30s, as did GSP. Meanwhile Anderson and Machida remained elite despite being almost 40, and others still like Randy and Hendo had some of the highlights of their career past that mark. This can be tallied up to both the differing styles and how they respond to a loss in speed, durabiity and strength as well as the simple fact every human being is unique and so are their bodies.

    But I do agree with the points you made about the game passing him by, and even as a fan the PED situation cannot be overlooked. I believe he also had numerous injuries in his run, although that can be chalked up to his body getting old as previously stated.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2015
  19. cocksure

    cocksure Silver Belt

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2007
    Messages:
    12,482
    Likes Received:
    6,099
    Location:
    England
    Far less adaptable than Fedor. As MMA grew, CCs particular set of skills became one facet of a bunch.

    ...And we knew from the Randleman fight, his chin wasn't Huntlike!
     
  20. yermajesty

    yermajesty Purple Belt

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2014
    Messages:
    1,667
    Likes Received:
    199
    AGE was a huge factor, imo.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.