Competetive submission grappling/BJJ without needing surgery at some point. Is it possible?

[Thrawn33]

Honestly I think of all the common grappling modalities I think judo is probably the one with the highest injury risk. It's a lot more chaotic than BJJ due to the focus on standing and the techniques are technically demanding on the person performing them in a different way to wrestling - lots of doing sweeps and shit while standing on one leg which can pop and ACL or PCL very easily.

There's a reason that "old beat up judo guy who specialises in groundwork/moves to BJJ" is a bit of a stereotype.
At least with BJJ most of what you have to worry about is spazzy opponents doing techniques wrong/not respecting the tap rather than in judo where you can go "alright I was doing my technique but I accidentally made a slight twisting motion and now my knee is made of balsa wood and held together with chewing gum".

Middle aged judoka turned BJJer with titanium plate and screws in ankle checking in...

 

[TheMaster]

Middle aged judoka turned BJJer with titanium plate and screws in ankle checking in...

That's impressive. So is your titanium ankle holding up to those joint locks or do you just mainly drill?
It cant have pleased the doctors when you told them this was your hobby.

 

[shunyata]

Middle aged judoka turned BJJer with titanium plate and screws in ankle checking in...

From my memory of kids judo, the number of 14 year olds wearing knee and ankle braces was too damn high.

When Rhonda came out recently and said she already had cognitive issues from Judo and a glass jaw from multiple concussion I instantly believed her.

To this day my only concussion and only knockout was in youth judo, getting thrown on my crown.

 

[TheMaster]

From my memory of kids judo, the number of 14 year olds wearing knee and ankle braces was too damn high.

I think your memory is off. I never saw kids with knee or ankle braces in Judo. If there were any, the numbers would be lower than freestyle wrestling for sure since there are less leg attacks.

When Rhonda came out recently and said she already had cognitive issues from Judo and a glass jaw from multiple concussion I instantly believed her.

Thats also a strange comment. I never got a concussion from Judo, maybe occasionally a hard landing but you arent going to get anywhere like the concussion risk from a striking art or playing football. If this was a real thing, we wouldnt see so many have iron chinned Judoka like Moussasi, Khabib, Fedor (not latter years) etc.

Between Judo and wrestling, again I would say its even but Judo tends to be a smoother landing because its using momentum and leverage more for the throws.

 

[shunyata]

I think your memory is off. I never saw kids with knee or ankle braces in Judo. If there were any, the numbers would be lower than freestyle wrestling for sure since there are less leg attacks.



Thats also a strange comment. I never got a concussion from Judo, maybe occasionally a hard landing but you arent going to get anywhere like the concussion risk from a striking art or playing football. If this was a real thing, we wouldnt see so many have iron chinned Judoka like Moussasi, Khabib, Fedor (not latter years) etc.

Between Judo and wrestling, again I would say its even but Judo tends to be a smoother landing because its using momentum and leverage more for the throws.

Politely go fuck yourself.

There were in my club.

We were also extremely competitive and going to regional tournaments every other weekend and multiple national tournaments every year (pretty much every big tourney within 10 hours driving radius). American Canadian Games in Buffalo, Liberty Bell Invitational in Philly, Junior Olympics, NJI junior nationals, etc.

 

[Rob Battisti]

From my memory of kids judo, the number of 14 year olds wearing knee and ankle braces was too damn high.

When Rhonda came out recently and said she already had cognitive issues from Judo and a glass jaw from multiple concussion I instantly believed her.

To this day my only concussion and only knockout was in youth judo, getting thrown on my crown.

It’s tough. I’m facing this dilemma as well. I want my boys to do judo and wrestling but also it’s so damn easy to get concussed that it’s more scary than I would have thought.

I want them to have the skills and grit that I got from martial arts, but it’s different being a dad.

 

[shunyata]

It’s tough. I’m facing this dilemma as well. I want my boys to do judo and wrestling but also it’s so damn easy to get concussed that it’s more scary than I would have thought.

I want them to have the skills and grit that I got from martial arts, but it’s different being a dad.

Still safer than football.

I'd also like to add that while I did have the one concussion, knowing how to fall well from judo saved me from potentially far worse injuries as a teen and adult. It was a net gain for injury prevention.

Became a lifesaver when me and my friends were skateboarding, jumping off shit on bmx bikes, and later trail running / mountain biking.

 

[Rob Battisti]

Still safer than football.

Oh definitely not doing football.

My wife is 5’ so my boys are at risk of potential manletism unless my Sherdog genes overwhelm hers. I need them to know how to handle themselves.

 

[shunyata]

Oh definitely not doing football.

My wife is 5’ so my boys are at risk of potential manletism unless my Sherdog genes overwhelm hers. I need them to know how to handle themselves.

That's the great thing about weight classes in wrestling and judo, just don't let them do any weight cut more complicated than skipping breakfast on weigh in day.

 

[Rob Battisti]

That's the great thing about weight classes in wrestling and judo, just don't let them do any weight cut more complicated than skipping breakfast on weigh in day.

Yup. I learn my lessons in highschool.

The issue with youth though is sometimes it’s just age.

 

[TheMaster]

It’s tough. I’m facing this dilemma as well. I want my boys to do judo and wrestling but also it’s so damn easy to get concussed that it’s more scary than I would have thought.

I want them to have the skills and grit that I got from martial arts, but it’s different being a dad.

Judo is the perfect martial art for kids. Discipline and etiquette that has been lost in many martial arts, standing and ground grappling, and falling and rollling skills. Unless they are competing regularly at a young age I dont see a big risk of concussion either, I personally would start them in it until about 9 or 10 anyway.

 

[Rob Battisti]

Judo is the perfect martial art for kids. Discipline and etiquette that has been lost in many martial arts, standing and ground grappling, and falling and rollling skills. Unless they are competing regularly at a young age I dont see a big risk of concussion either, I personally would start them in it until about 9 or 10 anyway.

Yeah definitely agree. I did a little judo but mostly wrestling growing up. I was thinking around 8.

Way more BJJ places nowadays but honestly that’s all just franchise shit now. It’s so expensive.

 

[Rob Battisti]

Judo is the perfect martial art for kids. Discipline and etiquette that has been lost in many martial arts, standing and ground grappling, and falling and rollling skills. Unless they are competing regularly at a young age I dont see a big risk of concussion either, I personally would start them in it until about 9 or 10 anyway.

This thread made me miss judo. Just found a gym im going to check out

 

[ROcknrollracing]

Trying to learn how to fall is a good way to get injured. Injuries in most sports are overblown and if you train appropriately they can mostly be nullified. What else are you going to do sit around and do nothing? You can get a severe injury from opening your refrigerator you know?

 

[ahheadlock]

Judo is the perfect martial art for kids. Discipline and etiquette that has been lost in many martial arts, standing and ground grappling, and falling and rollling skills. Unless they are competing regularly at a young age I dont see a big risk of concussion either, I personally would start them in it until about 9 or 10 anyway.

I have all 3 of my kids in Judo. One of them is a super competitive kid and he competes as often as is possible, the other 2 are happy to just show up and muck around on the mat but don't take it seriously. My oldest (competitive one) has yet to be injured. I do worry about concussions, he got a decent head knock at nationals last year and had some symptoms for the rest of the day. That's my only concern but considering he's been competing for 5 years now and that's the only time i've been worried about him, that's not too bad. It would be worse if he were in rugby or australian rules football. For the other two, it's good just to have them on the mat learning how to fall over and get more control of their body.

 

[Thrawn33]

That's impressive. So is your titanium ankle holding up to those joint locks or do you just mainly drill?
It cant have pleased the doctors when you told them this was your hobby.

I drill and compete as normal. Now that I'm doing jits I tap quickly to anything on that ankle.

Added benefit was the first few years of judo coming back from the surgery I switched to a lefty stance to protect my ankle from already painful "white belt footsweeps" banging against the very thin layer of flesh over the plate and screws. Somehow I now have a good left side uchimata that I could never get correct doing it righty. So switching to lefty mid round is fun, especially in standing in Jitz. Or doing the "Princess Bride" as I call it, starting left handed then going right handed out of nowhere...

 

[Dana's Moonface]

Judo is the perfect martial art for kids. Discipline and etiquette that has been lost in many martial arts, standing and ground grappling, and falling and rollling skills. Unless they are competing regularly at a young age I dont see a big risk of concussion either, I personally would start them in it until about 9 or 10 anyway.

Agree fully
The discipline and etiquette alone is great for kids, before you even start the training

Judo like wrestling will not just make kids physically strong, but mentally too

It takes balls to compete in judo

 

[Dana's Moonface]

I drill and compete as normal. Now that I'm doing jits I tap quickly to anything on that ankle.

Added benefit was the first few years of judo coming back from the surgery I switched to a lefty stance to protect my ankle from already painful "white belt footsweeps" banging against the very thin layer of flesh over the plate and screws. Somehow I now have a good left side uchimata that I could never get correct doing it righty. So switching to lefty mid round is fun, especially in standing in Jitz. Or doing the "Princess Bride" as I call it, starting left handed then going right handed out of nowhere...

How did you find the switch to bjj with your previous grappling with judo and wrestling? Dud you feel like you had a head start, as randori and Shia is very intense and many are apprehensive to stand

I do a little jitz at open matt and train judo. 90% of the guys in the open matt do not like the feet. Only the mma fighters like to start standing.

I think all guys who start bjj without prior wrestling or judo should spend a fair amount of time learning to stand and not just pull guard. I get many are hobbyists, but it's nice feeling comfortable on the feet and not afraid to being thrown

 

[Thrawn33]

How did you find the switch to bjj with your previous grappling with judo and wrestling? Dud you feel like you had a head start, as randori and Shia is very intense and many are apprehensive to stand

I do a little jitz at open matt and train judo. 90% of the guys in the open matt do not like the feet. Only the mma fighters like to start standing.

I think all guys who start bjj without prior wrestling or judo should spend a fair amount of time learning to stand and not just pull guard. I get many are hobbyists, but it's nice feeling comfortable on the feet and not afraid to being thrown

My first BJJ club started most rolls standing, and we were in the midwest, so lots of former wrestlers (not everyone though). Quickly gained the reputation as "the Judo guy" when I threw the brown belt instructor first roll, day one with a nice easy to take sumi (he promptly subbed me following). Did not want to come in trying to flex with a big hard throw and be branded an asshole.

From then on rolls would usually start one of three ways:
I pulled guard on white belts because I didn't want to risk hurting them, I wasn't gaining much tossing a BJJ WB as a longtime competitive brown belt in judo, I wanted to work on my weakest aspect of my game (bottom) because I had a crushing top game if I landed outside of guard

Most newer blues pulled guard so the new mid 30s WB (me) didn't throw them, or wind up on top in a dominant position and *gasp* possibly land a sub or just frustrate...

Senior blues and up actually wanted to work their stand up game and would ask pointers...if tossed them on a counter or they said attack as you would normally, they just smoked me quick on the ground to get back up, lol.

Already had over a decade of training in Judo and wrestling, a plate in the ankle and moved into "hobbiest" mode, so I rolled light when I felt like it, hard when agreed upon, and controlled the pace with the other WBs when I thought they were spazzing..

 

[Dana's Moonface]

My first BJJ club started most rolls standing, and we were in the midwest, so lots of former wrestlers (not everyone though). Quickly gained the reputation as "the Judo guy" when I threw the brown belt instructor first roll, day one with a nice easy to take sumi (he promptly subbed me following). Did not want to come in trying to flex with a big hard throw and be branded an asshole.

From then on rolls would usually start one of three ways:
I pulled guard on white belts because I didn't want to risk hurting them, I wasn't gaining much tossing a BJJ WB as a longtime competitive brown belt in judo, I wanted to work on my weakest aspect of my game (bottom) because I had a crushing top game if I landed outside of guard

Most newer blues pulled guard so the new mid 30s WB (me) didn't throw them, or wind up on top in a dominant position and *gasp* possibly land a sub or just frustrate...

Senior blues and up actually wanted to work their stand up game and would ask pointers...if tossed them on a counter or they said attack as you would normally, they just smoked me quick on the ground to get back up, lol.

Already had over a decade of training in Judo and wrestling, a plate in the ankle and moved into "hobbiest" mode, so I rolled light when I felt like it, hard when agreed upon, and controlled the pace with the other WBs when I thought they were spazzing..

Nice Post, thanks for the insight