Television Cobra Kai Season 5 Releases Tomorrow (Get Hyped)

[KnightTemplar]

Can we take a moment to talk about the MVP? Give Sensei Stingray his own show, damn it!

 

[wlu.29]

In case no one's mentioned it before: Tori in that orange bikini...

Fake though, so that jiggle ain't the same

 

[KnightTemplar]

Fake though, so that jiggle ain't the same

Her boobs may be fake, but my erection was very real

 

[ChickenBrother]

That is the thing though, he brought her to America because Chozen took out the American senseis. When Chozen was teaching Tory how to focus, you see Kyler mouthing off to one of the senseis and being rude and dismissive with his body language as the sensei is trying to fix his form. Clearly the Americanized students have attitude problem and the American sensei's looked weak as hell.

As far Kim chick goes, that was not normal training, that was some straight up old school dojo punishment. Keep people in check through fear. To be fair, she saw that Tory was not with the program. Aside from that, she was not really a bad person. Regards to getting sued, sure they could have gotten sued and they knew it was wrong without a doubt but they also know that Tory is poor which means her future lies in cobra kai since she gets fired from her other jobs. I doubt they would do that with a rich kid who has leverage in life. Aside from that, everything else is normal Korean training.

Daniel did conceded but like Terry said, it was when it was too late. Larusso did tons of damage but here is the thing, Terry didnt beat the shit out of him right from the start but rather he got Daniel to strike first. Larusso was the one who got physical with him first and Terry was like "Yes! This is the cobra kai student I remember!"

That and Daniel really did Kreese dirty. If he did help Kreese be free, then they would have one more guy on their side. Kreese would be a wild card and not a Miyagi team player but he would cause chaos for Terry so that the Miyagi do would win.


Heel turn is a good point, Terry to his credit did say that if he just lets it go, there is not going to be any retaliation or follow up attack. He was willing to let it go and focus on cobra kai. His goal was to make cobra kai and karate the Starbucks of coffee. This is much better than Kreeses revenge fueled dojo in which only the strong are allowed entry.

Notwithstanding the "old school dojo punishment" was straight up abuse - senseis blocking the exit threatening Tory lmao. It was the Private Pyle "choke yourself" treatment. But even what you're calling "normal Korean training" was abusive. Threatening kids with violence if they don't compete. Smacking kids if they're not aggressive enough. Having kids team up against a trained adult only to get beaten down LMFAO

The Terry + Kim CK was a "bad guy" dojo with a "bad guy" vibe. Same as the Kreese CK both in KK1 and in the series. There was an angry bully mentality there.

The Johnny CK by contrast had a better balance. He wasn't the dweeb Daniel is but wasn't a bully. His vibe was like, "I'll take you loser rejects and turn you all into badasses!" That's what makes Johnny so much more hilarious and likeable as a sensei. You get the sense he might actually be closer to Miyagi's philosophy than Daniel, who's more sanctimonious and still kind of a bitch. In the movies, Miyagi trolled Daniel all the time but did it with humor and good intent rather than heavy handedness.

 

[Kforcer]

Can we take a moment to talk about the MVP? Give Sensei Stingray his own show, damn it!

I'd watch.

 

[ChickenBrother]

Anyone kinda disappointed that Daniel was able to beat Silver solo after all that buildup? If anyone was going to get that honor, I would have sort of wanted it to be Johnny. And whoever it was, I would have liked to see them go through the fire so to speak, before getting the win. That said, I was cheering for Silver to go down and felt some genuine catharsis seem Daniel pull it off.

But the fact that Johnny got taken out by him in season 4 in such humiliating fashion and the fact that Johnny is just well-suited to Rocky-type comebacks in general makes me still wish it was Johnny that had the honors. Or you know, they could've just had Silver beat Daniel and somehow manage to wash his hands of everything the way Kingpin used to back in the day.

I think they established that Silver was the best fighter in the series, with Chozen the only one who could match him in a fair fight. Agree the circumstances under which Daniel beat him were disappointing, but it was something that had to happen because Silver was the only remaining baddie from the movies who Daniel hadn't yet paid back for wronging him.

Johnny by contrast owed him for getting cro-copped from the shadows like a bitch from last season (which johnny mentions lol), but he had no prior beef with him or even knew who he was until last season. As far as fan service, Johnny teaming up with the other baddies in Chozen and Barnes to break into Silver's house was possibly more rewarding and definitely hilarious.

But yeah, the way Silver lost was kind of lame. It was like Silver competing in IBJJF Masters 8 division and just won a hard fought special rules match against Gokor Chivichyan that goes the distance. Then he ends up having to go straight into a fight against a fresh guy from Masters 5 division coming into his first match.

 

[Kforcer]

Her boobs may be fake, but my erection was very real

I'd say they're real and spectacular.

 

[ChickenBrother]

Oh yeah. Mrs Larusso is a baddie and so is Miguel’s mom. Even more shocking is that I like Daniels wife looks and her character. She’s never treated Johnny terribly just because he had beef with her husband

Mrs. Larusso has had some issues but she learns from her mistakes and is a good wife and mother. Remember a few seasons back she went full Karen trying to mog Tory before realizing Tory was an underprivileged kid taking care of her sick mother. Then she checked herself and did the right thing.

 

[Ogata]

Yeah, that's all fair enough. I just sort of think it would have made more cathartic to see Johnny be the one to defeat Silver, given his connection with Kreese and the fact that Terry had beaten him the way he did in season 5. Johnny hasn't really had a shining moment fight-wise whereas Daniel got to put the finishing touches on Kreese in season 3, so it would have been cool to see him have the glory of being the one to take down Silver. At least in my opinion.

That said, it was a terrific season as it was. And with a show that is essentially ensemble, that's how things are going to work. Moments are not going to always be equally distributed and that is part of what makes things interesting.

By the way. I think Barnes was arguably the best part of the season. He was absolutely amazing.

I mean Johnny is the main character of the series but technically speaking, he has no history with Terry while Daniel did and in reality, Terry fucked Danny boy up so bad that when he found out Robby was Johnny`s son, he assumed it was some sick mind games.

This is because of his experience with Terry Silver. Hence the final fight made sense to be Daniel vs Terry.

Mike Barnes was supposed to have a much bigger role but Sean Kanan had a serious shoulder injury that did not allow him to go all out. That is why he got KO`d quickly and was out of commission in most of the house fight.

Notwithstanding the "old school dojo punishment" was straight up abuse - senseis blocking the exit threatening Tory lmao. It was the Private Pyle "choke yourself" treatment. But even what you're calling "normal Korean training" was abusive. Threatening kids with violence if they don't compete. Smacking kids if they're not aggressive enough. Having kids team up against a trained adult only to get beaten down LMFAO

The Terry + Kim CK was a "bad guy" dojo with a "bad guy" vibe. Same as the Kreese CK both in KK1 and in the series. There was an angry bully mentality there.

The Johnny CK by contrast had a better balance. He wasn't the dweeb Daniel is but wasn't a bully. His vibe was like, "I'll take you loser rejects and turn you all into badasses!" That's what makes Johnny so much more hilarious and likeable as a sensei. You get the sense he might actually be closer to Miyagi's philosophy than Daniel, who's more sanctimonious and still kind of a bitch. In the movies, Miyagi trolled Daniel all the time but did it with humor and good intent rather than heavy handedness.

Kids sparring against adults is standard + I have been in abusive boxing gyms in which the beginners get thrown in to the ring and get the living shit kicked out of them and getting an express trip to CTE city. Cobra kai sensei`s did not do anything to damage the brain. Tory leaving the tournament like that was a big deal. I would be extremely pissed.

The stick used to hit them in Korea is called...Mother Love

It actually is a thing and the idea is that, words hurt more than getting hit with a stick. You get hit and it hurts but you forget about the pain but saying something very hurtful sticks with someone for life. Also @ChickenBrother please understand that Tang Soo Do was birthed during a very bad time in Korean history. During these times, there was many lawlessness and Tang Soo Do masters MUST know how to fight with extreme urgency. Training had to be extreme and borderline abusive to get very good but they made sure you did not get head trauma.


I have been part of boxing gyms that were truly abusive and filled with bullying in terms of a coach and a student bullying other students and showing favoritism and believe me when I say this, cobra kai was nowhere near as bad. Aside from Tory, everyone else was being treated well because they got with the program. Watch the scene with Tory and Chozen training, in the background, Kyler and Edwin are being disrespectful to the sensei. The Korean masters were not getting disrespected and that is because there was the element of fear and respect which is important if its done in healthy small doses.

Without a small dose of fear, you get mouthy behavior and people wont respect you. Also Miyagi and Johnny had to deal with small batch of students. When you are dealing with a large batch, you have to instill a bit of ruthlessness because of the dynamic of dealing with quantity students otherwise you get hecklers and that leads to disorderly conduct.


Also Terry was a good mentor to Kenny. D bit hypocritical because both Kreese and Silver encourage their favorite to make their own decision while everybody else has to follow orders. That being said, Silver was much better and he did offer free classes to poor kids.

To truly understand the Korean and Tang Soo Do culture, you should read this book:



I agree with Johnny and Miyagi being similar. Both used humor like how Miyagi was like `Are you some type of a giiirrrllll!!!` Or Johnnys ` common, hit harder! Dont be a pussy!`

 

[ChickenBrother]

Kids sparring against adults is standard + I have been in abusive boxing gyms in which the beginners get thrown in to the ring and get the living shit kicked out of them and getting an express trip to CTE city. Cobra kai sensei`s did not do anything to damage the brain. Tory leaving the tournament like that was a big deal. I would be extremely pissed.

The stick used to hit them in Korea is called...Mother Love

It actually is a thing and the idea is that, words hurt more than getting hit with a stick. You get hit and it hurts but you forget about the pain but saying something very hurtful sticks with someone for life. Also @ChickenBrother please understand that Tang Soo Do was birthed during a very bad time in Korean history. During these times, there was many lawlessness and Tang Soo Do masters MUST know how to fight with extreme urgency. Training had to be extreme and borderline abusive to get very good but they made sure you did not get head trauma.


I have been part of boxing gyms that were truly abusive and filled with bullying in terms of a coach and a student bullying other students and showing favoritism and believe me when I say this, cobra kai was nowhere near as bad. Aside from Tory, everyone else was being treated well because they got with the program. Watch the scene with Tory and Chozen training, in the background, Kyler and Edwin are being disrespectful to the sensei. The Korean masters were not getting disrespected and that is because there was the element of fear and respect which is important if its done in healthy small doses.

Without a small dose of fear, you get mouthy behavior and people wont respect you. Also Miyagi and Johnny had to deal with small batch of students. When you are dealing with a large batch, you have to instill a bit of ruthlessness because of the dynamic of dealing with quantity students otherwise you get hecklers and that leads to disorderly conduct.

To truly understand the Korean and Tang Soo Do culture, you should read this book:
View attachment 943524

Sorry but I completely disagree. I've been training basically my whole life in boxing, wrestling, Judo and BJJ with cross training in most of the common TMAs. 100% of the time when I hear someone defending outdated practices because "that's what they did 80 years ago," my bullshido alarm goes off. There is nothing honorable or bushido samurai about being an abusive prick.

By far the most effective coaches/senseis are the ones who know how to push kids but do it with a smile, have good EQ and are assertive without being aggressive or abusive to the kids. Basically what Miyagi/Johnny does. That keeps kids in line. If the kid is acting like he doesn't want to be there (aka Kyler or Tory), you make him do push ups in the corner, maybe run a few laps. Then you pull the kid aside and talk to them. If that doesn't work, you talk to their parents and if necessary, you kick them off the team. You can't force a kid to compete or to want it if they don't. This isn't communist North Korea and it shouldn't have to be to get buy in from the students.

 

[KnightTemplar]

I'd watch.

Stingray is a Dungeon Master: Cobra Kai - Stranger Things crossover confirmed!

 

[Kforcer]

Sorry but I completely disagree. I've been training basically my whole life in boxing, wrestling, Judo and BJJ with cross training in most of the common TMAs. 100% of the time when I hear someone defending outdated practices because "that's what they did 80 years ago," my bullshido alarm goes off. There is nothing honorable or bushido samurai about being an abusive prick.

By far the most effective coaches/senseis are the ones who know how to push kids but do it with a smile, have good EQ and are assertive without being aggressive or abusive to the kids. Basically what Miyagi/Johnny does. That keeps kids in line. If the kid is acting like he doesn't want to be there (aka Kyler or Tory), you make him do push ups in the corner, maybe run a few laps. Then you pull the kid aside and talk to them. If that doesn't work, you talk to their parents and if necessary, you kick them off the team. You can't force a kid to compete or to want it if they don't. This isn't communist North Korea and it shouldn't have to be to get buy in from the students.

I think it is sort of a complex question.

My high school wrestling coach who had a fairly laidback approach blew me off when he saw me at a high school meet post-high school, whereas a drill-instructor, tough-love, grumpy old-man coach from a rival school who ran freestyle practices I attended went out of his way to talk to me when he bumped into me in a grocery store and clearly cared about how I was doing and talked to me like I was basically his grandson. I can think of a soccer coach who was sort of similar; really pushed discipline, was super-intense, but in the end, really cared, whereas other coaches that weren't as passionate or as scary seemed to ultimately not give a crap about the players, at least not in the same way.

My main problem with the hardcore coaches is that they can sometimes turn kids into drones and paradoxically drive out their own passion for whatever they're doing instead of letting them find it inside of them (if its there to be found). They can also potentially be so intense as to make kids nervous and on edge during competition so that they lock up.

Anyway, that's all sort of off-topic, I guess. But I think the hardcore coach who yells at people isn't always a bad guy. I think the key to whether he is the bad sort of hardcore coach or the good kind is often revealed in how he views effort versus results. Usually the good kind is going to be happy with kids that manage to dig deep and bring out their best whereas the bad kind just wants winners. You saw this with Kreese, of course, at the beginning of Karate Kid 2 and also in Cobra Kai, where he mercilessly expelled people he saw as failures from his dojo.

Not that this is necessarily contradicting what you're saying. I do think there is a sort of context to it all though. For instance, the hardcore wrestling coach I'm thinking of coached an inner city school and he needed a certain approach to give his wrestlers structure because they came from a world without structure. Sometimes he had to sort of be an authoritarian figure for certain kids, you know, like the Grid Iron Gang coach in that old documentary.

I mean, I think if Kreese wasn't so psycho and pro-cheating, he could possibly be a great fit for someone like Sean if Sean ever gets out of juvenile detention.

 

[Kforcer]

I think they established that Silver was the best fighter in the series, with Chozen the only one who could match him in a fair fight. Agree the circumstances under which Daniel beat him were disappointing, but it was something that had to happen because Silver was the only remaining baddie from the movies who Daniel hadn't yet paid back for wronging him.

Johnny by contrast owed him for getting cro-copped from the shadows like a bitch from last season (which johnny mentions lol), but he had no prior beef with him or even knew who he was until last season. As far as fan service, Johnny teaming up with the other baddies in Chozen and Barnes to break into Silver's house was possibly more rewarding and definitely hilarious.

But yeah, the way Silver lost was kind of lame. It was like Silver competing in IBJJF Masters 8 division and just won a hard fought special rules match against Gokor Chivichyan that goes the distance. Then he ends up having to go straight into a fight against a fresh guy from Masters 5 division coming into his first match.

I definitely loved seeing Johnny team-up with the other hardcore guys, that was awesome. But this is the second time that Daniel got the honors of beating the main bad guy and so in that sense, I'd have liked it to have gone to Johnny if it had to go to one of them. And I also feel like, though there wasn't prior history, Silver's beatdown sent Johnny's life into a downward spiral. He left him a drunken mess and it was basically because of the beating he gave him that Johnny had the whole faux pas with Miguel.

It is funny, the way you describe Silver versus Larusso reminds me of how the John Walker-Steve Rogers showdown in Captain America 350 went down; a frostbitten, near dead Walker dragged himself out of the hospital and went through a gauntlet of the Red Skull's top enforcers before finally fighting a fresh Steve Rogers, whom he was convinced was Red Skull (due to a cloned body). It also, honestly, isn't so different form Daniel's dramatic defeat of Kreese at the end of season 3. Old man Kreese had gone through a rugged battle with Johnny and had absolutely no time to rest before Daniel burst on the scene and went at him.

It is a funny thing in fiction when the heroes capitalize on the antagonist's fatigue instead of vice versa and are essentially given all the storyline glory for their win, which would've probably been portrayed as cheap had the shoe been on the other foot.

 

[Ogata]

Sorry but I completely disagree. I've been training basically my whole life in boxing, wrestling, Judo and BJJ with cross training in most of the common TMAs. 100% of the time when I hear someone defending outdated practices because "that's what they did 80 years ago," my bullshido alarm goes off. There is nothing honorable or bushido samurai about being an abusive prick.

By far the most effective coaches/senseis are the ones who know how to push kids but do it with a smile, have good EQ and are assertive without being aggressive or abusive to the kids. Basically what Miyagi/Johnny does. That keeps kids in line. If the kid is acting like he doesn't want to be there (aka Kyler or Tory), you make him do push ups in the corner, maybe run a few laps. Then you pull the kid aside and talk to them. If that doesn't work, you talk to their parents and if necessary, you kick them off the team. You can't force a kid to compete or to want it if they don't. This isn't communist North Korea and it shouldn't have to be to get buy in from the students.

I agree with the bold part but we have to have the talk about being an abusive prick vs tough love and this comes down to ego. I will get in to this but first lets talk about cobra kai being abusive or not.

Cobra Kai context:

Aside from Tory, we did not see Tyrone and other Kim Sun Yung trained senseis be overly abusive. Remember, the series takes place in the modern times. I am sure if Terry did train kids like they used to during Master Kim era, they would all quite on the first day. Not to mentioned lawsuits...

So in a way, all of Master Kims disciples are teaching todays generation a more pussified version of the old school training that was taught 80 years ago. They have to otherwise they would go out of business. We saw Terry owned cobra kai training, the fact is, Kyler has the ability to stop mid-way and tell Kenny:

Hey yo bro, Sloowwwww down man, your making us look bad!

This implies that Terry has ordered the Korean trained senseis to hold back on the disciplining. I have never seen a real life dojo in which one member stops another mid-drill to tell them to slow down. Usually in real life, they get called out for it or are told to not speak.

Tory did get abused and it was straight up criminal, no question about that.


Regarding abuse vs tough love:

Abusive teachers tend to do so from a place of ego. They psychologically enjoy beating someone down. For me, it comes down to psychology of that teacher. If they enjoy yelling and screaming because its cathartic for them and makes them feel good. Then yes, they are an abusive piece of shit because they are using their social status as a therapy session and you literally end up paying for it.

That and an abusive teacher tends to be a prick outside of training and uses that status to further pull some alpha male bullshit. To that end, I agree with you 100 percent.


At the Korean Dojang I train at, my teacher sometimes yells and tells me to move it and it can sound abusive but after training, we go back to being friendly. That hostile style of training has NEVER ended up affecting how we interact. Every 3-4 sessions, we end up hanging out at the Dojang and have like 3 hours of conversation about life. He is a decade younger and we talk about our generation difference, politics and life in general from dating to favorite shows as well as him taking an interest in boxing and I tell him the different between boxing and Taekwondo/Tang Soo Do footwork.

That being said, I am a private student of a Korean Dojang. They demand perfection and in doing so, they will push you in a way that is not culturally compatible within the western world. This method has few particular flaws which one of them is what @Kforcer mentioned in top post. Burning out and passion fizzling out and creativity going to shit. While a more relaxed training allows creativity to flourish while a brutal training gives urgency and cardio.

But going back to abuse vs tough training. I can say that psychologically speaking, my teacher has ZERO ill will and we both know how to turn it off and have hours of friendly conversation. Last thing and most important thing that separates a tough teacher vs abusive teacher is...

Openness in communication, a tough teacher is open to discuss their tough training and happily share ( with a smile as you mentioned) about what they experienced and what is the driving factor their method. That and if you are injured or extremely beat up, they are ok with you requesting an easy mode ( I have asked this before ) like having a light day or just a technique day because the rapport has been established.

Abusive teacher does not let you talk, not open to any modification, yells and screams like a maniac if their method is challenged and is dismissive as well as temperamental and demands loyalty while not reciprocating.

Also I fully read @Kforcer post about his wrestling experience. I have had boxing coaches who super nice and laid back people but never had any interest to push me to my limits. They were friendly but there was a lack of interest in my improvement and seeing me reach my full potential.


P.S: We DO NOT use Mother Love in modern times! Legit you would sued to the living dept!

 

[IamStryker]

I still can't believe this show exists.

 

[Streeter]

Just hope the show ends with a Johnny vs Daniel match in the cage. Imo thatsxhow it needs to end. Hoping if it does Johnny wins n Kreese os in Johnny corner somehow as a redemption story before getting hauled back to jail.

 

[Ogata]

I still can't believe this show exists.

Pretty awesome right?

Just hope the show ends with a Johnny vs Daniel match in the cage. Imo thatsxhow it needs to end. Hoping if it does Johnny wins n Kreese os in Johnny corner somehow as a redemption story before getting hauled back to jail.

Johnny had a heart to heart talk with Chozen. He realized that the kick was not the problem. It was his shitty outlook to the loss that messed his life up. Him learning to move on was the ultimate victory. Like Hawk said, You win some and you lose some and then you move on.

Johnny finally came to that conclusion that a rematch will not change the past. Best to focus on family and loved ones. That being said, in reality, a rematch is pointless because they are evenly matched. They both know it and both are fine with it.


@BisexualMMA

Get your ass in here where you belong!

Master Kim Sun Yung finally made his legendary appearance and I have not heard you express yourself.

 

[BisexualMMA]

@BisexualMMA

Get your ass in here where you belong!

Master Kim Sun Yung finally made his legendary appearance and I have not heard you express yourself.

I haven't been able to watch it...but I looked up some highlights. Is there more than him in the background and the shadows while Johnny and Terry are sparring? Anyway, if that's all there is it's still pretty good...he seemed formidable and mysterious.

All I've seen is a few scenes out of context but what I saw seemed pretty good.

 

[IamStryker]

I don't see why they put Mike Barnes in this season at all. He felt shoehorned in. His storyline didn't make much sense and he didn't do much.

 

[Tabarnakos]

Good question. Silver is off the board. Even if he somehow manages to avoid serious prison time, everyone now knows what an utter sociopath he really is. Kreese is a wanted man. And the Kim doesn't have the resources to continue teaching, in America, even if she could find students dumb enough to sign up.

Unlike the previous seasons, there is no natural progression from this point.

100% agree with that. From a logical POV series should end right there. Defeating/exposing Silver , making his students turn on him , stopping the Cobra Kai expansion and Daniel finally getting the upper hand on him in a fight is like the ultimate Karate Kid universe climax. There is no need to push things further as this is the ideal happy ending.

That said we already know that there is a strong possibility of a S6 so my guess is that the plot will focus around that world tournament that i forgot the name of. Because aside from that i don't see anything. With the season villain being some new guy linked to that tournament. It's aslo possible that Silver returns in some way as with his money and lawyers he may find a way to corrupt a judge or something and get out of jail. But that would be a bit lame if you ask me. The Silver arc should be over and Kreese should have a redemption arc and not be the villain imho