Classic Doom 1 & 2 chat

[Clippy]

 

[hillelslovak87]

That turn by DoomBro is so awesome. It's like he sees this guy, and all he really cares to do is go southpaw for better angles. Gold.

 

[Clippy]

 

[JBSchroeds]

Yo Clippy, can I get some level suggestions? I've been doing E1 and E2 UV 100% kills and secrets runs and I'm looking for more of those style levels. Basically, stuff that doesn't need finding hidden shit, solving obnoxious puzzles, or navigating teleportation mazes in order to beat. I really like E1 and E2 for the fact that as long as you explore the whole level you can beat them. Sure, there's backtracking after finding keys, but the levels aren't convoluted. I've tried E4, Doom 2, Doom 64, TNT, Plutonia, and Sigil and all of them fall back on "bullshit puzzles, cheap monster closets, and enemy spam" to inflate their difficulty.

There's nothing I hate more than having to pause the game to look up a solution to a puzzle only to find out you need to walk in a specific direction, run off a ledge, activate some unmarked wall, or shoot some random tile just to progress; not just to find a secret area, but to finish the damn level.

 

[Clippy]

Yo Clippy, can I get some level suggestions? I've been doing E1 and E2 UV 100% kills and secrets runs and I'm looking for more of those style levels. Basically, stuff that doesn't need finding hidden shit, solving obnoxious puzzles, or navigating teleportation mazes in order to beat. I really like E1 and E2 for the fact that as long as you explore the whole level you can beat them. Sure, there's backtracking after finding keys, but the levels aren't convoluted. I've tried E4, Doom 2, Doom 64, TNT, Plutonia, and Sigil and all of them fall back on "bullshit puzzles, cheap monster closets, and enemy spam" to inflate their difficulty.

There's nothing I hate more than having to pause the game too look up a solution to a puzzle only to find out you need to walk in a specific direction, run off a ledge, activate some unmarked wall, or shoot some random tile just to progress; not just to find a secret area, but to finish the damn level.

Haha even some missions in episode two annoy me. That one where you have to go through dark mazes after dark mazes

Not sure what to suggest but I do like Doom 2 Icarus you should have a look at it

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

Good work finally beating Sigil @Clippy
Watched your E5M9 video this afternoon on my second monitor while doing a bit of work. Fucking lol at your fight with the Cyberdemon. Finally took him down with three shotgun shells to spare after probably 20 deaths <Lmaoo>

 

[Clippy]

Good work finally beating Sigil @Clippy
Watched your E5M9 video this afternoon on my second monitor while doing a bit of work. Fucking lol at your fight with the Cyberdemon. Finally took him down with three shotgun shells to spare after probably 20 deaths <Lmaoo>

Thank you for calling it a fight

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

So @Clippy in that austinado guy’s vid where he was reviewing your map he said you make vanilla maps and that in your vids you play vanilla maps. What exactly did he mean by that? As opposed to what?

 

[Clippy]

So @Clippy in that austinado guy’s vid where he was reviewing your map he said you make vanilla maps and that in your vids you play vanilla maps. What exactly did he mean by that? As opposed to what?

Standard issue basic maps with the regular monsters and textures and weapons

Something that could fit right into any other regular Doom 2 released map

once you start getting into zdoom special effects and things it no longer becomes a vanilla map

 

[JBSchroeds]

I can now do 100% secrets, ultraviolence, consecutive level runs in E1, 2, and 3, in both vanilla and brutal (though still can't beat the cyber or spider in brutal, the balance is absurd compared to the rest of the mod EDIT: so it turns out the spider is actually really easy if you have the Unmaker and a full 600 ammo, just dump it all into him and he goes down even faster than with the BFG on vanilla).

The secret level in E3 is so obnoxious. If you don't grab the invuln surrounded by the specters and then book past all the enemies and straight to that long killing corridor, grab the key, and run back out all while you're still invincible then you get absolutely ass fucked. I can't imagine how you are supposed to survive that first-try-blind. I know I sure didn't.

Also not a fan of Mt. Erebus with all it's meatballs and skulls. Pistol-start for that level must blow; lots of avoiding confrontation I'd imagine.

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

What’s the difference between Brutal Doom and Project Brutality. Are you supposed to run them together?

 

[JBSchroeds]

What’s the difference between Brutal Doom and Project Brutality. Are you supposed to run them together?

They are two different mods, one built on top of the other. Brutal Doom mostly overhauls the enemy AI (more aggressive, new melee attacks if you get too close, some get limited dodging abilities), weapons (new sprites and animations, new additions to the arsenal like an SMG and combat rifle, needing to reload), and adds a new gore system (splatter, destructible corpses, blowing off limbs, death animations) while adding some new graphical flairs like lighting and water ripples. There's a lot of changes, but overall it doesn't feel like an all new game to me. The pace of combat and what weapons you use in what situation is mostly the same as before. The creator has even broken it up so if you want you can have just the gore system, or just the gore+improved enemies.

I haven't tried it, but what I've read on Project Brutality it turns things up to 11 with tons of new enemy variants, different ammo types, jumping and ledge grabbing, weapon special moves, etc. The videos I've seen of it in action makes it look like a very different play experience than either Vanilla or Brutal. I've been meaning to try it, but since they are independent projects and Brutality is built on top of Brutal you currently need an older version of Brutal to run Brutality and I just haven't bothered to sort out what I needed to download yet.

 

[JBSchroeds]

So an update on Project Brutality: I tracked it down and you don't need to also download any version of Brutal Doom to get it to work, everything is included in a single (huge) zip file found on their github page. I played through E1 and did not like it...at all. They changed the movement and default mouse sensitivity so my snap shooting was thrown off and things felt sluggish, and the feel of some weapons is totally different (the minigun is almost impossible to control on anything other than short burps due to the added recoil mechanic). They also changed weapon numbering so guns are on different keys (want to whip out that rocket launcher to blast a baron, haha, no you just pulled out the minigun). I (mostly) like Brutal Doom, I doubt I'll ever play Project Brutality ever again.

EDIT: I decided to give Project Brutality a second shot and was playing through E2. There's a few things here and there that I did like (sound design being one of them, as well as a number of the replacement sprites). But some of the alternate/upgraded enemies are just dumb. Like the exploding skulls or zombies with rocket launchers. You know the path to the secret exit where you go behind the blood fountain it dumps you in a room surround by Lost Souls? Yeah, so, in PB those normal skulls are replaced with the exploding versions and I went from like 200 armor 120 health to dead in about five seconds. PB is a big fat "nope" for me.

 

[JBSchroeds]

I just finished my normal play through of Doom 2. I had to look up the solutions to a couple levels (having to shoot the wall to open a hidden door on Map28 was BUUUUUULLLLLLshit). My impression is that it's a much more uneven game than the first one, with some quality levels mixed in with the forgettable and the trash. I like the expanded enemy group and the super shotgun is a nice addition (wish they had added another weapon, like some weirdo demon weapon for slot 8 like later games did with the Unmaker and Soul Cube). One thing I wish was that they had it broken up into episodes instead of one long map set; it's not like it isn't already thematically divided as is.

I don't think I'm going to bother learning how to do it UV 100% secrets like I did for E1-3. I guess I should finish trying to get through E4 as my next endeavor.

So @Clippy, you probably already mentioned this but I don't feel like sifting through 200+ messages to find it: what program are you using to make levels? I'd like to give it a shot. Searching it seems like Doom Builder 2 and DeePsea are the two main options.

 

[Clippy]

I just finished my normal play through of Doom 2. I had to look up the solutions to a couple levels (having to shoot the wall to open a hidden door on Map28 was BUUUUUULLLLLLshit). My impression is that it's a much more uneven game than the first one, with some quality levels mixed in with the forgettable and the trash. I like the expanded enemy group and the super shotgun is a nice addition (wish they had added another weapon, like some weirdo demon weapon for slot 8 like later games did with the Unmaker and Soul Cube). One thing I wish was that they had it broken up into episodes instead of one long map set; it's not like it isn't already thematically divided as is.

I don't think I'm going to bother learning how to do it UV 100% secrets like I did for E1-3. I guess I should finish trying to get through E4 as my next endeavor.

So @Clippy, you probably already mentioned this but I don't feel like sifting through 200+ messages to find it: what program are you using to make levels? I'd like to give it a shot. Searching it seems like Doom Builder 2 and DeePsea are the two main options.

Just simple doom builder bro

Use Slade to add music and custom textures and map name

 

[Clippy]

I got bored and thought I would see how long I can play doom 1 episode 1 knee deep in the dead ULRTA VIOLENCE without dying

I actually didn't die once! Good times

 

[JBSchroeds]

I made my first level. It felt like it took forever and, honestly, it likely sucks. I had to learn the program from scratch so a lot of the features are really just there because I was fucking around trying to figure out how how various triggers and such work. I playtested it a few times on UV tackling stuff in different orders and using/skipping certain secrets and I was able to beat it so it should at least be playable. Honestly, I'm not sure if I'm going to bother ever making another one: I just didn't find it to be fun playing a level I made myself.

 

[Clippy]

I made my first level. It felt like it took forever and, honestly, it likely sucks. I had to learn the program from scratch so a lot of the features are really just there because I was fucking around trying to figure out how how various triggers and such work. I playtested it a few times on UV tackling stuff in different orders and using/skipping certain secrets and I was able to beat it so it should at least be playable. Honestly, I'm not sure if I'm going to bother ever making another one: I just didn't find it to be fun playing a level I made myself.

Well where is it haha

I love play testing maps

My first maps suck too. There is a learning curve. I have fun making maps

Don't be so hard in yourself just have fun

Would love to play it bud

 

[JBSchroeds]

Well where is it haha

I love play testing maps

My first maps suck too. There is a learning curve. I have fun making maps

Don't be so hard in yourself just have fun

Would love to play it bud

Don't say I didn't warn you (see attached)

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

Don't say I didn't warn you (see attached)

Looking forward to @Clippy ’s YouTube review.