Law Cheers, Guv Gav for the happiness of California p******!

[jeremyemilio]

Probably the best peer reviewed scholarly article you will find in the last few years:

https://www.annualreviews.org/docserver/fulltext/energy/47/1/annurev-environ-112420-014642.pdf?expires=1760666157&id=id&accname=guest&checksum=AA9B372C0BE86A819133A46EBD6B4A32

If the link doesn't work, it's called "State of the World’s Birds" published in 2022, in the journal Annual Review of Environment and Resources.

Basically it outlines that the top 4 causes of bird biodiversity loss across the world (ranked in order) are:

1) Resource industries (logging, hunting/trapping, fishing, etc.)
2) Agriculture (farming)
3) Climate Change
4) Invasive & problematic species (cats are here)

Fair. But your article is much more broadly focused than the topic at hand. It is an overview of all birds, for one thing, and I pointed specifically to songbirds. Also, while this thread is about North American cats and claws, this paper is a worldwide study and a lot of the impacts you are talking about are far more prevalent in developing nations (especially the hunting aspect because in much of the west hunters and their practices are a net positive to bird species through their management initiatives, which is why, for instance, wetlands are actually increasing, as mentioned in your article). But even so, your article nods to a different reading of the data, in current contexts, that coincides with mine:

"Once species richness and phylogeny are accounted for, the bird families under the highest current degree of extinction risk are primarily threatened by invasive alien species, especially in small island systems (92) ( Figure 4 ). Predation by introduced mammals such as rats, mice, cats, dogs, and pigs is both a major historical driver of avian extinctions and a major contemporary threat (68). Globally, 766 species are threatened by invasive species (with 300 species suffering high or medium impacts). Of those threatened by named invasive species, 572 are threatened by mammals (230 species suffering high or medium impacts) such as the Henderson Petrel (Pterodroma atrata) threatened by Polynesian Rats (Rattus exulans) and domestic cats. Pets or their feral descendants are a major cause of biodiversity loss through disturbance and predation. For example, domestic cats kill an estimated 2.4 billion birds in the United States annually"

In any case, I made a statement that cats are the top culprit for declining bird populations, and that's probably a misstatement. What is more accurate to say is that cats are the top cause responsible for the killing of birds in North America, which (you are correct) is something different.

My point was that cats kill a lot of birds. Billions. They are a major threat to bird populations, by all accounts, including your article. How that makes me MAGA, I don't know.

 

[High Test With da Best]

Fair. But your article is much more broadly focused than the topic at hand. It is an overview of all birds, for one thing, and I pointed specifically to songbirds. Also, while this thread is about North American cats and claws, this paper is a worldwide study and a lot of the impacts you are talking about are far more prevalent in developing nations (especially the hunting aspect because in much of the west hunters and their practices are a net positive to bird species through their management initiatives, which is why, for instance, wetlands are actually increasing, as mentioned in your article). But even so, your article nods to a different reading of the data, in current contexts, that coincides with mine:

"Once species richness and phylogeny are accounted for, the bird families under the highest current degree of extinction risk are primarily threatened by invasive alien species, especially in small island systems (92) ( Figure 4 ). Predation by introduced mammals such as rats, mice, cats, dogs, and pigs is both a major historical driver of avian extinctions and a major contemporary threat (68). Globally, 766 species are threatened by invasive species (with 300 species suffering high or medium impacts). Of those threatened by named invasive species, 572 are threatened by mammals (230 species suffering high or medium impacts) such as the Henderson Petrel (Pterodroma atrata) threatened by Polynesian Rats (Rattus exulans) and domestic cats. Pets or their feral descendants are a major cause of biodiversity loss through disturbance and predation. For example, domestic cats kill an estimated 2.4 billion birds in the United States annually"

In any case, I made a statement that cats are the top culprit for declining bird populations, and that's probably a misstatement. What is more accurate to say is that cats are the top cause responsible for the killing of birds in North America, which (you are correct) is something different.

My point was that cats kill a lot of birds. Billions. They are a major threat to bird populations, by all accounts, including your article. How that makes me MAGA, I don't know.

Any sense for what % of the overall North American song bitd population 2.4 billion represents?

 

[ShadowRun]

You have cats?

You couldn’t have guessed ? She made some thread that she had to cancel a trip somewhere and lost out on deposits because her normal cat sitter wasn’t available and didn’t want to use any other kind of sitters.

You know the cat is a vegan and has anxiety

 

[Alpha_T83]

My point was that cats kill a lot of birds. Billions. They are a major threat to bird populations, by all accounts, including your article. How that makes me MAGA, I don't know.

Yes cats kill ~2.4 billion birds a year. But it's still not more than other human activities causing habitat damage/loss.

And torturing pet cats won't do shit. The real problem is the feral cat populations, so we should be working hard to spay/neuter every single pet cat, and capture as many feral cats as possible.

 

[fingercuffs]

Fair. But your article is much more broadly focused than the topic at hand. It is an overview of all birds, for one thing, and I pointed specifically to songbirds. Also, while this thread is about North American cats and claws, this paper is a worldwide study and a lot of the impacts you are talking about are far more prevalent in developing nations (especially the hunting aspect because in much of the west hunters and their practices are a net positive to bird species through their management initiatives, which is why, for instance, wetlands are actually increasing, as mentioned in your article). But even so, your article nods to a different reading of the data, in current contexts, that coincides with mine:

"Once species richness and phylogeny are accounted for, the bird families under the highest current degree of extinction risk are primarily threatened by invasive alien species, especially in small island systems (92) ( Figure 4 ). Predation by introduced mammals such as rats, mice, cats, dogs, and pigs is both a major historical driver of avian extinctions and a major contemporary threat (68). Globally, 766 species are threatened by invasive species (with 300 species suffering high or medium impacts). Of those threatened by named invasive species, 572 are threatened by mammals (230 species suffering high or medium impacts) such as the Henderson Petrel (Pterodroma atrata) threatened by Polynesian Rats (Rattus exulans) and domestic cats. Pets or their feral descendants are a major cause of biodiversity loss through disturbance and predation. For example, domestic cats kill an estimated 2.4 billion birds in the United States annually"

In any case, I made a statement that cats are the top culprit for declining bird populations, and that's probably a misstatement. What is more accurate to say is that cats are the top cause responsible for the killing of birds in North America, which (you are correct) is something different.

My point was that cats kill a lot of birds. Billions. They are a major threat to bird populations, by all accounts, including your article. How that makes me MAGA, I don't know.

Oh fucking hell, lol.
My 3 cats look at the birdies when I put seed in a planter for them. They aren't decimating birdies.

 

[fingercuffs]

Luckily(depending on where you live, I guess), they don't have many natural predators. Might have a harder time being a predator themselves though, and will have to put in some extra effort hunting their own food. I'd be more worried about it getting hit be a car, than getting taken out by a coyote or whatever.

Shit, I had one go missing for six months way back. His greatest enemy seemed to be plant life. Just absolutely covered in burrs in shit. Practically had to shave him bald, and turn him into a sphinx for a bit LOL.

I think I covered bad drivers and coyotes as to why I don't let my cats outside.