Brandon Vera's "intellegent defence"

[blanko]

I am a firm beliver that Vera didn't "intellegently defend" himself against werdum. This is what he did:

i don't see an "intellegent defence" for the love of god look at his legs... No upa attempt, no attempt to shrimp nothign. A bjj brown belt and an accomplished greco roman wrestler doesn not "intellegently defend" in this fashion.

 

[Yojimbo]

I agree. He wasn't hurt, but he didn't do anything to prevent the fight from being stopped. It was his own fault.

 

[UrbanSavage**]

Vera really annoyed me in the post fight press conference, too. He was acting like he deserved a rematch, saying Werdum had promised him a rematch in the cage and then took it back, said the ref sucks, etc. The stoppage was questionable, but he literally did NOTHING to escape or look like he was defending. Lauzon kept trying to Upa and do different things against Florian, that's why the ref let it go 2 minutes or so before he stopped it. Vera looked like he just gave up once he was mounted.

 

[Cryomancer]

Honestly, Brandon Vera is overhyped. Bright future for Werdum

 

[HitamiAkaya]

Vera really annoyed me in the post fight press conference, too. He was acting like he deserved a rematch, saying Werdum had promised him a rematch in the cage and then took it back, said the ref sucks, etc. The stoppage was questionable, but he literally did NOTHING to escape or look like he was defending. Lauzon kept trying to Upa and do different things against Florian, that's why the ref let it go 2 minutes or so before he stopped it. Vera looked like he just gave up once he was mounted.

and Werdum responded, "Get back in que."

 

[YeahBee]

bullshit stoppage, jsut because some shots went thru you cannot stop it, and he was trying to avoid them, jsut a couple got thru it mostly hit his arms ffs

Should Silva vs Leben been stopped after the first couple of jabs? clearly Leben wasn't intellegently defending himself either

vera knew how much time ther was left and decided to ride it out isntead of trying to escape and give Werdum a big opening, he didn't get TKO'ed, he was moving all the time not going limp and had his arms up

 

[LeatherWhip]

Vera said himself for another fight "Don't believe the hype, just believe what you see"

 

[Chute Stomp]

You're allowed to take a few punches in a fight you know. If his body had gone limp, or say his arms were trapped and he was taking a prolonged beating, then ok stop it, but that wasn't the case.

Miragliotta totally lost it. He was ready to pull the trigger the moment Werdum got mount. Dan was stopping that no matter what. He was just itching to get in.

Their is nothing worse in sports than an official who thinks he is part of the show. Dan MUST go. From now on everyone is gonna be worried when they see Dan as the ref in a big fight. Months of training and build-up can't be risked on this guy.

Is their anything more annoying than an early stoppage? Everybody loses.

 

[blanko]

bullshit stoppage, jsut because some shots went thru you cannot stop it, and he was trying to avoid them, jsut a couple got thru it mostly hit his arms ffs

Should Silva vs Leben been stopped after the first couple of jabs? clearly Leben wasn't intellegently defending himself either

vera knew how much time ther was left and decided to ride it out isntead of trying to escape and give Werdum a big opening, he didn't get TKO'ed, he was moving all the time not going limp and had his arms up

as a grappler i am suprised that you compare this stoppage to the jab leben took. I expect this from a tuf noob in the heavweights but from a trained grappler like yourself? NO. What did vera do to try to IMPROVE POSITION? Nothing. What he did is basically cover up in a fetal position. As randy said on boadcasts many times "THIS (covering up) is not an intellegent defence, you have to attempt to improve position". All the fighters know this, the ref constantly scream it at them "improve position". Letting someone punch you and hoping that he doesn't knock you out is not something a fighter like Vera should do.

 

[blanko]

You're allowed to take a few punches in a fight you know. If his body had gone limp, or say his arms were trapped and he was taking a prolonged beating, then ok stop it, but that wasn't the case.

you are allowed to take a few punches if you are mentally there and you are trying to improve position.

is their anything more annoying than an early stoppage? Everybody loses.

what's more annoying is when a fighter of high lvl greco roman training and is an accomplished grappler and a brown belt in jiu jitsu just covers up and makes NO ATTEMPT to improve position.

 

[Hinch**]

At the end of the day, I looked at it lie this:

"It could have gone on for 10 or more seconds, but I couldn't see anything being done by Vera to show it would have been a poor stoppage.

Eventually, all the uncomfortable squirming and wriggling in the world can't be deemed intelligent defence. Especially when mounted by a Mundial champion."

Okay, I just posted about it literally this second on another board, and am far too lazy to re-word my thinking.

 

[FWTG]

edit: double post

 

[Jaguar Tang]

u guys are all noobs. Vera was doing the fetal guard. Most effective way to defend against gnp. TUF dumbasses

 

[Jaguar Tang]

u guys are all noobs. Vera was doing the fetal guard. Most effective way to defend against gnp. TUF dumbasses

 

[FWTG]

(Disclaimer: I didn't see the Vera fight.)

Is this the same ref that was in elite? They actually let him ref again??

 

[Chute Stomp]

you are allowed to take a few punches if you are mentally there and you are trying to improve position.



what's more annoying is when a fighter of high lvl greco roman training and is an accomplished grappler and a brown belt in jiu jitsu just covers up and makes NO ATTEMPT to improve position.

If Vera was not "mentally there" he would not have jumped straight up afterwards, he was not unconcious or even close to going out.

I don't know why you are going on about position, fights don't get stopped cause a guy is in the mount, or even because he's taking shots from the mount. The only thing that matters is that he is concious and that he's not taking too bad a beating.

A ref should be looking to let the fight go, to give the fighter every chance, not looking to stop it at the first sign of trouble.

Btw, I wanted Werdum to win, but not like this. This is what early stoppages do, they rob everyone.

 

[blanko]

If Vera was not "mentally there" he would not have jumped straight up afterwards, he was not unconcious or even close to going out.

I don't know why you are going on about position, fights don't get stopped cause a guy is in the mount, or even because he's taking shots from the mount. The only thing that matters is that he is concious and that he's not taking too bad a beating.

A ref should be looking to let the fight go, to give the fighter every chance, not looking to stop it at the first sign of trouble.

Btw, I wanted Werdum to win, but not like this. This is what early stoppages do, they rob everyone.

in intellegent defence as randy said many times is not staying still and covering up. If Vera was 'mentally there" he should have escaped or at least tried to.

 

[BeRGLeZ]

bullshit stoppage, jsut because some shots went thru you cannot stop it, and he was trying to avoid them, jsut a couple got thru it mostly hit his arms ffs

Should Silva vs Leben been stopped after the first couple of jabs? clearly Leben wasn't intellegently defending himself either

vera knew how much time ther was left and decided to ride it out isntead of trying to escape and give Werdum a big opening, he didn't get TKO'ed, he was moving all the time not going limp and had his arms up

I completely agree.

Escapes very often lead to opportunities for submissions... I thought Vera was blocking the punches rather well, and honestly was given very little time to work out of it anyway. I'm sure his corner was yelling out the time, or he at least knew how long he had left. Why shrimp away and buck (wasting energy) and risk some major hits/submissions when you can ride it out and minimise risk AND injury. He was FINE.

 

[stu3ufc**]

I agree. He wasn't hurt, but he didn't do anything to prevent the fight from being stopped. It was his own fault.

spot on--it was a really good fight before the call---but werdum was dominating--he held his own standing--and took vera down at will

werdum wud of won it imo

 

[hayliks]

The stoppage was correct, anybody who thinks otherwise is just plain ignorant. Was Vera rocked? Probably not, but that's a moot point, he took several blows without trying to escape, moving around while mounted with your hands up is NOT intelligently defending yourself. IF he tried to shrimp out and regain guard I 100% guarantee the fight would have continued. Stop bitching about how Vera was fine, dumb stoppage, blah blah. Vera lost fair and square, he has nobody else to blame than himself.