BJ Penn and Randy Couture Overrated?

Torrid said:
Randy? Maybe. Depends how you view him.

Penn? No way. Guy fought everywhere, every weight, everyone; just fought a little too long.
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yes, to put his career in context, bj fought for 8 years during which he achieved a 15-5-1 record with no unavenged losses in his real weight class.

in his later career he wasted valuable time floating from LW to WW to LW to FW. he needed to just commit to fighting where he belonged. but that's what made penn great--he was willing to fight anyone.

randy did well in several big fights, but was never consistently dominant. in his day he was solid, though. i wouldn't say he's terribly overrated--he's never in p4p best discussions.
 
Randy yeah, BJ yeah but to a much lesser degree. It's mostly his ardent nuthuggers that are doing the overrating so it's not so bad.

They were both second generation champions, products of their time. They'd get wrecked now-now because they both got whuppins' by the third generation and we're heading into the fourth. It's just a matter of seeing them in proper historical perspective.
 
I agree both are very overated.

That said, both were great fighters... just not on the level the UFC hype machine puts them.
 
Prince Nephilim said:
Great for their time. Just like Fedor was great for his time, now he wouldn't even be top 5.

...and in the future, fighters of today will be overshadowed by future talent. In the evolution of combat, fighters will keep becoming even more well-rounded.

Time, how does it work?!
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Fedor wouldn't even be top 5 in his prime yet a past prime Andrei Arlovski and Mark Hunt are/or were recently cracking the top5? Hahha
 
Great for their time. Just like Fedor was great for his time, now he wouldn't even be top 5.
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Lol what a joke. I suppose a few weeks ago you thought Cain was a god too? Just look how Fedor moved, his power, technique. Maybe if one day you simply threw him against someone from the future, he would get beat. But time to prepare, He's top 5.
 
So are you saying, for example ... someone who fought 30 times, and lost 10 of those times to the champion of their division in razor-thin split-decision losses ... is worse than someone who fought 30 times and never lost, with all 30 wins being razor-thin split decisions against top 15-20 opponents ?

fuck outta here
 
Randy was gifted 2 Title Shots coming off losses also he is the biggest Asshole I've ever met in the sport.

Fuck him, his couch and the poor horse he rode in here on!!!!
 
Randy's overrated for sure; he was lhw/hw champ when most of the best fighters in those divisions weren't in the UFC. He was a 'master game planner' but that master game plan was always dirty boxing and grinding out td's. Very good don't get me wrong, but he was circumstantially fortunate.

BJ on the other hand proved he was the best at 155 by killing gomi, avenging the Pulver loss and going on a great run whilst also beating arguably the best ww ever (2nd imo) for the belt in a higher weight class. He was a pioneer who bridged the gap between the true martial artists and the new wave of well rounded complete fighters.
 
ForbiddenSun said:
Fighting is about winning.
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False.


ForbiddenSun said:
So putting your objective hat on, can you REALLY consider a fighter an all time great if they couldn't even win 60% of their fights (6 out of 10)?
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Handing the objective hat back to you and casting my eyes to the top of your head...How can you sum up a career like BJ's with a single number?

If you don't mind my asking, how old are you? Have you ever participated in an individual combative sport? If so, did you feel that it benefited you in any way regardless of the W or L?
 
Couture was on trt when everybody was roided out of their minds so it didnt really gave him any advantage. Both Randy and BJ are far from Anderson, Jbj or Gsp level but they are legends of mma and they are far from overrated.
 
Reach4theSky said:
Yep, and it's just going to get worse and worse as the years go on.
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Yup, and it's funny how people always seem to think that whoever the fighters are right NOW are always the "best ever".

LOL at prime Couture, BJ, and Fedor getting destroyed by top fighters today.
 
Over rated I don't think so specially Randy I don't see many people in claiming can beat this or that.

I think Overated fighters are the long reigning Champs because of the tremendous fan base and hype machine behind them.

1.Fedor,A.Silva, GSP,CAIN,BIG NOG, they have been overrated by MMA writers fans and the like


is normal.

I would not say Randy Couture is over rated but his dirty boxing has been over hyped by Rogaine and other commentators claiming that only Randy has that Clinch game.
 
They're both excellent fighters and legends of the sport. Fought all comers big and small, won titles in 2 divisions and challenged themselves against the best.

If you sit down and watch all their fights, you learn that they aren't overrated. They're awesome and had ups and downs. Not GOAT contenders but legendary fighters - which is exactly where people rate them, generally - so no, not overrated.
 
SirKratos said:
Both would get destroyed by current top fighters of their divisions.So yes,kinda

But depends on how you "rate" them really. I mean if the majority considers BJ top10 GOAT,yes he is heavily overrated
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based on that logic in the top line, every past fighter ever is overrated

the reality is you need to judge people for how well they did in their environment
 
They're both great. Have spotty records because few fight 20-50 pounds above their weight class AND STILL have belts in 2 divisions. Those who do take on all comers are generally sideshows like Minowa.
 
Randy fought at an age when everyone is coming out of their prime.

He won multiple titles and beat huge names.

Couture is the furthest thing from overrated. What he did at his age is almost unheard of.
 
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