Beyond 5/3/1 - Jim Wendler

KidAlchemy said:
To me this sounds like a person does all of his 4 main exercises per week for the 5's, 3's and 531 weeks and after the 531 weeks he jumps right in another 5's week and then 3's and lastly 531 week before deloading for a week then repeating it again.
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I can answer both your questions.

1. You can set up a two day split in two ways - a 4 day split spread over two weeks, or combine days.
Option A:
Monday Squat
Thursday Bench
Monday Deadlift
Thursday Press

Each cycle takes 6 weeks.

Option B
Monday Squat/Bench
Thursday Deadlift Press

Each cycle takes 3 weeks.

I've done both while training MMA. Option B is pretty good if you do any form of BBB - main sets, BBB, rows or chins, go home. Option A is slower but lets you do more assistance per day. Try both.

2. The 6 week cycle looks like this:
Week 1 3x5
Week 2 3x3
Week 3 5/3/1
->Increase Training Max
Week 4 3x5
Week 5 3x3
Week 6 5/3/1
Week 7 deload

Very popular setup. He also gives you new deload options, if you like your delaods to be intense but lower volume.

There is a LOT of stuff in this book. I did some rough maths and if you tried all the challenges, every permutation of BBB and all the splits once each you'd be running 5/3/1 for 6 years and 8 months :eek:
 
Obscure Terror said:
17. Advanced 5/3/1
It's for advanced lifters, it's not an advanced routine. Based on Prilepin.
Week 1: 5x5 @ 75%
Week 2: 5x3 @ 85%
Week 3: 5x1 @ 95%
Week 4: Optional deload
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...and it all comes back to John Christy.
 
jrams said:
Is this actual GVT or just simply 10 sets of 10 any way you can?
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Wendler says he doesn't mind if you use one weight for all 10 sets or if you want to change the weights as you go. I'm not up on GVT that much and it's a short part of this book, only a page.
 
Obscure Terror said:
2. The 6 week cycle looks like this:
Week 1 3x5
Week 2 3x3
Week 3 5/3/1
->Increase Training Max
Week 4 3x5
Week 5 3x3
Week 6 5/3/1
Week 7 deload

Very popular setup. He also gives you new deload options, if you like your delaods to be intense but lower volume.
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This is what I was going for. I've never heard of anything like this so the idea kinda blew me away. Thanks for the explanation!
 
KidAlchemy said:
So you perform 2 main exercises per week if not possible BBB sets aren't accounted for. Like week 1: Squat day and bench day week 2: deadlift day and OHP day?
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I usually did two main exercises per day. Looked something like this:

Day one:
Squat 5/3/1
Bench 5/3/1
GHR
DB Bench
Ab wheel


Day two:
Deadlift 5/3/1
OHP 5/3/1
Farmer's walk
DB press
Ab pull downs

5/3/1 progression was simply
Week 1: 5x3
Week 2: 3x3
Week 3: 5,3,1
Week 4: Increase weight, 5x3
Week 5: 3x3
Week 6: 5,3,1
Week 7: Increase weight, 5x3
et cetera
 
TheeFaulted said:
I usually did two main exercises per day. Looked something like this:

Day one:
Squat 5/3/1
Bench 5/3/1
GHR
DB Bench
Ab wheel


Day two:
Deadlift 5/3/1
OHP 5/3/1
Farmer's walk
DB press
Ab pull downs

5/3/1 progression was simply
Week 1: 5x3
Week 2: 3x3
Week 3: 5,3,1
Week 4: Increase weight, 5x3
Week 5: 3x3
Week 6: 5,3,1
Week 7: Increase weight, 5x3
et cetera
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This is also an interesting idea. Did you do some other sport at the same time as you lifted?
 
Nope. There's really not enough volume on 2x/week to necessitate a deload.
 
Obscure Terror said:
8. 5/3/1 Rule of 10
Get 10 reps on your PR set however you can. Singles, triples, whatever.


That's it for part 1. Will put the rest in later.
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Thanks for posting.

I really like this rule of 10 thing.
 
I'd like to sum this all up by saying, you can find all of the information in this book on most forums or T-nation articles with time, or hit upon the ideas he gives out by just studying strength training in general and applying different periodization principles and ideas from other programmes and bodybuilding for assistance work.

However, paying $25 to get it all in one place is well worth it - I knew most of this stuff and had contemplated a lot of the ideas from reading lots of programming books, and a couple things were new. But if you're more bothered about lifting and not studying then by all means buy this book. But it's pointless if you haven't read and internalised 5/3/1 fully first.

The main thing he hammers home is starting light and picking for your training max 90% of a number that you can hit on a bad day, sick, with DOMS and hungover. Then smashing rep PR's. This is the best thing about 5/3/1, pushing those reps. Reps make you stronger, singles don't in my opinion.

Also there is very little "NOV" talk or motivational life coaching type stuff, it's more training. He does have a pop at people who have criticised his power clean advice and there are many digs at Crossfit, but nowhere near as opinionated as the original book. Certainly isn't a section on how to incorporate 5/3/1 into Crossfit like there was in the first book. Probably because 5 years have passed and the evidence of Crossfit's inefficacy and stupidity have mounted in that time.

I may or may not use the stuff in here. The Boring But Big options are nice but the original 5x10 still rocks my boat. The reverse pyramid is probably what I'll institute when I do 5/3/1 again. Not bothered about Joker sets or the challenges so much.
 
I just spoke to Jim on Facebook. While he has many talents, a comprehensive knowledge of Comic Books is not one of them. Since I am the Uber Nerd, I considered it my responsibility to educate him. I pointed out that Joker Sets is a terrible name for a good idea; the Joker doesn't even Lift, bro.:icon_lol:

Jim agreed, and renamed the concept, "Bane Sets." So from next week, I shall be running 5/3/1: the Bane Template.:icon_twis
 
I quite liked this book. Even if you don't end up using much from the book itself it has a lot of good ideas that I think are good to think about if you enjoy lifting. Lots of variety that all still follow the original principles behind 5/3/1.

I'm running the version of the Full Body Template he has in it as well as adding in Joker/Bane sets after the main lifts. It's the right time to do more reps of the big lifts, be reminded about starting light and to build up my strength again slowly.
 
Hybrid_Killer said:
I quite liked this book. Even if you don't end up using much from the book itself it has a lot of good ideas that I think are good to think about if you enjoy lifting. Lots of variety that all still follow the original principles behind 5/3/1.

I'm running the version of the Full Body Template he has in it as well as adding in Joker/Bane sets after the main lifts. It's the right time to do more reps of the big lifts, be reminded about starting light and to build up my strength again slowly.
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I think Bane Sets are an excellent idea. The only thing I don't like about them is that on the 5/3/1 week I'd be doing Bane Sets of Singles, and I'm not a fan of Singles. I may tweak the program slightly and do Doubles instead.
 
KnightTemplar said:
I just spoke to Jim on Facebook. While he has many talents, a comprehensive knowledge of Comic Books is not one of them. Since I am the Uber Nerd, I considered it my responsibility to educate him. I pointed out that Joker Sets is a terrible name for a good idea; the Joker doesn't even Lift, bro.:icon_lol:

Jim agreed, and renamed the concept, "Bane Sets." So from next week, I shall be running 5/3/1: the Bane Template.:icon_twis
Click to expand...

You didn't mention him about Batman Beyond: 5/3/1? :D

Lol, just thought Jim telling Bruce that Terry should do BBB squats more.
 
KidAlchemy said:
You didn't mention him about Batman Beyond: 5/3/1? :D

Lol, just thought Jim telling Bruce that Terry should do BBB squats more.
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Shit, I wish I'd thought of that!:icon_lol:

Nice Joker av, by the way.:icon_chee
 
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