Applying "old school" Boxing to Muay Thai

[Bay Area]

Here is a radical idea TS. Why not drop all the "old school boxing" nonsense and learn to fight like they do in Thai Land. You know... Muay Thai?

 

[SaiWa]

And also, TS is talking about adaption and learning from concepts of old school boxing to help his muay thai game, not "i'm going to fight muay thai in old school boxing way" like more than a few people here misunderstood. So at least don't discourage the guy. Whether or not it works it will entirely up to him. It had been working for me and Discipulus so far, so why not let the guy have his attempt?

working for you? you've been non-Thai-Chi sparring MT with someone? vid please... let's see it...

 

[cuality]

yeah I meant to say if your too bladed... because you cant turn your leg in time... and being bladed is a consequence of having your weight on the back foot (altho you can still be square like a regular MT stance)

 

[Polarity]

And this is related to the topic at hand because.....? English isn't my strong suit, but to use it as a sort of an ad hominem attack is a very low move.

Perhaps multi-quoting isn't mine.

 

[Nuclearlandmine]

working for you? you've been non-Thai-Chi sparring MT with someone? vid please... let's see it...

Why should I? Baiting for shit storm? All you need to know is that it works for me when kicks, knee and clinch come to play.
Of course, feel free to "assess" that i'm scared to show it because i got beat senselessly.

Perhaps multi-quoting isn't mine.

Or....you are trying to artifically boost up your post count.

 

[sourdiesel209]

working for you? you've been non-Thai-Chi sparring MT with someone? vid please... let's see it...

of course he has been sparring heavily!! but Im afraid all those videos of epic sparrings are only for the joy of "Sinister and his group" tho... so we'll have to take Nuke's word for it

 

[sourdiesel209]

Why should I? Baiting for shit storm? All you need to know is that it works for me when kicks, knee and clinch come to play.
Of course, feel free to "assess" that i'm scared to show it because i got beat senselessly.



Or....you are trying to artifically boost up your post count.

sorry but your last public sparring session you got your legs kicked the crap out of... so doubt that its working that good in a muay thai setting ....

 

[Discipulus]

(For me) lost all credibility after that but I guess your fingers got some good exercise , so i guess this post wasn't a complete wash.

Please explain how their level of experience has anything to do with the general principles at work in that fight. I understand that experienced fighters don't do the same things as inexperienced fighters. What you guys don't seem to realize is that experienced fighters don't make the same mistakes as inexperienced ones. I can't think of anyone whose style totally changed once they reached some imaginary benchmark of experience.

oh boy , you guys have got to start sparring with some high calibre people , some of the things you are suggesting are only setting you up to get knocked the fuck out ,

if your lead hand is at the centre line of your opponent , so is your lead leg , might as well kiss it good bye

yes a good established jab is very important, but you dont see it as much in mauy thai fighting because of the range , i will eat your jab just for the opportunity to kick you as hard as i can , in the legs or the head

I'm sorry, peanut, but you come off here like you don't know what you're talking about. To propose that the jab is useless in Muay Thai is a bit silly. Also, for the lead leg/hand to be directed at the opponent's center you needn't be completely bladed. Rather, I'm advocating that you face your opponent, and use those lead weapons (the fastest ones) to threaten him and protect your face, and your space. Surely this is something you understand as a TKD guy, using quick lead leg attacks to keep the guy from taking the initiative.

start sparring guys who are out to hurt you and you will see why the muay thai guys fight the way they do and arent trying to reninevt the wheel , that is the only way you will realize that the same stuff in boxing may or may not apply to the kicking game

Nuke already pointed it out, but I'll reiterate: No one is saying that you can stand in a classical boxing crouch and never kick and do well in Muay Thai. But the principles can be adapted and applied, such as in the Vicharnnoi fight. Speaking of which...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?featur... it...[/QUOTE] Let's see your videos, man.

 

[Discipulus]

sorry but your last public sparring session you got your legs kicked the crap out of... so doubt that its working that good in a muay thai setting ....

And your last public sparring session you fought someone who knew even less about boxing than you do. And where were the leg kicks?

 

[sourdiesel209]

And your last public sparring session you fought someone who knew even less about boxing than you do. And where were the leg kicks?

at least im not claiming I got hidden videos of me sparring like Mayweather, but with kicks, knees and the clinch lol... also that dude wasnt THAT much of a noob, he had a few months boxing training, at least he came forward and tried to fight...

and where are your sparring videos? I must have missed them.. you got a camera right? lotsa blogs and hitting the bag videos, but... do you even sparr bro?

 

[peanut66]

to "disipulus " and to "nuke"

again you both have missed my entire point and have added a barrage of points of your own ,

that guy fought that way in the mauy thai video because of the way he was trained in muay thai , not old school boxing principles ,, instead of posting pictures of old style stances , why dont you watch them in a fight , and you will see very quickly that old school guys would not last minutes in the ring with any muay thai guy of the same era .. if you are going to talk about pioneers and old school boxers , at least mention sugar ray leonard or marvin hagler .those are the guys that floyd jr and bernard hopkins resemble the most in my eyes ..

im done debating , have at it guys

 

[jensen34]

I've tried out some of it, not extensively, but I've tried using more boxing/bladed stances in MT and I've found it simply isn't worth the damage you take from kicks.

Hands low newbie? You are begging to get kicked in the head. Bladed stance? Enjoy walking funny for a day or two. If you get to a level where you can really read kicks well it might give some advantages, but it's very situational.

IMO there is no one perfect stance, there are many stances and each one is perfect for a given situation. Don't get so hung up on trying to fit square pegs into round holes. Be like water and shit like that.

 

[Discipulus]

at least im not claiming I got hidden videos of me sparring like Mayweather, but with kicks, knees and the clinch lol... also that dude wasnt THAT much of a noob, he had a few months boxing training, at least he came forward and tried to fight...

and where are your sparring videos? I must have missed them.. you got a camera right? lotsa blogs and hitting the bag videos, but... do you even sparr bro?

I'm not over here instigating and calling people out. You're being asked to step up because you're constantly asking it of others. I'm only pointing out your hypocrisy.

to "disipulus " and to "nuke"

again you both have missed my entire point and have added a barrage of points of your own ,

I don't think I missed your points, man. I just disagreed with them.

that guy fought that way in the mauy thai video because of the way he was trained in muay thai , not old school boxing principles ,, instead of posting pictures of old style stances , why dont you watch them in a fight , and you will see very quickly that old school guys would not last minutes in the ring with any muay thai guy of the same era .. if you are going to talk about pioneers and old school boxers , at least mention sugar ray leonard or marvin hagler .those are the guys that floyd jr and bernard hopkins resemble the most in my eyes ..

im done debating , have at it guys[/QUOTE]

Of course the old school guys would lose against contemporary Thais--they were boxers, not kickboxers. You don't seem to understand the point of this thread, or of my response. I don't think that you should go into a Thai fight expecting to fight like a boxer. You have to learn to adapt those things.

And I just posted a video, not a picture, of an "old style" nakmuay in a fight. Yes, that is the way he has trained in Muay Thai, not boxing. I didn't post that to suggest that Vicharnnoi learned from boxers. I posted that to prove that the same principles apply across the board. I am of the opinion that there are correct and incorrect principles of fighting, and that Vicharnnoi was displaying lots of correct principles in that fight--the same correct principles displayed in Jim Corbett's stance, thus my reason for posting his photograph.

Why are you done debating, peanut? This is interesting stuff.

 

[Discipulus]

I've tried out some of it, not extensively, but I've tried using more boxing/bladed stances in MT and I've found it simply isn't worth the damage you take from kicks.

Hands low newbie? You are begging to get kicked in the head. Bladed stance? Enjoy walking funny for a day or two. If you get to a level where you can really read kicks well it might give some advantages, but it's very situational.

IMO there is no one perfect stance, there are many stances and each one is perfect for a given situation. Don't get so hung up on trying to fit square pegs into round holes. Be like water and shit like that.

If all that you take away from this long-standing discussion is that boxing = bladed and Muay Thai = square, then you've missed a lot.

 

[sourdiesel209]

I'm not over here instigating and calling people out. You're being asked to step up because you're constantly asking it of others. I'm only pointing out your hypocrisy.

lol wut?? Nuke was the one claiming the old school stance was being used effectively by him with knees and kicks involved... but he wont show the supposed videos of that... I was merely stating that in his last sparring he showed the opposite... so its unlikely hes telling the whole truth

 

[SaiWa]

Let's see your videos, man.

i am sorry but could you find my post where i stated i do MT sparring using old school boxing successful? when you find that, i'll post up a vid of myself sparring MT. i assure u, it won't be pretty.. just like most of Nuke's vids but i'll at least have my hands up...

 

[jensen34]

If all that you take away from this long-standing discussion is that boxing = bladed and Muay Thai = square, then you've missed a lot.

Not everyone needs a read/write a novel to get a point across.

 

[peanut66]

to "disipulus"

do you agree that what works in boxing may or may not work in muay thai , or any other kicking martial arts ,,

and that the "old school stance " is just a stance , there is a whole offensive and defensive game that comes with that type of stance , and if a person doesnt implement them the stance puts them at a disadvantage

how come i can come from a tkd background and see that not everything in tkd is applicable in boxing , muay thai ,mma .. some things are and transfer over quite well , but others put me at a disadvantage and are not really relevant



those are my points , nothing to do with boxing

and you guys still never mention sugar ray leonard

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=

 

[Discipulus]

lol wut?? Nuke was the one claiming the old school stance was being used effectively by him with knees and kicks involved... but he wont show the supposed videos of that... I was merely stating that in his last sparring he showed the opposite... so its unlikely hes telling the whole truth

It is truly baffling why he wouldn't want to post his sparring videos publicly. After all, his progress has been met with nothing but support on this forum. Focus on improving your own skills, man. Trust me, he's doing his homework.

i am sorry but could you find my post where i stated i do MT sparring using old school boxing successful? when you find that, i'll post up a vid of myself sparring MT. i assure u, it won't be pretty.. just like most of Nuke's vids but i'll at least have my hands up...

You must have learned from the masters.

Not everyone needs a read/write a novel to get a point across.

Not everyone can read, apparently.

to "disipulus"

do you agree that what works in boxing may or may not work in muay thai , or any other kicking martial arts ,,

and that the "old school stance " is just a stance , there is a whole offensive and defensive game that comes with that type of stance , and if a person doesnt implement them the stance puts them at a disadvantage

how come i can come from a tkd background and see that not everything in tkd is applicable in boxing , muay thai ,mma .. some things are and transfer over quite well , but others put me at a disadvantage and are not really relevant



those are my points , nothing to do with boxing

and you guys still never mention sugar ray leonard

I completely agree with you, actually. I think we're not quite communicating effectively. Just as you would probably agree that you could utilize some things from your TKD background in Muay Thai that other Thai fighters wouldn't generally use, I think that boxing principles can and have been applied successfully in Muay Thai with adaptation.

Like I said, you can't go into a Thai fight and just pretend to be Jack Johnson. I like Jack's style, but I use my teep and low kicks a lot. And I like to play around in the clinch with throws and knees and elbows. There are just some things that Jack did that I try to do too.

And I'm not sure why you're so fixated on Leonard. :icon_chee

 

[peanut66]

im not fixated on sugar ray , its just you guys use floyd jr and bernard hopkins and roy jones jr correlation to those old stiff guys , where personally i see sugar ray as their template ,, and you guys never give him his props