Antônio Rodrigo Nogueira or Daniel Cormier - Who do you rank higher in the GOAT rankings?

[HHJ]

DC finished his career at 22-3

At one point Nog was 31-4 holding the UFC Interim Belt and his only losses were X2 to Fedor and split decisions to Hendo and Barnett that he decisively avenged.

Also other than the losses to Fedor,no one could beat Nog for like 5 or 6 yrs.

 

[cmw43]

Way longer? DC was top 10 from 2011-2020. It's like 1-3 years max longer for Nog who's something like 1999-2011ish if I recall.

Way more fights yes, years no. And Nog was much younger too.

More importantly, unlike Nog DC never lost his way out of the top 10. He retired while ranked #1 after the Stipe trilogy. He could've easily stuck around for a few more years in the top 10, he just quit once he could no longer be champ.

DC left because his back was wrecked after the surgery he had.


According to Cormier, that surgery should have seen the end of his career, and in his mind, he was never the same competitor again. “When I had that back surgery in 2018 after Derrick Lewis it was over,” Cormier said, speaking on the DC & Helwani show (H/T Cole Shelton). “Like I mean, it was absolutely over.

 

[DatSamboKid]

If we’re focusing solely on the heavyweight division, I'd lean towards Big Nog, but considering their overall careers, I voted for Cormier.

Big Nog is definitely undervalued in pound-for-pound discussions despite a legendary Pride career, but his 5-6 UFC stint is hard to ignore.

Cormier's losses were only to Jones and Stipe. Becoming a double champion by knocking Stipe out in the first round cemented his status as a GOAT.

 

[moreorless87]

I think Nog had a better resume personally, he has wins over the following in their prime or at least before they had seriously dropped off...

Crocop
Barnett
Herring x2
Sergei
Werdum
Sylvia
Semmy
Coleman
Hendo
etc

From his debut until the loss to Mir, a period of almost a decade he only lost to the GOAT HW and close/high questionable decisions to Barnett and Hendo which he avenged. If Fedor doesnt exist I think Nog is likely the GOAT HW.

He stayed on waaaaaaay last his prime but I think the way he remained credible when such a shadow of himself physically shows you how good he was.

 

[BFoe]

If we’re focusing solely on the heavyweight division, I'd lean towards Big Nog, but considering their overall careers, I voted for Cormier.

Big Nog is definitely undervalued in pound-for-pound discussions despite a legendary Pride career, but his 5-6 UFC stint is hard to ignore.

Cormier's losses were only to Jones and Stipe. Becoming a double champion by knocking Stipe out in the first round cemented his status as a GOAT.

I agree. Nog definitely ranks higher at HW (either #2 or #3), while I have DC in my top 10 all time.

 

[mkt]

If we’re focusing solely on the heavyweight division, I'd lean towards Big Nog, but considering their overall careers, I voted for Cormier.

Big Nog is definitely undervalued in pound-for-pound discussions despite a legendary Pride career, but his 5-6 UFC stint is hard to ignore.

Cormier's losses were only to Jones and Stipe. Becoming a double champion by knocking Stipe out in the first round cemented his status as a GOAT.

And wins over Stipe, Bigfoot, Barnett, Rumble X 2, Gustaffson, Mir...all of them in their primes or at least twilights of their primes. I have a hard time seeing Big Nog having better wins. I won't list Anderson Silva or Hendo since both were past their best days, but if I was just throwing names out there, I could.

 

[mkt]

I think Nog had a better resume personally, he has wins over the following in their prime or at least before they had seriously dropped off...

Crocop
Barnett
Herring x2
Sergei
Werdum
Sylvia
Semmy
Coleman
Hendo
etc

From his debut until the loss to Mir, a period of almost a decade he only lost to the GOAT HW and close/high questionable decisions to Barnett and Hendo which he avenged. If Fedor doesnt exist I think Nog is likely the GOAT HW.

He stayed on waaaaaaay last his prime but I think the way he remained credible when such a shadow of himself physically shows you how good he was.

Coleman was over 40 and left the UFC years before that on a 3-loss streak. And his skillset never really evolved after 1997. It's a myth he was a great HW wrestler by the mid-2000s.

 

[RemyR]

Shit this is a good one. Probably DC overall though

 

[EndlessCritic]

Nog was an incredibly good hw with a long prime. He adjusted his game as he got older to substitute punching power for athleticism. He probably doesn’t have as good of a signature win as Stipe though.

I'd say Nog's prime was over by the time he fought in the UFC.

The nog that fought Kharitonov in 2004 imo was prime.

 

[markg171]

DC left because his back was wrecked after the surgery he had.


According to Cormier, that surgery should have seen the end of his career, and in his mind, he was never the same competitor again. “When I had that back surgery in 2018 after Derrick Lewis it was over,” Cormier said, speaking on the DC & Helwani show (H/T Cole Shelton). “Like I mean, it was absolutely over.

What does that have anything to do with whether or not he could've still been top 10 for a few more years when he retired in 2020 ranked #1 after 2 competitive losses to champ Stipe?

DC not being the same =/= he wasn't still better than a lot of fighters.

 

[HHJ]

Coleman was over 40 and left the UFC years before that on a 3-loss streak. And his skillset never really evolved after 1997. It's a myth he was a great HW wrestler by the mid-2000s.

Doesnt matter. He won the GP and he was the guy for Nog to fight. Nog was of the emerging new breed and ushered in the coming era.

 

[Sweater of AV]

Nog

 

[BrucieBaby]

One is an Olympian the other thought a bus was a horse.

 

[HavokHarmon]

I wonder how DCs career would look if he hadn’t been so concerned about keeping a spot at the table for Cain at hw and never made the drop to LHW.

 

[ultra321]

both are legends... would have to favor DC slightly...

 

[markg171]

I wonder how DCs career would look if he hadn’t been so concerned about keeping a spot at the table for Cain at hw and never made the drop to LHW.

It would look a lot worse considering he'd have taken his first loss not from Jon Jones but from any one or more of Cain, JDS, Werdum, Overeem, Stipe, etc. He was at the point of having to face big and athletic HWs, not the previous ones he'd been used to of big but unathletic and/or fat. He was going to take a loss(es) the way he was looking. Those guys would punish him for the awkward flying kicks he was attempting against the Mirs and Nelsons of the world, not just looking perplexed at this fat uncoordinated fuck.

Moving down to LHW's the only reason he ever went anywhere. And that was also only because the UFC oddly decided to strip Jon over their fake Athletic Policy when he crashed his car. And then further oddly gave DC the title shot, despite coming off a title loss and despite Ryan Bader being the #2 contender.

And if he'd never moved down he'd obviously never get the chance to move back up and become double champ. Maybe he wins the HW belt at some point sure, but would never have the double champ status if he never became LHW champ first.

DC owes his entire career to moving down, and being a right place right time kinda guy.

 

[Clark Rogers]

Well we are talking about strictly MMA where you can get knocked the fuck out. So it should not play into this discussion, as great as what he did is.

Part of me agrees, but we're talking GOAT-greatness, and it's all tied up together to some extent, threat of knockout or not (btw, you can get KTFO on the mat, seen more than a few, but usually from a bad landing).

His international wrestling success has direct influence on everything after, same as Nog's judo, boxing, and bjj. Neither of them are what they are without those backgrounds, so it's hard for me to exclude them.

 

[HHJ]

Part of me agrees, but we're talking GOAT-greatness, and it's all tied up together to some extent, threat of knockout or not (btw, you can get KTFO on the mat, seen more than a few, but usually from a bad landing).

His international wrestling success has direct influence on everything after, same as Nog's judo, boxing, and bjj. Neither of them are what they are without those backgrounds, so it's hard for me to exclude them.

I mean of course we cant help but use it to hold him in such high esteem. Thats why I dont care so much about GOAT stuff overall. They both should absolutley be celebrated.

 

[FrankDux]

Nog.

 

[HHJ]

I wonder how DCs career would look if he hadn’t been so concerned about keeping a spot at the table for Cain at hw and never made the drop to LHW.

Got to think DC would be exceptional in all he does.