"Alexa Grasso boxing is too good"

[ComfortablyNumb55]

It honestly looked like a fix, but this thread still delivers lol.

 

[Luvhawky]

She landed more significant strikes at a higher percentage in every single round. People just assume Valentina was losing because they're not used to seeing her opponents be competitive.

Alexa won round 1 and lost 2 and 3. While she wasn't winning the fight, finishing the 4th on Valentina's back would have made it 2-2 going into the fifth.

 

[Eric Silva 2.0]

She landed more significant strikes at a higher percentage in every single round. People just assume Valentina was losing because they're not used to seeing her opponents be competitive.

Those stats don't really tell the story and I don't believe they're accurate. I'm starting to rewatch the fight and just finished round 1. Grasso landed more significant strikes, had a couple that really rung Valentina's bell. Valentina was wobbly for a few seconds there. Grasso easily won that round.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

Or as some people call it "wrestled," because she also wrestles people in this thing we call MMA, and Alexa's not the first person she wrestled. Alexa's boxing was apparently not good enough for Val
Also, Val was doing just fine in the standup, and still arguably winning. AND Alexa's boxing didn't win the match.

Don't pull revisionist bullshit. None of it applies here.

I agree that Val did not resort to wrestling out of panic. Wrestling's a big part of her game.

But Grasso was giving Val problems with her boxing, which is how she won the first. But yeah, Grasso's boxing did not win her the match. So on balance, I mostly agree, though I think you are overly discounting the success Grasso was having with her hands.

 

[Mohawk Banditó]

Those stats don't really tell the story and I don't believe they're accurate. I'm starting to rewatch the fight and just finished round 1. Grasso landed more significant strikes, had a couple that really rung Valentina's bell. Valentina was wobbly for a few seconds there. Grasso easily won that round.

I don't think anyone disputes round 1. I was playing the role of "background expert" when watching live with a friend, so I was going over Val's extensive striking credentials at the time, so I don't know if I was just mentally overscoring her technique and diversity over the effective meat and potatoes approach in round 2, 3, and 4, but there's no arguing that Val was winning from round 2 to the back take in round 4.

So my argument is that Alexa's boxing, though sharp enough to win her the first and keep her competetive throughout and even arguably ahead in the stand-up, it wasn't winning her the fight cuz she was losing and didn't win her the fight, cuz it's not like Val was forced to an outside range from the boxing, (she was actually too close to throw what she did), so Alexa's boxing wasn't "too much" for Val and her grappling won her the fight

 

[drbolony]

Valentina was always a wrestler. All of her finishes besides the Eye KO came either from submissions or ground and pound, and she's had takedowns in all but one of her fights (including two fights with 5 TDs and one with 7).

That's always been Valentina's gameplan - stand while it's sensible, then take the opponent down and finish them. Anyone who's acting like this is new must have never watched her fight.

Until an opponent didn't accept position, made her work, got her visibly tired and frustrated. Not being able to identify these things in real time shows that some people may not know as much as they think they do about fighting.

I agree that Val did not resort to wrestling out of panic. Wrestling's a big part of her game.

But Grasso was giving Val problems with her boxing, which is how she won the first. But yeah, Grasso's boxing did not win her the match. So on balance, I mostly agree, though I think you are overly discounting the success Grasso was having with her hands.

I think you're being kind. I know it sounds dismissive/derogatory to say "panic wrestle", but when someone who is known for well timed take downs and head and arm throws, starts shooting from a mile out, what else can you call it? Val was visibly frustrated in the 4th because she couldn't employ her grappling anymore.

I personally didn't think Alexa would be the one to do this to Val, maybe Blanchfield or someone like that, but I'm also not going to deny what happened.

 

[Mohawk Banditó]

I agree that Val did not resort to wrestling out of panic. Wrestling's a big part of her game.

But Grasso was giving Val problems with her boxing, which is how she won the first. But yeah, Grasso's boxing did not win her the match. So on balance, I mostly agree, though I think you are overly discounting the success Grasso was having with her hands.

I don't think I discount her boxing (see above), I'm just being very specific to the claim being made. She did excellent and I noted that no one has looked that good standing against Val in the pbp thread, and even noted before the fight in the "grasso does nothing better than Val" thread that Grasso's striking has proven to be effective and that's all she needs, but i came back to that thread after the fight to note I didn't give her that credit for her grappling, which is ultimately what did it for her

Alexa had a deserved win and a great performance, but I feel people are either discounting Vals overall effectiveness or are undercrediting Grasso's well- timed and aggressive grappling finish

 

[Eric Silva 2.0]

I don't think anyone disputes round 1. I was playing the role of "background expert" when watching live, so I was going her Val's extensive striking credentials at the time, so I don't know if I was just mentally overscoring her technique and diversity over the effective meat and potatoes approach in round 2, 3, and 4, but there's no arguing that Val was winning from round 2 to the back take in round 4.

So my argument is that Alexa's boxing, though sharp enough to win her the first and keep her competetive throughout and even arguably ahead in the stand-up, it wasn't winning her the fight cuz she was losing and didn't win her the fight, cuz it's not like Val was forced to an outside range from the boxing, (she was actually too close to throw what she did), so Alexa's boxing wasn't "too much" for Val and her grappling won her the fight

You can look at it that way and I can't argue with that. What I will say is Grasso had more effective striking on the feet. I just finished round 2 and Valentina clearly won that with dominant wrestling/grappling. One thing to note is that Val was using a lot of energy with her takedowns and Grasso is more efficient with her energy. I'll have more for you after I watch the next two rounds. It's hard for me to comment too much without watching a second time. When I watch the fights live, I watch the sport for the love of it rather than the technical/scoring aspect.

 

[Mohawk Banditó]

You can look at it that way and I can't argue with that. What I will say is Grasso had more effective striking on the feet. I just finished round 2 and Valentina clearly won that with dominant wrestling/grappling. One thing to note is that Val was using a lot of energy with her takedowns and Grasso is more efficient with her energy. I'll have more for you after I watch the next two rounds. It's hard for me to comment too much without watching a second time. When I watch the fights live, I watch the sport for the love of it rather than the technical/scoring aspect.

I definitely agree with that too. From what I remember, Val turned over to almost purely grappling to mount an effective offense for round 2. I think she opened up more to both striking and grappling for 3 and 4, but idunno anymore

I'll give you the credit here though, cuz I had said from the night of that I gotta rewatch to confidently score the striking, but still haven't

 

[Kaiokenrye24]

Valentina was always a wrestler. All of her finishes besides the Eye KO came either from submissions or ground and pound, and she's had takedowns in all but one of her fights (including two fights with 5 TDs and one with 7).

That's always been Valentina's gameplan - stand while it's sensible, then take the opponent down and finish them. Anyone who's acting like this is new must have never watched her fight.

She has a much more well known muay thai pedigree

 

[Gamer2k4]

She has a much more well known muay thai pedigree

That may be true, but my point is that her strong wrestling has been an important element in most of her fights (and all but one of her finishes). The fact that she wrestled Grasso is hardly unique or out of character for her. Even if you want to argue that she wouldn't have done it if she was more comfortable on the feet, what does it matter? Is it somehow more "honorable" or whatever to not change up your gameplan even if you'd be more successful for doing so?

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

I don't think I discount her boxing (see above), I'm just being very specific to the claim being made. She did excellent and I noted that no one has looked that good standing against Val in the pbp thread, and even noted before the fight in the "grasso does nothing better than Val" thread that Grasso's striking has proven to be effective and that's all she needs, but i came back to that thread after the fight to note I didn't give her that credit for her grappling, which is ultimately what did it for her

Alexa had a deserved win and a great performance, but I feel people are either discounting Vals overall effectiveness or are undercrediting Grasso's well- timed and aggressive grappling finish

Fair.

 

[leto1776]

To be fair she turned Valentina into a wrestler that fight

She’s taken down all of her opponents in the UFC. What was different this fight, was that Alexa had Valentina shooting for double legs, rather than going for Valentina’s trust body lock TDs

 

[Eater of Souls]

Valentina was always a wrestler. All of her finishes besides the Eye KO came either from submissions or ground and pound, and she's had takedowns in all but one of her fights (including two fights with 5 TDs and one with 7).

That's always been Valentina's gameplan - stand while it's sensible, then take the opponent down and finish them. Anyone who's acting like this is new must have never watched her fight.

Yeah. I mean, she has only taken down every opponent she had ever faced. Must be something new this fight.

 

[Post 2 Decision]

MMA gonna MMA

 

[ryun253]

Or as some people call it "wrestled," because she also wrestles people in this thing we call MMA, and Alexa's not the first person she wrestled. Alexa's boxing was apparently not good enough for Val
Also, Val was doing just fine in the standup, and still arguably winning. AND Alexa's boxing didn't win the match.

Don't pull revisionist bullshit. None of it applies here.

Forced "ThE BeSt WoMeNs StRiKeR In HiStOrY" to become a wrestler.
Forced Valentina to tap.
VSP wanted to LnP and got beat.

 

[I WILL CUT YOU]

She landed more significant strikes at a higher percentage in every single round. People just assume Valentina was losing because they're not used to seeing her opponents be competitive.

We don't just count strikes lol, plus how many of those were on the ground?

 

[Dreyga Hates You Sherbums]

MMA gonna MMA

Thanks for being a good sport.

 

[Post 2 Decision]

Thanks for being a good sport.

I let my bets and Tap picks do the talking

Not going to get everything right

 

[mudrubble]

Until an opponent didn't accept position, made her work, got her visibly tired and frustrated. Not being able to identify these things in real time shows that some people may not know as much as they think they do about fighting.

I think you're being kind. I know it sounds dismissive/derogatory to say "panic wrestle", but when someone who is known for well timed take downs and head and arm throws, starts shooting from a mile out, what else can you call it? Val was visibly frustrated in the 4th because she couldn't employ her grappling anymore.

I personally didn't think Alexa would be the one to do this to Val, maybe Blanchfield or someone like that, but I'm also not going to deny what happened.

And I think that if the fight went into the 5th round and to decision, it VERY LIKELY would have been her boxing that got that win because Val was gassing heavy and desperate for TDs since she did not like what was developing on the feet.

And if they suddenly ruled "no more TDs" who would have been more discouraged by that? That suggests she knew the tides were turning. Val didn't want any more smoke on the feet and was getting desperate.