A Hole in Cruz's Game (Anyone Else Notice?)

[TheVenom]

Cruz's footwork and movement saves him. It's hard to predict what he's going to throw and he's quick about it. We, as fans, can see opening some after watching him for so long. It's another thing to counter him when you're face to face. He's a monster.

 

[TheCryingElite]

Yeah the whole squad went to Bang lmfao
Even Mendes, who isn't full timing it, has been training with Bang for a week or so at a time.
Cody gets Benivdez for sparring I think, but that's why I bet against him - I don't see him being experienced enough, or having a good enough camp to beat a guy who I think is theoretically one of the best fighters ever (I don't think he has the resume, but that's a matter for another thread).

I just want to congratulate you on your analyst in this thread(so far because I haven't made it all the way through, but you seem so spot on right now) I'm a big Cruz fan, and therefore it's hard for me to admit his flaws. But you have a really clear minded thought process when it comes to him, and it's really refreshing.

 

[Drake]

You'd be surprised though, if the least hit guy in MMA also happens to have a really good chin. I mean in the 3rd fight where he knocked Faber down for the first time, he sprinted full on into an up kick and he took it like it didn't affect him in the least. In fact so much so it really took the replay for me to realize he had been hit with an upkick at all.

Same here, haha.

Let's also not forget that he trains with fuckin' Jeremy Stephens on a daily basis... Harder hitter than Cody. Great guy to have in your camp for this fight.

 

[TheCryingElite]

Wow, I can't believe people are actually discussing tactics and skills in MMA on here. I didn't think we did this anymore on Sherdog and didn't think I'd get so many replies. Very nice to see lol. Thanks to everyone participating.

Yeah I was thinking the same thing. Very pleasant thread so far.

 

[ValentinG]

 

[Squintz]

For anyone else it looks sloppy and pointless but there's a method behind the madness. His mind and body is always one or two moves ahead of his opponent. That's what makes him so great. Faber is not only backing up but he's thinking ... really hard about what Dom is throwing and in the next or future exchange he's going to wonder if Dom is going to throw something similar again and he may or may not but he's thinking about what's coming next. Anytime you can get your opponent to think about what you're going to do you're already ahead.

He's technical in a lot of ways but he's also unorthodox and unpredictable in a lot of ways which makes him so good and hard to figure out.

 

[TheCryingElite]

For anyone else it looks sloppy and pointless but there's a method behind the madness. His mind and body is always one or two moves ahead of his opponent. That's what makes him so great. Faber is not only backing up but he's thinking ... really hard about what Dom is throwing and in the next or future exchange he's going to wonder if Dom is going to throw something similar again and he may or may not but he's thinking about what's coming next. Anytime you can get your opponent to think about what you're going to do you're already ahead.

He's technical in a lot of ways but he's also unorthodox and unpredictable in a lot of ways which makes him so good and hard to figure out.

Not to mention, that No Love looking confused at the way Cruz strikes, probably doesn't look favorably on his chances in the cage.

 

[dmc]

Cruz is far too intelligent for Cody...

 

[Threetrees]

they believed cruz could be caught with the head kick because of the way he circles out especially after striking.started working towards the end of the fight to when fatigue kicked in

yeah, but I was just chaining off of what you said
Early in the fght when he's bumping to T position he's safe because he's more disciplined and throws looping punches from basically where no one can ht him

Later in the fight when he's slowed a bit and he's not fully committing to those kind of hard shits and throwing from distance he's still putting his head in harms way

I THINK we're actually saying and seeing the same thing here though

 

[Threetrees]

For anyone else it looks sloppy and pointless but there's a method behind the madness. His mind and body is always one or two moves ahead of his opponent. That's what makes him so great. Faber is not only backing up but he's thinking ... really hard about what Dom is throwing and in the next or future exchange he's going to wonder if Dom is going to throw something similar again and he may or may not but he's thinking about what's coming next. Anytime you can get your opponent to think about what you're going to do you're already ahead.

He's technical in a lot of ways but he's also unorthodox and unpredictable in a lot of ways which makes him so good and hard to figure out.

Yeah, but I think that's a hole. It sounds counter intuitive, because we're taught the guy thinking multiple steps ahead is the one who will win. But I think usually when people say it they're being at least partially metaphorical, but when Cruz says it he's being 100% literal.

I think he's got his pattern planned out up to five shifts out based on a couple reads! Either he really is a super genius, which I don't think he is but whatever people get up and arms whenever I say that, or he's begging to be exposed OR more likely it's somewhere inbetween. Not many fighters in combat sports history have been able to get away with doing whatever they want in the cage without being exploited, and I've seen Cruz put himself into bad positions and get caught out of position more than a few times.

Even in the last fight, up until Cruz dropped him (with a near perfect darting "straight" to give him credit) Urijah was actually performing very well. Even later in that fight, Uriah catches him coming in (as guys do) and put him momentarily on skates. DJ was able to take advantage of Cruz literally shifting himself against the fence over and over again because he's committed to a line of attack and doesn't realize that he's close to the black lines and will dodgeball back INTO the fence with no defense at all. He even has moments where he crosses his feet in the cage! You're not supposed to do that. But no one has been able to consistently take advantage because he just has so many tools in the tool box to grab when he senses danger, and that is where I think he's actually better than everyone else.

All of the shifting and feinting and stance switching is okay, there are other fighters that are better at that - I think TJ and DJ are both better than that, but I think Cruz is the best "in between" fighter since GSP, in that all of his best moments for me come when he's in a scramble or has backed himself into a bind, or has been caught coming in - he responds well and changes the phase of the game, from distance to clinch striking, from clinch to ground, from ground to stand up etcetera. That's why I want to see him fight at 145 or fight DJ and TJ again, because these are guys who are almost as good in transition as he is. It's why Faber, despite already being in decline in the 2nd fight, could give him a tough out because Faber is a great scramble himself.

All that being said, I think where he's NOT as good as GSP is that he's not as good in anyone phase of the sport where as GSP could kickbox anyone one and purely wrestler anyone when in his prime. Cruz will lose, imo, when a guy can shut down an entire aspect of his game. It's why Jose Aldo is a bad match up, because no matter how much you bait him it's nearly impossible to take Aldo down unless your name is Chad Mendes - Franke a similair fighter to Cruz tried and we saw what happened there. But guys who fight out of phase always tend to struggle whenever they have a guy who can shut down their first line of attack AND their go to phase switching tactics. But those guys are only other champions and legit #1 contenders, and few and far between in MMA

 

[agibmxmma]

I see Cody with a counter straight left over lunging Dom, followed by right head kick or jumping right knee KO.. Possibly a counter left hook, right uppercut combo TKO.. If Dom does this sloppy shit.

 

[Fincher7]

Cody via wheelkick.

 

[The Natural Born Runner]

Dominick Cruz is the Bernard Hopkins or MMA, he shows you very little and knows your angle before he throws.

He's not this sloppy guy who is throwing those wild shots without knowing the potential consequence, he's in touch at all times with what he is doing.

Speed kills with fighters like Dom, if you're fast enough to get to him and he's faced a solid version of Faber, much lighter guys like Johnson and Benavidez as well as TJ Dillashaw who made Renan Barao look like he had boulders for feet.

Dominick is on another level.

 

[Durr T Sanchez]

Is it my imagination or did Dillashaw try to head kick him no less than 100 times? Have not seen the fight since original air date.

it was a close fight but I remember thinking TJ deserved to lose for all those stupid head kicks. He spent 3.5 rds doing that before he realized he should maybe kick Doms legs. Fucking worst game plan ever because TJ has the best chance at beating Dom...cardio, chin, footwork, speed, wrestling, and BANG muay thai. You would think BANG would've said leg kicks all day???

 

[fortheo]

Even in the last fight, up until Cruz dropped him (with a near perfect darting "straight" to give him credit) Urijah was actually performing very well. Even later in that fight, Uriah catches him coming in (as guys do) and put him momentarily on skates. DJ was able to take advantage of Cruz literally shifting himself against the fence over and over again because he's committed to a line of attack and doesn't realize that he's close to the black lines and will dodgeball back INTO the fence with no defense at all. He even has moments where he crosses his feet in the cage! You're not supposed to do that. But no one has been able to consistently take advantage because he just has so many tools in the tool box to grab when he senses danger, and that is where I think he's actually better than everyone else.


All that being said, I think where he's NOT as good as GSP is that he's not as good in anyone phase of the sport where as GSP could kickbox anyone one and purely wrestler anyone when in his prime. Cruz will lose, imo, when a guy can shut down an entire aspect of his game. It's why Jose Aldo is a bad match up, because no matter how much you bait him it's nearly impossible to take Aldo down unless your name is Chad Mendes - Franke a similair fighter to Cruz tried and we saw what happened there. But guys who fight out of phase always tend to struggle whenever they have a guy who can shut down their first line of attack AND their go to phase switching tactics. But those guys are only other champions and legit #1 contenders, and few and far between in MMA

I like your analysis, and I don't want to be that guy, but since Cruz and Edgar are some of my favourite fighters, I need to say

1.

This is not a darting straight right—he's using the crouch to get reads off of faber and also gets fabers attention on his right hand while he loads up on the left.


2. As for Frankie, I know he didn't show it in his last fight against Aldo, but he had more success wrestling Aldo in the first fight than any fighter ever has, including Mendes:

Also, while Edgar and Dom are very similar in theory—both rely on feints a lot to get reads off their opponents, both have great ankle pick takedowns and great reactive takedowns etc etc—their execution of those techniques are very different, so I wouldn't say that Edgar's lack of success against Aldo is any real indication of how Dom would do against Aldo.

 

[Threetrees]

I like your analysis, and I don't want to be that guy, but since Cruz and Edgar are some of my favourite fighters, I need to say

1.

This is not a darting straight right—he's using the crouch to get reads off of faber and also gets fabers attention on his right hand while he loads up on the left.


2. As for Frankie, I know he didn't show it in his last fight against Aldo, but he had more success wrestling Aldo in the first fight than any fighter ever has, including Mendes:

Also, while Edgar and Dom are very similar in theory—both rely on feints a lot to get reads off their opponents, both have great ankle pick takedowns and great reactive takedowns etc etc—their execution of those techniques are very different, so I wouldn't say that Edgar's lack of success against Aldo is any real indication of how Dom would do against Aldo.

I had the wrong punch in my head re: The darting right, my mistake

And I'm not using Edgar's lack of success to indicate why Cruz would lose to Aldo, I'm typing them as similar fighters (which may or may not be a mistake) and looking for types of fighters that could theoretically give them trouble

And regarding the first Aldo fight, sure - but he was still largely ineffective even in the rounds that he won, and then in the second fight we saw Aldo fight him literally the same way, with a couple tactical adjustments and completely take him apart.

Last point, I don't consider that second Edgar gif to be an actual MMA takedown

 

[fortheo]

I had the wrong punch in my head re: The darting right, my mistake

And I'm not using Edgar's lack of success to indicate why Cruz would lose to Aldo, I'm typing them as similar fighters (which may or may not be a mistake) and looking for types of fighters that could theoretically give them trouble

And regarding the first Aldo fight, sure - but he was still largely ineffective even in the rounds that he won, and then in the second fight we saw Aldo fight him literally the same way, with a couple tactical adjustments and completely take him apart.

Last point, I don't consider that second Edgar gif to be an actual MMA takedown

Ah, i was just nitpicking because I really don't think Mendes did any better wrestling Aldo than Edgar did. The Edgar fan in me had to say something lol.

 

[Threetrees]

Ah, i was just nitpicking because I really don't think Mendes did any better wrestling Aldo than Edgar did. The Edgar fan in me had to say something lol.

Yeah I get that lol, I was a little off I think - I'm rewatching Edgar/Aldo I now and I forgot how well he did in that first fight

Cruz/Edgar was always one of my dream fights

 

[discrawg]

Effective countering requires perfect timing, perfect timing (in striking) is developed through repetition of action during sparring, repetition of action is hard to achieve when specifically preparing for Dominic Cruz due to the difficulty of mimicking his vast array of unorthodox actions.

So, it is hard to counter Dominic Cruz in a fight.

 

[Squish II]

His TD timing is second to none. True. Dom & Urijah are two of the very best scramblers ever. That's why it was always fun when they went to the ground. Dom has never spent more than about a second on his back either...guy is crazy.

But with the rest if that, it's hard to say. I don't think Cody's the guy. Definitely too emotional & just too inexperienced. Dude was talking shit to Henry Briones during their fight lol.

What about TJ? Instantly got up in their fight.