A+ Athletes making better fighters is a myth

[I am your real dad]

That's all I ever hear on this site...about how A+ athletes, football and basketball players would make the best fighters...I say that's all bullshit...always has been...some of the greatest fighters in history, were not great athletes...rocky marciano, wasn't athletic...he was fairly short, had a short reach...most likely couldn't run all that fast, dunk a baskball or play football all that great...so what does that mean...Absolutely nothing...the guy still had incredible cardio, hit like a tank and had supreme heart...Being able to run fast with a leather football or being able to dunk a rubber ball in a hoop, means nothing when it comes to fighting...sports are very specific...especially fighting...

This latest football player turned mma fighter only proves this point...the guy was gassed after one round...all by a fat dude, not half as "athletic" as himself...but when it comes to fighting, running fast or whatever means nothing in a fight....you think roberto duran was a great athlete? no, but could he fight? you bet he could...

You got that right. Rocky was also a good wrestler and a bad baseball player.

 

[BearGrounds]

I don't think there has ever been what is truly considered an A-level athlete in MMA. Who?

You don't consider NCAA wrestling champs or Olympic level wrestlers A-level?

BTW...

A guy like Randleman (RIP) would outright murder a guy like Lebron.

 

[I am your real dad]

Many of the forum dont understand athleticism because theyve never played a sport or combat sport
Its very simple

better athlete with skilll > inferior athlete with skill

Thats it.
Two people with the same level of skill/ training, the one with more athleticism will win everytime

Better (A LEVEL) athletes go to big sports for more money or even education they're groomed early to do so.

The UFC used to have bus drivers and math teachers as champs.
Cormier is an Olympian and Jon Jones has 2 brothers in the NFL

this is REALLY basic

I don't know about that

 

[bubbleboyjones]

Beat the shit out of Crowder ??Huh ?When was he beating the shit out of Crowder?

Sherdog Play by play. Hardy wasn't putting a clinic on him but for a guy with the fraction of the skill level of a Pro fighter with 13 fights Hardy was giving Crowder the works. Thats exactly what being a really good athlete gets you. You can have shit skills and still do work.

ROUND 1
Hardy is landing some huge punches right away on Crowder. These are two big boys swinging hard and heavy early. Now Crowder is pushing Hardy against the fence and trying to slow down the fight. Hardy gets out of it. Hardy is throwing huge punches but Crowder is surviving. Hardy is still throwing heat. Crowder is just standing at the end of his range. Hardy lands a big knee to Crowder. Now Crowder gets a takedown. He’s holding Hardy to the ground. Now Crowder is in side control. Now Crowder has the crucifix position. Hardy is in trouble but somehow manages to escape. Crowder is just riding Hardy now and tries or a guillotine choke. But Hardy gets out of it and lands on top. Bad fight IQ by Crowder there. Hardy is on top and throwing hammerfists. Crowder is trying to get the triangle but Hardy gets out of it. Now Hardy is holding him down again. Hardy finishes the round with a couple big punches. 10-9 Hardy.

 

[Vergilius]

All else being equal, athletic ability is a plus and obviously the more the better. Just like in any other sport.

It's not that hard to understand. No one (who is serious) claims being an "A+ athlete" in and of itself is enough to be successful at the highest levels of MMA.

If you took an A+ athlete and a C-level athlete at age 13, and trained them in the exact same way, same sports, same methods, same everything...at age 25 the A+ athlete would likely be meaningfully ahead of the average athlete.

Every sport has skills components that are required to be effective in the sport. Athletic ability acts like a multiplier effect to those skills/abilities...but if you don't have them in the first place you are just multiplying by 0 (or a small number) and not getting anywhere.

Being "athletic" in one sport, doesn't mean you would do well in all other sports. Lebron is a super athlete in basketball, but he would likely have no chance to make it as a pro in road cycling, soccer, swimming or sprinting because his body type is wrong for those sports (e.g. you ideally need short legs but a long wingspan for swimming - he's only halfway there, and he's too big to climb up a mountain on a bicycle/start fast in a sprint etc.).

He's one of a kind in basketball, but that doesn't mean he would make it in mma. I'm tired of people shitting on our sport in favour of NFL/Basketball, it's like, dudes, the manliness of your heroes isn't threatened because the fat UFC champ could beat them up. They are still great at their sports.

 

[Gref]

Greg Hardy is C Level at best. Gassed midway through round 1. A poor man's Francis Ngannou. Another NFL dropout trying to make it in MMA.

 

[Chappi]

Being a fighter is a mindset, not all athletes have it or can get it.
If 2 men both have a fighters mindset, being a great athlete on top of that is better of course.

 

[xx madskillz xx]

Sherdog Play by play. Hardy wasn't putting a clinic on him but for a guy with the fraction of the skill level of a Pro fighter with 13 fights Hardy was giving Crowder the works. Thats exactly what being a really good athlete gets you. You can have shit skills and still do work.

ROUND 1
Hardy is landing some huge punches right away on Crowder. These are two big boys swinging hard and heavy early. Now Crowder is pushing Hardy against the fence and trying to slow down the fight. Hardy gets out of it. Hardy is throwing huge punches but Crowder is surviving. Hardy is still throwing heat. Crowder is just standing at the end of his range. Hardy lands a big knee to Crowder. Now Crowder gets a takedown. He’s holding Hardy to the ground. Now Crowder is in side control. Now Crowder has the crucifix position. Hardy is in trouble but somehow manages to escape. Crowder is just riding Hardy now and tries or a guillotine choke. But Hardy gets out of it and lands on top. Bad fight IQ by Crowder there. Hardy is on top and throwing hammerfists. Crowder is trying to get the triangle but Hardy gets out of it. Now Hardy is holding him down again. Hardy finishes the round with a couple big punches. 10-9 Hardy.

I watched the fight twice so I don't need to read that.lol.I know what happened in the fight and at no point was Hardy beating the shit out of Crowder like you said.

 

[TheAmericanGazelle]

Being "athletic" in one sport, doesn't mean you would do well in all other sports.

No one who is serious argues otherwise.

That's why the "all else equal" qualifier is used.

 

[phikus]

This thread got me thinking about Stephen Neal. I've always thought that it would have been interesting to see how he would have stacked up in MMA. He was a 2x NCAA wrestling National champion (defeated Brock for his last title), freestyle world champion and went on to win Super Bowls with the Patriots even though didn't play football in college. I'm not one of these guys that thinks NFL players are A+ athletes by default, but those credentials lead me to think Mr. Neal qualifies.

 

[bubbleboyjones]

Many of the forum dont understand athleticism because theyve never played a sport or combat sport
Its very simple

better athlete with skilll > inferior athlete with skill

Thats it.
Two people with the same level of skill/ training, the one with more athleticism will win everytime

Better (A LEVEL) athletes go to big sports for more money or even education they're groomed early to do so.

The UFC used to have bus drivers and math teachers as champs.
Cormier is an Olympian and Jon Jones has 2 brothers in the NFL

this is REALLY basic

This.

Take Deontay Wilder for example. He couldn’t make it in football or basketball so he starts boxing at 20, gets a medal at the Olympics 3 years later and wins the WBC title 4 years after that. The best athletes literally get filtered into traditional stick and ball sports for the most part in the U.S. This is for many reasons. If you are an exceptional athelete growing up and have some size you will be almost for sure playing a team sport at your high school. You do this for a number of reasons.

1. It give you social power at your school. You get fuck the prom queen and part of cool hierarchy at school.

2. You'll get a free ride to a major University. Again you get social power at your University, access to top women and are basically a celebrity.

3. And if you are the elite of the elite you get drafted, once again gain social power, money, women..etc.

 

[kingghidrah]

Greg Hardy is a joke. Fat slob, can punch 3 or 4 times before completely gassing and not knowing where he is, or even having the "timing" to wait until a guy has actually stood up before delivering a knee. What a joke, he'd be destroyed by anyone in the HW division with a bit of defense and cardio.

 

[ritchest_eva]

Henry and Yoel are A level athletes Olympic medalist

 

[JoeyJoeJoeJr]

Natural talent is a way bigger factor

 

[Zebo]

Greg Hardy is C Level at best. Gassed midway through round 1. A poor man's Francis Ngannou. Another NFL dropout trying to make it in MMA.

I wouldn't necessarily associate endurance with A level athleticism. If that were true every idiot who is decent in a marathon runner is a A level athlete. Pretty sure he had an adrenal dump mixed in there too. He gassed out, he is a big guy who has to cut to make HW. Seen a ton of HW vets gas out early too. Fight endurance is a whole different world than any other type of endurance. Takes years of specialized training and discipline in the octagon. Point is if you are an NFL Pro Bowler on Defense you are an elite athlete period. But that doesn't necessarily mean you are capable of becoming an elite fighter.

 

[ClipYourDirtyWings]

Absolutely not a myth, that's silly. If you took someone like Saquon Barkley and had mma be his main focus for his entire life, he'd obliterate anyone. A-Level athletes just aren't drawn to this sport because why get punched in the mouth in a cage for, best case, a million or two per fight, when they can play in the NFL or NBA for tens of millions of dollars per year and do it for way longer?

Hardy is only here because of all his baggage.

The question of whether or not an A-Level athlete with little to no training can come in and wipe out a division has been asked and answered, though.

 

[ermac88]

I don't know about thatView attachment 509347

Huh?
How is posting a picture of Check Kongo and Roy Nelson and example of that??

 

[ermac88]

Absolutely not a myth, that's silly. If you took someone like Saquon Barkley and had mma be his main focus for his entire life, he'd obliterate anyone. A-Level athletes just aren't drawn to this sport because why get punched in the mouth in a cage for, best case, a million or two per fight, when they can play in the NFL or NBA for tens of millions of dollars per year and do it for way longer?

Hardy is only here because of all his baggage.

The question of whether or not an A-Level athlete with little to no training can come in and wipe out a division has been asked and answered, though.

No one in mma is getting a million or two a fight or if they do its an anomaly
The average pay out in mma is in the thousands

 

[ClipYourDirtyWings]

No one in mma is getting a million or two a fight or if they do its an anomaly
The average pay out in mma is in the thousands

That's what I'm saying. Absolute best case like a Conor or Jones or Lesnar you're getting a million or two.

 

[fractal]

Being athletic doesn't make you a good fighter, but it certainly helps. If you can't take a punch or understand the fight game, you might as well be a F level athlete.