Elections 2020 Democratic Primary Thread v4

Who do you support most out of the remaining Democratic candidates?

  • Tom Steyer (Entrepreneur)

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I so want what you guys have here in the states man. What a relief it would be to know that not a single child in my county was going without needed health care.

Imagine walking into a gas station here and seeing the face of some precious child on a jar with a note from the parents begging for money for a procedure that they won't get otherwise.....

Also my father was a union electrician in the 1980's, a proud man who would never take charity from anyone. My mother got cancer and the treatment, even with my dad's health insurance and my mothers too, who worked for a hospital, bankrupted them. They lost everything and that while trying to hold the family together.

It was a terrible time in my life.
While we are definitely not perfect and have our own issues, it's for certain that we have a very strong and cohesive society that takes care of the working and lower class as a matter of first principle, while at the same time providing strong individual rights and good business opportunities. The US is an amazing country if you are rich, probably one of the best in the world if not the best. However, if you're not, which is the majority, it can be devastating. The lower you go the more terrible it gets. There are still a lot of good things about the US, some strong traditions of value and great people, but Imagine what a country it could be like if the people really put their mind to it. You could indeed be the greatest country in the world.
 
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You also see that three European countries still have the wealth tax. 2 out of those 3 are very prosperous and rich (Norway and Switzerland)

Most importantly, the reasons why it was a relative failure in the EU and what would be different in the US are also spelled out:




Wealth inequality is a massive problem worldwide. The left is proposing new ways to address this based on past mistakes and successes. The irrational right is saying "Nah, let's not change anything. Problems go away when you ignore them."

Do you ever get tired of being irrational?



“Only the super rich”


<Dany07>




You leftists really are gullible.


Taxing the rich won’t pay for nearly what they’re promising.
 
This so called "exodus" from Europe has no bearing on the argument of the quality of life, the power of our middle class or our overall society. Not to mention it's misrepresented. Rich people are rich here too. Listen to some facts, just comparing my own country here, but it's largely the trend with all simular countries. Just to put the propaganda in perspective:

  1. We have less poor (rank #3 of OECD countries, US ranks near near bottom at 34 https://data.oecd.org/inequality/poverty-rate.htm#indicator-chart)
  2. We have less inequality (#5 on the Gini-coifficient, US doesn't rank top 30, #1 on P90/10P, US doesn't rank top 30 ttps://data.oecd.org/inequality/income-inequality.htm - )
  3. We have less crime and much less violent deaths (5 times lower the rate of homicides https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/VC.IHR.PSRC.P5, https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26551975)
  4. We have less prisoners (#6, US ranks last with over twice the amount of number 2, and 10 times as many per capita as us)
  5. We have a longer life expectancy (81 years vs 78 years https://data.oecd.org/healthstat/life-expectancy-at-birth.htm
  6. We have less government and corporate corruption (#1, US doesn't rank top 20 https://www.transparency.org/cpi2018)
  7. We are ranked higher on forbes list as a better country to do business with (#7, US ranks #17 https://www.forbes.com/best-countries-for-business/list/#tab:overall)
  8. We have a higher freedom ranking, including free speech and human rights (#10 on the Freedom House ranking, US ranks #58 - #6 on the CATO list, US ranks #17, https://www.businessinsider.com/cou...s-worth-noting-that-the-us-was-ranked-58th-28, https://object.cato.org/sites/cato....ex-files/human-freedom-index-2018-revised.pdf)

Isn't it crazy how we can both have stronger social safety nets, provide healthcare and education for all, less crime and still have equal or better business opportunity and more freedom? Pretty much all northern European countries rank above the US in most or all of these metrics. But wait, you have a bigger military and more rich people! Yay!



The Poorest 20% of Americans Are Richer on Average Than Most European Nations

https://fee.org/articles/the-poorest-20-of-americans-are-richer-than-most-nations-of-europe/



Plus, our police don’t look the other way while people rape our women.
 
I so want what you guys have here in the states man. What a relief it would be to know that not a single child in my county was going without needed health care.

Imagine walking into a gas station here and seeing the face of some precious child on a jar with a note from the parents begging for money for a procedure that they won't get otherwise.....

Also my father was a union electrician in the 1980's, a proud man who would never take charity from anyone. My mother got cancer and the treatment, even with my dad's health insurance and my mothers too, who worked for a hospital, bankrupted them. They lost everything and that while trying to hold the family together.

It was a terrible time in my life.
Shit.. Man, that is gut wrenching.
 
Shit.. Man, that is gut wrenching.


It was terrible. My parents already had a strained relationship, but not terrible. She was so sick though and the chemotherapy destroyed her health and on top of that we were going under financially. This, as you may know, added so much stress to their relationship that there was fighting going on too.

The thing about being financially insecure is that it FORCES you to think about it all the time. Its an instinct and it is powerful and it overrides other concerns. No one got the love and care they needed during that time I can tell you that.

It was so bad man. It scarred the whole family. My mom lived though but it was a bad 3 years or so.
 
While we are definitely not perfect and have our own issues, it's for certain that we have a very strong and cohesive society that takes care of the working and lower class as a matter of first principle, while at the same time providing strong individual rights and good business opportunities. The US is an amazing country if you are rich, probably one of the best in the world if not the best. However, if you're not, which is the majority, it can be devastating. The lower you go the more terrible it gets. There are still a lot of good things about the US, some strong traditions of value and great people, but Imagine what a country it could be like if the people really put their mind to it. You could indeed be the greatest country in the world.



This is straight up bullshit. There are welfare queens 3 miles from me who live in houses bigger than yours, with tv’s bigger than yours, free food and free healthcare.


America > Useless European nations.
 
It was terrible. My parents already had a strained relationship, but not terrible. She was so sick though and the chemotherapy destroyed her health and on top of that we were going under financially. This, as you may know, added so much stress to their relationship that there was fighting going on too.

The thing about being financially insecure is that it FORCES you to think about it all the time. Its an instinct and it is powerful and it overrides other concerns. No one got the love and care they needed during that time I can tell you that.

It was so bad man. It scarred the whole family. My mom lived though but it was a bad 3 years or so.


And that is a cakewalk compared to what many families go through when they lose the primary breadwinner due to illness and lose everything too..... its so fucked.

@blottstein
 
This is straight up bullshit. There are welfare queens 3 miles from me who live in houses bigger than yours, with tv’s bigger than yours, free food and free healthcare.


America > Useless European nations.


Bigger TV's and bigger homes equals better quality of life..... said the american.
 
It was terrible. My parents already had a strained relationship, but not terrible. She was so sick though and the chemotherapy destroyed her health and on top of that we were going under financially. This, as you may know, added so much stress to their relationship that there was fighting going on too.

The thing about being financially insecure is that it FORCES you to think about it all the time. Its an instinct and it is powerful and it overrides other concerns. No one got the love and care they needed during that time I can tell you that.

It was so bad man. It scarred the whole family. My mom lived though but it was a bad 3 years or so.

Appreaciate you sharing. Most people I know have a medical related clusterfuck story that touched them or their family.

And yea acute financial stress has been shown to be the equivalent of lowering your IQ something like 10-15 points. Completely unnecessary suffering in our HC system
 
The Poorest 20% of Americans Are Richer on Average Than Most European Nations

https://fee.org/articles/the-poorest-20-of-americans-are-richer-than-most-nations-of-europe/



Plus, our police don’t look the other way while people rape our women.
This is straight up bullshit. There are welfare queens 3 miles from me who live in houses bigger than yours, with tv’s bigger than yours, free food and free healthcare.


America > Useless European nations.
Even from you I expected a more cohesive response to the facts I listed. It's a little sad when your talking points are refused and you just get stuck and resort to randomly throwing things at the wall hoping they stick. You can't deny a single thing I listed.
 
And more/better food
More freedom
Lower taxes
Lower priced cars
Lower priced gas
More opportunities for success


Need I go on?


What specifically is better about the food they get than in @Sano 's country?

None of the things you mention stack up as better to me than a guaranteed minimum amount of security for everyone BTW.

Less work hours and no chance of going broke leaves room for the important things in life like spiritual growth and relationships and bettering oneself intellectually and emotionally.

Its amazing how people feel and live when their very security is not threatened.
 
What specifically is better about the food they get than in @Sano 's country?

None of the things you mention stack up as better to me than a guaranteed minimum amount of security for everyone BTW.

Less work hours and no chance of going broke leaves room for the important things in life like spiritual growth and relationships and bettering oneself intellectually and emotionally.

Its amazing how people feel and live when their very security is not threatened.
I forgot to mention that we have less weekly working hours (37 is full time), we get 6 weeks vacation a year mandatory, we have better pensions AND working parents get 52 weeks of maternity leave split betweem them.
 
I forgot to mention that we have less weekly working hours (37 is full time), we get 6 weeks vacation a year mandatory, we have better pensions AND working parents get 52 weeks of maternity leave split betweem them.

I KNOW. It sound incredible. I would gladly give up some of my extras to live in a country like that man. Just simply knowing that everyone is OK at a minimum level would be a relief on my heart.

As a christian it gives me more hope for the rich too as they would not be so deeply sinful sitting on more money than they will ever need or spend while others starve or die.

Wealth guilt is a thing too and that could be eradicated also.
 
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What specifically is better about the food they get than in @Sano 's country?

None of the things you mention stack up as better to me than a guaranteed minimum amount of security for everyone BTW.

Less work hours and no chance of going broke leaves room for the important things in life like spiritual growth and relationships and bettering oneself intellectually and emotionally.

Its amazing how people feel and live when their very security is not threatened.


Our food is cheaper and more plentiful.

“Denmark is the most expensive place in Europe to buy groceries, according to new figures from Eurostat.
The Eurostat numbers show that food and non-alcoholic drinks in Denmark cost 145 percent of the average price in the EU. This was well above second-place Sweden, where consumers pay 124 percent of the average EU price.

Only non-EU countries Norway and Switzerland have higher grocery costs, at 159 and 173 percent respectively.

Not only does Denmark have the highest overall grocery prices, it can also claim the most expensive meat and bread. Only when it comes to dairy products are there more expensive EU countries. Danish consumers “only” pay 127 percent of the EU average for their milk, cheese and eggs, topped by prices in Cyprus, Greece and Ireland.

While it might be hard to believe if you shelled out 60 kroner for a pint of beer, Denmark is only the fifth most expensive EU country when it comes to alcoholic beverages. Danish consumers pay 138 percent of the EU average price for booze, putting the nation behind Ireland (175%), Finland (172%), the UK (163%) and Sweden (141%).

You can perhaps console yourself over your next beer by thinking of the Norwegians, who pay a whopping 250 percent of the EU average for alcoholic beverages.”




The difference between you and I, is you naively think you’ll get “free healthcare”. That “security” you talk about comes at great expense. It’s part of why they have less stuff, small houses, more expensive everything.

Live in America, have a job, buy insurance. You’re ok. This is the reality for most of America. There are horror stories, it sucks. That’s life.

And next time you’re upset about healthcare, remember to that the patron saint Obama for Obamacare.
 
Our food is cheaper and more plentiful.

“Denmark is the most expensive place in Europe to buy groceries, according to new figures from Eurostat.
The Eurostat numbers show that food and non-alcoholic drinks in Denmark cost 145 percent of the average price in the EU. This was well above second-place Sweden, where consumers pay 124 percent of the average EU price.

Only non-EU countries Norway and Switzerland have higher grocery costs, at 159 and 173 percent respectively.

Not only does Denmark have the highest overall grocery prices, it can also claim the most expensive meat and bread. Only when it comes to dairy products are there more expensive EU countries. Danish consumers “only” pay 127 percent of the EU average for their milk, cheese and eggs, topped by prices in Cyprus, Greece and Ireland.

While it might be hard to believe if you shelled out 60 kroner for a pint of beer, Denmark is only the fifth most expensive EU country when it comes to alcoholic beverages. Danish consumers pay 138 percent of the EU average price for booze, putting the nation behind Ireland (175%), Finland (172%), the UK (163%) and Sweden (141%).

You can perhaps console yourself over your next beer by thinking of the Norwegians, who pay a whopping 250 percent of the EU average for alcoholic beverages.”




The difference between you and I, is you naively think you’ll get “free healthcare”. That “security” you talk about comes at great expense. It’s part of why they have less stuff, small houses, more expensive everything.

Live in America, have a job, buy insurance. You’re ok. This is the reality for most of America. There are horror stories, it sucks. That’s life.

And next time you’re upset about healthcare, remember to that the patron saint Obama for Obamacare.

YOu said it was "better food" You have provided no proof of that.
 
YOu said it was "better food" You have provided no proof of that.


Being able to afford good protein for every meal = better food.

Not to mention America has some of the finest culinary talent and destinations in the world.

Denmark?

<{cruzshake}>


“But muh herring”
 
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