Why John Danaher Refused to Shake Hands with Mike Davila at EBI

[rmongler]

I have great comeback but I'm waiting for my instructor's friend's permission if I could post it.

Very good young grasshoppa, the not-yet-enlightened must know their station in the proper order of things.

Now, more crane kicks!

 

[neutralmilkh]

I love how fucking butthurt people are over this. The thing people are so butthurt over is that Danaher called it like he fucking sees it. He said there are guys on the team way better than davilla and should have had a chance over this guy. I take his opinion over any of the fucking whiners on here.

But we live with the fucking Millenials where you can't give any anything but likes or praise or you are just a hater....a gold start for all the special snowflakes.

Guess what? You will NEVER hear of Davliia again and he gave up a cushy instructor job for NOTHING. Lol.

Is it the Eddie bravo invitational or the John Danaher invitational?

 

[Foppa21]

He is definitely a bit bigger than Tonon but they've had some pretty fun matches.

Yep. But the results have been the same.

It's hard to say whether he's improved enough top beat Keenan.

Tonon did go the distance with Palhares... but Keenan finished Lister

 

[Foppa21]

Danaher should have shook his hand plain and simple. Even peeps who hate each other and talked sh$t all throughout the pre-fight and interviews prior to a fight shake hands after. He didn't have to kiss him and hug him and laugh and joke with him, just shake his hand quickly stone faced and move on.

Worked out real well for Ronda and Miesha lol

 

[Machote]

So childish, why not shake his hand? Its not like Davila had sex with his mum or something. A handshake does not mean you have to love and respect the man you are shaking hands with, it's just a normal thing to do, like saying hi.

 

[Uchi Mata]

Yep. But the results have been the same.

It's hard to say whether he's improved enough top beat Keenan.

Tonon did go the distance with Palhares... but Keenan finished Lister

Keenan's no-gi game is highly underrated. I think he's a lot better no-gi, mostly because he's gotten too into stalling and gamesmanship with the worm guard in the gi. When he goes straight at guys he's very, very hard to beat and extremely dangerous as a finisher. He has wins over Calasans, Yuri Simoes, Jackson Souza, Lucas Leite, Clark Gracie, Pablo Popovitch, Dean Lister, Tonon himself, Leandro Lo, Felipe Pena, and Braulio Estima to name only a few. I'd say Garry's best wins are James Puopolo, Joao Miyao, and Dillon Danis. Most of his record are fast wins against 2nd and 3rd tier guys. There's just no comparison of their records, Keenan is far, far more accomplished and really only competes against top guys. I'm actually not hating on Garry for making money and building his brand against guys he knows he can beat (and taking on Palhares was legitimately a very ballsy thing to do), but for the most part when these DDS guys have run into true top flight competitors like Tanquinho and Kron they've fallen short. I think Gordon's win against Yuri at EBI was probably the first time any of them beat a really top level competitor. As I've said before, ADCC 2017 will be telling.

 

[Zankou]

Given the apex quality of Keenan's wins he has actually been somewhat unlucky in taking home 1sts.

 

[Pizdek]

I also sometimes write essays about my feelings….

 

[Spazzmaster]

but for the most part when these DDS guys have run into true top flight competitors like Tanquinho and Kron they've fallen short. I think Gordon's win against Yuri at EBI was probably the first time any of them beat a really top level competitor. As I've said before, ADCC 2017 will be telling.

Yeah. I don't even rate Gordon's win over Yuri that highly. Everybody knew Yuri was exhausted from his triple overtime war with Tonon and had an injured leg going into that match. It's a tournament, sure, that's what happens, brackets can make all the difference. But I think that match goes very different if Yuri is fresh.

We'll see how the Danaher guys do at ADCC next year. To his credit, Tonon did sub Dillon Danis at ADCC 2015. Only to be thoroughly dominated by Lucas Lepri.

As for now, there's really no debate that Keenan's record is leagues better than any of the Danaher guys. I remember Keenan's match against Tonon at No Gi Worlds 2014 was so one-sided people were accusing Keenan of lacking "budo" by running up the score.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Keenan's no-gi game is highly underrated. I think he's a lot better no-gi, mostly because he's gotten too into stalling and gamesmanship with the worm guard in the gi. When he goes straight at guys he's very, very hard to beat and extremely dangerous as a finisher. He has wins over Calasans, Yuri Simoes, Jackson Souza, Lucas Leite, Clark Gracie, Pablo Popovitch, Dean Lister, Tonon himself, Leandro Lo, Felipe Pena, and Braulio Estima to name only a few. I'd say Garry's best wins are James Puopolo, Joao Miyao, and Dillon Danis. Most of his record are fast wins against 2nd and 3rd tier guys. There's just no comparison of their records, Keenan is far, far more accomplished and really only competes against top guys. I'm actually not hating on Garry for making money and building his brand against guys he knows he can beat (and taking on Palhares was legitimately a very ballsy thing to do), but for the most part when these DDS guys have run into true top flight competitors like Tanquinho and Kron they've fallen short. I think Gordon's win against Yuri at EBI was probably the first time any of them beat a really top level competitor. As I've said before, ADCC 2017 will be telling.

sort of agree....

I am a huge tonon fan, mostly becasue I enjoy his style and he mostlly fights no gi. But there is absolutely no dobut that keenan has a way better resume. Keenan fights ibjjf tournements, where is where the monsters are. Now its a totally different ball park than sumbission only tournaments, also, keenan doesnt seem to be very pro no gi, he has gone on record saying he doesnt like it that much. that doesnt mean hes not a beast no gi also. He sure is, he sure was when he was a purple, and he sure is now. I dont remember if garry was working with danaher back then, but he gave keenan one hell of a fight.

Gary also wouldve beaten kron if he had not go ape shit and played it safe, many guys wouldve just stalled. Tonon took on buchecha the first fight in the absolute, he did very well, I think he lost on points in a close fight.

Eddie cummins took on tanquinho mendes twice, one was a razor close fight, and the second was a draw, what am I trying to say? well evnethough keenan defenitly has taken and beaten more top guys in a consistent basis, both cummings and tonon seem to be just on pair with them, there is no a world of difference skillwise talking.

adcc 2015 will really really suck balls if they dont do something about this -1 for guard pulling in the finals, or add some strong penalties for stalling, other ways, (no disrepect for olando) but you will have another champ who wins all of his matches by being the strongets dude and not wanting to actually grapple.

If they do keep it the way it is, I would love to have some journey men wrestlers with minimun sub grappling join the contest and make everyone look silly in there td or force a guard pull, run, win.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Yeah. I don't even rate Gordon's win over Yuri that highly. Everybody knew Yuri was exhausted from his triple overtime war with Tonon and had an injured leg going into that match. It's a tournament, sure, that's what happens, brackets can make all the difference. But I think that match goes very different if Yuri is fresh.

We'll see how the Danaher guys do at ADCC next year. To his credit, Tonon did sub Dillon Danis at ADCC 2015. Only to be thoroughly dominated by Lucas Lepri.

As for now, there's really no debate that Keenan's record is leagues better than any of the Danaher guys. I remember Keenan's match against Tonon at No Gi Worlds 2014 was so one-sided people were accusing Keenan of lacking "budo" by running up the score.

yuri deserved to lose, he tried to cheat in the overtime, he got his arm trapped for playing smartass and trying to remove one hook before the go, gordon probably knew that was coming since he did the same to garry.

in a points match, based on that match yuri wouldve probably beat him by a wide margin.

 

[Spazzmaster]

I dont remember if garry was working with danaher back then, but he gave keenan one hell of a fight.

This is the last time Keenan and Tonon faced each other. Final score was 23-2.

IBJJF rules, but still...

 

[BJJ_Rage]

This is the last time Keenan and Tonon faced each other. Final score was 23-2.

IBJJF rules, but still...

I for some reason had in mind that that match was gi, keenan put a royal ass beaten on gary.

IBJJF rules though.

 

[NSchoke]

I think Gordon Ryan vs Keenan will be closer than most people think. I wouldn't have said that pre EBI6 but anyone who can beat an Adcc Gold medalist and bronze medalist back to back is going to give anyone trouble. Not to mention he's only 20-21 and has only been training 5-6 years, in the few months since EBI he's most certainly gotten better and probably stronger.

I wouldn't put him as a favorite over Keenan but counting him out is foolish.

 

[Spazzmaster]

Keenan vs Tonon at Five Grappling in 2013. Rules allowed reaping.

 

[Spazzmaster]

I think Gordon Ryan vs Keenan will be closer than most people think. I wouldn't have said that pre EBI6 but anyone who can beat an Adcc Gold medalist and bronze medalist back to back is going to give anyone trouble. Not to mention he's only 20-21 and has only been training 5-6 years, in the few months since EBI he's most certainly gotten better and probably stronger.

I wouldn't put him as a favorite over Keenan but counting him out is foolish.

Not counting Gordon out, but the fact is, Keenan was repeatedly crushing Gordon's mentor when Gordon was still a purple belt. The difference in experience and accomplishments is undeniable.

But hey, only a couple weeks until their Grappling Industries super match. Gonna be interesting.

 

[mataleaos]

Yep. But the results have been the same.

It's hard to say whether he's improved enough top beat Keenan.

Tonon did go the distance with Palhares... but Keenan finished Lister

exactly

 

[yetanother]

Keenan's no-gi game is highly underrated. I think he's a lot better no-gi, mostly because he's gotten too into stalling and gamesmanship with the worm guard in the gi.

Most of the stalling in the worm guard is done by the guy on top.
The match against Buchecha was the only one he was doing a bunch of gamesmanship but it seemed a good strategy.
The IBJJF rules really promote stalling a lame tactics so it's hard to blame Keenan for playing the game.

 

[Uchi Mata]

sort of agree....

I am a huge tonon fan, mostly becasue I enjoy his style and he mostlly fights no gi. But there is absolutely no dobut that keenan has a way better resume. Keenan fights ibjjf tournements, where is where the monsters are. Now its a totally different ball park than sumbission only tournaments, also, keenan doesnt seem to be very pro no gi, he has gone on record saying he doesnt like it that much. that doesnt mean hes not a beast no gi also. He sure is, he sure was when he was a purple, and he sure is now. I dont remember if garry was working with danaher back then, but he gave keenan one hell of a fight.

Gary also wouldve beaten kron if he had not go ape shit and played it safe, many guys wouldve just stalled. Tonon took on buchecha the first fight in the absolute, he did very well, I think he lost on points in a close fight.

Eddie cummins took on tanquinho mendes twice, one was a razor close fight, and the second was a draw, what am I trying to say? well evnethough keenan defenitly has taken and beaten more top guys in a consistent basis, both cummings and tonon seem to be just on pair with them, there is no a world of difference skillwise talking.

adcc 2015 will really really suck balls if they dont do something about this -1 for guard pulling in the finals, or add some strong penalties for stalling, other ways, (no disrepect for olando) but you will have another champ who wins all of his matches by being the strongets dude and not wanting to actually grapple.

If they do keep it the way it is, I would love to have some journey men wrestlers with minimun sub grappling join the contest and make everyone look silly in there td or force a guard pull, run, win.

My feeling is that you can't base your estimation of someone's skill on matches they would have or should have won. These guys are all pros, they're quite close in skill, but the difference between them is in those small things that allow them to win close matches against other elite guys. Danaher's team has consistently shown an inability to do so, whether because they're so strategically focused on submissions in points tournaments like ADCC or for some other reason. I think Keenan's match with Gordon Ryan will probably be close, but I also think Keenan will win. Why? Because he's shown the ability to win close matches against elite guys on a consistent basis with Ryan (nor Tonon nor Cummings) has.

And frankly the 'I only do sub only tournaments' excuse is pretty thin, because sub only tournaments typically do not have the same caliber of competitor as points tournaments. There's just no comparison between the level of competition in EBI and ADCC. And when EBI stars like Tonon, Cummings, Geo Martinez, etc. have stepped up to the big leagues they've consistently fallen short.

 

[Uchi Mata]

Most of the stalling in the worm guard is done by the guy on top.
The match against Buchecha was the only one he was doing a bunch of gamesmanship but it seemed a good strategy.
The IBJJF rules really promote stalling a lame tactics so it's hard to blame Keenan for playing the game.

I understand why he does it but I don't think it actually plays to his strengths that well. He's much better when he's going forward aggressively IMO.