Why I am now Libertarian (New Alternative Political Ideology)

[STEVEN SEAGOLD]

Libertarians are essentially the Jedi Knights and Masters of society and the political spectrum. Imagine Neo at the end of The Matrix, but way cooler. It's like being an atheist, but without the obnoxiousness and cringe. You get to wear cool hats like Clint Eastwood, and ride into the sunset as the lone wolf... Metaphorically speaking.

Don't get me wrong, it's not a centrist movement dictated on the ebbs and flows of Democrats and Republicans. We're much cooler and have our own unique identity.

What do we (Libertarians) believe in?

- Low taxes
- No taxation without representation
- Small government
- Personal responsibility
- Private sector growth and support
- Free trade enterprise without the government meddling, bailouts and cronyism
- Minimal to nonexistent welfare state
- Separation of state and church

Core pillars of our ideology include;

Individualism

Individual Rights

Spontaneous Order

The Rule of Law

Limited Governments

Free Markets

Virtue of Production

We've got all the best things about Democrats and Republicans, and none of the bad things

 

[lecter]

"New Alternative"

?

 

[Thurisaz]

Libertarianism kills itself thanks to free trade.

That's why all defenses of it are safely in the theoretical and free to ignore actual reality.

Within a nation, I am, however, for maximizing individual freedom.

 

[STEVEN SEAGOLD]

"...I'm going to show these people what you don't want them to see. I'm going to show them a world without you. A world without rules and controls, without borders or boundaries. A world where anything is possible. Where we go from there is a choice I leave to you."

- Neo on Libertarian Ideology

 

[Jack V Savage]

Yeah, the real message of the Matrix is that we should give tax cuts to rich people, workers should be more obedient, and we should allow more pollution.

Right-wing "libertarianism" was invented in the 1950s by business lobbyists, and it shows. Their marketing material suggests an inability to relate to young people and an assumption that they're all idiots. "Be young, have fun, drink Pepsi, and eviscerate the proletariat."

 

[Octavian]

Libertarians fundamentally misunderstand how society and governing works. Try again.

 

[Octavian]

Yeah, the real message of the Matrix is that we give tax cuts to rich people, workers should be more obedient, and we should allow more pollution.

Right-wing "libertarianism" was invented in the 1950s by business lobbyists, and it shows. Their marketing material suggests an inability to relate to young people and an assumption that they're all idiots. "Be young, have fun, drink Pepsi, and eviscerate the proletariat."

Exactly. It's seductive for people who hate government but it's really just a Trojan horse aimed and building support against the government so as to unbridled business which then just holds as much if not considerably more influence over ones life... and you have virtually zero control or ability to combat that.

 

[SpawnOfNyarlathotep]

You really like the matrix ending don't you TS?

 

[electricfuneral]

Sounds like TS just discovered libertarian ideology. There are many kinds of libertarian leanings as well. I have been a libertarian for decades and that means a different thing depending on what country you live in.

As far as being athiest without the cringe?

My centrist friends consider it to be akin to scientology.

 

[STEVEN SEAGOLD]

Being a Libertarian is like being a force user in Star Wars

 

[lecter]

For people who are as butthurt as Octavian or Jack, just because of one single person who became president, you might expect they would appreciate the few remaining people critical of governments' influence in their lives. But of course, the real problem is that Bernie didn't win. It's just the wrong guy, that's it. The government just has to do the right things. Well, you can try again in 4 years I guess.

Right-wing "libertarianism" was invented in the 1950s by business lobbyists

What are you criticizing? Libertarian-leaning politicians in the Republican party? The libertarian party in the US? Libertarianism?
The way you wrote it, you're obviously and factually wrong.
Was Albert Nock not a right-libertarian? Yes, he was.
Ayn Rand? A business lobbyist in the 1950s? Hm, interesting.
Would you assess Steiner-Vallentyne significantly different than whatever you call right-libertarian?

 

[electricfuneral]

For people who are as butthurt as Octavian or Jack, just because of one single person who became president, you might expect they would appreciate the few remaining people critical of governments' influence in their lives. But of course, the real problem is that Bernie didn't win. It's just the wrong guy, that's it. The government just has to do the right things. Well, you can try again in 4 years I guess.


What are you criticizing? Libertarian-leaning politicians in the Republican party? The libertarian party in the US? Libertarianism?
The way you wrote it, you're obviously and factually wrong.
Was Albert Nock not a right-libertarian? Yes, he was.
Ayn Rand? A business lobbyist in the 1950s? Hm, interesting.
Would you assess Steiner-Vallentyne significantly different than whatever you call right-libertarian?

Alot of heavily partisan people and partisan ratfucks conflate right-wing libertarian as being the support that you can not serve black people at your business because they are black. It is where most libertarian ideology debates usually deteriorate to.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Sounds like TS just discovered libertarian ideology.

Sounds more like either a deliberate troll making fun of right-wing libertarians or someone copying and pasting really out-of-touch marketing material.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Alot of heavily partisan people and partisan ratfucks conflate right-wing libertarian as being the support that you can not serve black people at your business because they are black. It is where most libertarian ideology debates usually deteriorate to.

A lot of racists have latched onto the right-wing libertarian movement, but primarily it's about upward redistribution of wealth and contempt for working people.

 

[electricfuneral]

A lot of racists have latched onto the right-wing libertarian movement, but primarily it's about upward redistribution of wealth and contempt for working people.

I agree that a lot of racists have attached to it. There are many people that only subscribe to this ideology to troll people. I saw a guy call into Sam Seder and debate that we wouldnt pay taxes for roads and infrastructure because we could fly around with jetpacks and hover cars.

There are some valid critiques of the ideology.

 

[STEVEN SEAGOLD]

I agree that a lot of racists have attached to it. There are many people that only subscribe to this ideology to troll people. I saw a guy call into Sam Seder and debate that we wouldnt pay taxes for roads and infrastructure because we could fly around with jetpacks and hover cars.

There are some valid critiques of the ideology.

Now that's cool.

 

[kpt018]

Libertarianism is wonderful for college students who like personal freedom, hate the government and have no fucking clue how the real world works. I've been there. Then I grew up.

 

[Higus]

I've personally been less enthusiastic about the ideology over time. The hidden goal seems to be the transfer of power and authority from public to private corporate ownership rather than having anything to do with increasing personal freedom beyond a superficial level.

 

[lecter]

Libertarianism is wonderful for college students who like personal freedom, hate the government and have no fucking clue how the real world works. I've been there. Then I grew up.

Democratic Socialism is wonderful for college students who are angry over their fees, don't want to work and have no idea how the real world works.
I've been there. Then I got a job.

You can make snarky comments about any ideology and about everything you group together with that ideology.
Unfortunately, that doesn't say anything.

 

[kpt018]

Democratic Socialism is wonderful for college students who are angry over their fees, don't want to work and have no idea how the real world works.
I've been there. Then I got a job.

You can make snarky comments about any ideology and about everything you group together with that ideology.
Unfortunately, that doesn't say anything.

Nah, I'm very comfortable arguing about how broken libertarianism is and we can discuss it if you want. And there is nothing about Democratic socialism that says you don't have to work, so if we are going to discuss this stuff make an effort to be accurate.