Pope Francis declared having an abortion after finding birth defects in an unborn child was...

it creates a bit of a problem with what do you consider physically/mentally handicapped? until those parameters are set and I can really know what Im arguing for or against I tend to lean towards not killing disabled people.

Not physically killing them, but eliminating the possibility that they're ever born in the first place. This will be done through advancements in science. We're going to eventually get to a point where certain measures can be taken to ensure the healthiest baby possible, and will be able to tell earlier and earlier if a baby is going to have a defect.

Ever see "Gattaca"? That kind of shit.
 
On the surface it is a controversial post, and probably should be. But that is only if people think that today's outcomes will amount to the same exact results, as they did for the Nazis. The Nazi genocides were a product of a particular time and place, quite far off from modern realities.

Not putting human life at the center of everything, does not inevitably lead to the same amount of suffering and atrocities that it may have led to in the times of Hitler and the Nazis. Today, we have means at our disposal with which we can prevent children with serious defects from being born, before they reach the stage of developed human life.

It is not Hitler who is ordering people to abort their children. It is the people themselves who are choosing to do so, by their own will. And there are no gas chambers or concentration camps being utilized to accomplish the feat, either. The shame of Nazi atrocities, does not really resonate with people who partake in the modern version of "eugenics", because scientific progress in these areas has basically reduced the element of human suffering, down to nothing.



It's not a matter of whether we should or should not. It's happening, whether we like to admit it or not.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/down-syndrome-iceland/

Are Icelandic people Nazis? Maybe or maybe not. But they've accomplished something even Hitler couldn't do. And I reckon that they won't be the only ones to do it, eventually.

I actually advocate for limitations on abortions, etc. to increase population growth in my own country, which is suffering from an aging population, and a huge decrease of birth rates. But my arguments have nothing to do with the shame game that the Pope is trying to play, which is bound to end in failure due to a complete misunderstanding of the respective circumstances. For me, it's just about basic maintenance of a society for the long-term.

For some societies, abortions are a dire necessity.
It's sad how adding "hitler" or "nazi" to a talking point can completely shut down a conversation. I wonder what else we could get away with by playing the "anti hitler" name game.
 
While I disagree with his position I am not surprised, after all, he's the Pope.

I am just glad he generally preaches an open and empathetic, some might even say humanist, world view. By the standards of Popes he is just fine.

Where he fails is the complete inability to explain why he comes to these positions, and why his position should be regarded as the best possible way forward for human societies.

Just being in favour of something because you're the Pope, doesn't really cut it, these days. Every hack with a Wikipedia at their disposal can come up with better arguments.
 
I think you're only seeing that because some part of that triggers you, tbh.
No, you and him are just eugenics facists. I hope you both rot in hell for having such evil beliefs.
 
Not physically killing them, but eliminating the possibility that they're ever born in the first place. This will be done through advancements in science. We're going to eventually get to a point where certain measures can be taken to ensure the healthiest baby possible, and will be able to tell earlier and earlier if a baby is going to have a defect.

Ever see "Gattaca"? That kind of shit.
aw well if thats possible then I dont know how anyone could be against it..... of course all babies if possible should be born as healthy as possible. I would certainly be in favour of that kind of eugenics
 
It's sad how adding "hitler" or "nazi" to a talking point cant completely shut down a conversation. I wonder what else we could get away with by playing the "anti hitler" name game.

For me, putting Hitler and the Nazis in there is actually the only way to open up a conversation. I don't get too many replies to my posts unless I bring out ol' Adolf and his cronies. Makes people feel they're more "safe" in trying to challenge the argument, as they can always just call "Nazi" to end the debate, even if they are on the losing end of it. I'm content enough getting in a few replies before that happens.

It's one of the hands I'm used to playing in such forums. At other times I might use Stalin and the Commies, or other such figures to stir up the pot.
 
<Lmaoo> give your head a shake you triggered little bitch.
Scathing retort. Yet, I am not the facist advocating for the murder of people. So have fun with that.
 
Scathing retort. Yet, I am not the facist advocating for the murder of people. So have fun with that.
Look at yourself. A single word shuts your whole brain down. You dont even know what you are arguing, all you know is you must be right. Sad.
 
a complete eradication of persons who are incapable of living a fulfilling and respectable human life.
It simply isn't true that people with Down's Syndrome cannot live fulfilling and respectable lives.
 
It simply isn't true that people with Down's Syndrome cannot live fulfilling and respectable lives.

Maybe they can, maybe they cannot. But they will not be here for long, if modern developments continue.

It's not me, or the Nazis that are doing the "eradication". It's parents who simply can't bother with having a defected child when they can abort, try again, and have a child with no defects.

Whether that's right or wrong, that's not really for me to decide. The society seems to be making that decision by itself.

I don't really bother with the morality aspect of it, because we've grossly expanded beyond our natural limitations, as it is. Whether Down's children will or will not exist in the future, is the least of it.
 
It simply isn't true that people with Down's Syndrome cannot live fulfilling and respectable lives.
Agreed.

But it's too easy to either put them on drugs, or delete them entirely. Life means nothing to us.
 
Maybe they can, maybe they cannot.

There's no maybe about it. Anyone who knows a person or two with Down's Syndrome knows they can live fulfilling and respectable lives.

I don't really bother with the morality aspect of it

Clearly. And it's an ugly thing. I'm no Catholic, but I'm with the pope on this one.
 
There's no maybe about it. Anyone who knows a person or two with Down's Syndrome knows they can live fulfilling and respectable lives.

Lives that end up being a massive burden on their parents.

Clearly. And it's an ugly thing. I'm no Catholic, but I'm with the pope on this one.

So I'm to believe that I'm "ugly" because I do not concern myself with problems, that in the grand scheme of things, do not really have any meaning whatsoever in regards to the long-term sustainment of our societies.

Others believe themselves to walk around with a halo over their heads, as they wrestle with the completely mundane issues, while the world around them goes to shit.

I'm not one for pretension. If the Pope actually gave a shit, he'd have something more to say than pulling the ol' Nazi card out of his back pocket. He's just doing what he's "meant to do", throwing a few bones every now and then to his assumed crowd, not what his heart tells him to do.

If he truly believed, with all his might, that this issue needed to be resolved, he'd have more to say, than this piece of bullshit.

Atleast I actually put a honest effort into the arguments that I believe in.
 
Look at yourself. A single word shuts your whole brain down. You dont even know what you are arguing, all you know is you must be right. Sad.
I know exactly what I am arguing. You are grasping at straws to justify your vile beliefs.
 
Please quote these vile beliefs of mine.
Don't have to. Just look back at every single post of yours and OP. Ima sit back and watch this shit show go on. I am curious how long it will survive before a moderator aborts it.
 
Don't have to. Just look back at every single post of yours and OP. Ima sit back and watch this shit show go on. I am curious how long it will survive before a moderator aborts it.
Thought so.
 
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