People who get upset about hunters yet consume animals or wear animal products bother me

[Jack Reacheround]

Killing for food is different than killing for fun. Intent matters. Everyone knows that, which is why we have first degree murder charges, for people who made a conscious decision to go out and murder someone, and second degree murder charges, for people who didn't plan on killing someone, but we're so enraged that they were compelled to.

It's also why we have involuntary manslaughter, for people who don't mean to kill someone.

But hey, I guess intent doesn't matter. We should give anyone whose actions resulted in someone dying the maximum sentence, right?

 

[bushman505]

Always someone in the group who doesn't fill theirs *wink wink

Agree on moose as the top meat. I make shit loads of sausage/jerky.

Yeah moose is pretty much the best. And if I can get a 60"+ monster then all the better. Caribou is good but not as good as moose.

Are you hunting the USA? Or Canada?

 

[Drenalin]

I'm a hunter. I'm against killing elephants though.

Also anyone who eats meat & is against hunting for food, is just dumb.

 

[Curmudgeon]

Yeah moose is pretty much the best. And if I can get a 60"+ monster then all the better. Caribou is good but not as good as moose.

Are you hunting the USA? Or Canada?

Canada. Alberta/Sask.

 

[AgentSmecker]

I don't agree with the logic, word usage or case you are making here. It is flawed across the board imo.

I certainly am for humane treatment and raising of animals but domestic animals are not the same as wild animals. You cannot overlay human concepts of freedom on them as that is as silly as suggesting dogs and cats are enslaved if we breed and keep them as pets (as the guy upthread did) when that is what they appreciate and want from life.

Raising and eating domestic animals is in no way morally unjustifiable.

No. You are gravely deluded my friend. Bringing animals into the world to exploit and slaughter involves a complete disregard for the rights of these animals. No matter how supposedly well or humanely we treat them there is still huge amounts of needless artificially manufactured suffering and death involved and essentially we are treating sentient beings as no more than commodities.

 

[I Am Legion]

At the end of the day, killing an Elephant or a Lion, or any trophy animal is not the same as hunting deer. Deer populations need to be kept down or they will starve to death. The meat is usable and the animal is on no endangered lists. I guess if you are the type of person that likes to kill animals for trophies by looking through a scope and pulling a trigger like a fucking pussy , you were never taught the value of life.

 

[weich]

I don't understand this line of thought personally. being a more intelligent animal doesn't give you anymore right to live Imo. That said I have nothing against hunting unless it's hunting to the extinction

It's my personal preference, but I don't want to hunt an animal that is part of a community and will cause years and years of morning. Supposedly elephants have gone on to become man killers as revenge for members of their herd being killed. I just don't like the idea.

 

[elreece]

I am all for hunting, but why the fuck do you need to hunt endangered animals thats just fucking stupid.

 

[bushman505]

I'll hunt dolphins. I don't give a fuuuuuuck.

 

[Big Tuppy Hole]

Is it alright to hunt for fun? whats peoles opinion on hunting for sport

 

[Big Tuppy Hole]

There is a huge difference between killing for food/supplies and some dickhead killing something because he wants an animals head on his wall.

Fuck him.

I shoot foxes, rabbits, crows, pigeons, doves and rats for fun, does that make me a dickhead

 

[astrozician]

Meh, the world is full of people who don't know much about life. In recent years they have become loud complainers.

Is normal.

 

[MikeMcMann]

No. You are gravely deluded my friend. Bringing animals into the world to exploit and slaughter involves a complete disregard for the rights of these animals. No matter how supposedly well or humanely we treat them there is still huge amounts of needless artificially manufactured suffering and death involved and essentially we are treating sentient beings as no more than commodities.

Dumb logic.

Almost every animal in nature will die via predation. That predation is often quite horrific by human standards. They don't die via old age comfy in their bed at night.

But the animals do not understand the human concept of the end of their life. All they care about is THEIR LIFE and being able to live it as long as it lasts the best they can. All animals have a will to survive and to live and to propagate the species.

Again you wrongly overlay human concepts freedom to domestic animals who care nothing for that concept and then you wrongly judge the situation for them by a concept that means nothing to them.

Pets and free range farmed domestic animal live a great life up until their death. And whether that future death is a family pet being put down or slaughter for food means nothing to the animal during the period of its enjoyed life just as the deer being killed by the wolf eventually still wants its life despite an eventual harsh death.

So only man gets retarded enough to overlay human concepts on domestic animals and to try and judge through that lens. It is as dumb as saying keeping house plants is wrong as all plants belong out in nature. You are imparting human concepts where they do not belong and are not valued.

Whether its a goat in the wild or a goat on a family farm BOTH OF THEM simply want their chance at life and the fact that both may one day die by predation does not change that desire.

 

[bufetadanacara]

People should need to acquire a license to eat meat. Once you have killed and butchered an animal, you can eat it. That would make a lot of people go vegetarian, which is probably much healthier.

I love meat, I try to raise my own but need to supplement from stores. I think hunting is about the most sane, clean and natural thing we can do as men. I say that in the case that you are using the animal- food, coat, etc.

Trophy hunters should be shot and pissed on.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

I'm with ya TS. But I live in Michigan, we are very hunter friendly and our deer taste the best.

Equally I hate non- control hunters that kill just for killing.

 

[mjmj]

I caveated my post with 'most' for a reason and that is because most meat in big grocery chains is factory farmed which is a far worse life imo for the animal then living free. Both are eventually killed by predation but one actual has a quality of life prior.

So tell what is so ignorant about my view?

Because you're actually incorrect, at least as far as beef goes. Almost all beef in grocery stores originally comes from family farms, and just spends a couple months in some sort of "feed lot" before being butchered. Admittedly, some feed lots leave a lot to be desired, but they're not all bad. They go to great lengths to keep the animals calm, comfortable, and healthy. To not do that creates poor quality meat and would run them out of business.

 

[MikeMcMann]

Because you're actually incorrect, at least as far as beef goes. Almost all beef in grocery stores originally comes from family farms, and just spends a couple months in some sort of "feed lot" before being butchered. Admittedly, some feed lots leave a lot to be desired, but they're not all bad. They go to great lengths to keep the animals calm, comfortable, and healthy. To not do that creates poor quality meat and would run them out of business.

Well I won't claim to be an expert in this area nor will I claim that I have fact checked anything I have read.

But a quick google search of 'percent of meat factory farmed' gives you the top hits all saying stuff like this.

When you take into account the fact that factory farms raise 99.9 percent of chickens for meat, 97 percent of laying hens, 99 percent of turkeys, 95 percent of pigs, and 78 percent of cattle currently sold in the United States, it’s shocking how much time we waste debating each other, rather than trying to actually change the system. Link

Anyway the percentage was never central to my point. My point was merely that hunting meat is better than buying meat from a grocery store that comes from factory farming.

 

[mjmj]

Well I won't claim to be an expert in this area nor will I claim that I have fact checked anything I have read.

But a quick google search of 'percent of meat factory farmed' gives you the top hits all saying stuff like this.



Anyway the percentage was never central to my point. My point was merely that hunting meat is better than buying meat from a grocery store that comes from factory farming.

I can tell you with absolute certainty that those stats are complete bullshit.

 

[Revolver]

lmao @ this hunter. Trophy hunting is stupid and he can rest in piss.

 

[AgentSmecker]

Dumb logic.

Almost every animal in nature will die via predation. That predation is often quite horrific by human standards. They don't die via old age comfy in their bed at night.

But the animals do not understand the human concept of the end of their life. All they care about is THEIR LIFE and being able to live it as long as it lasts the best they can. All animals have a will to survive and to live and to propagate the species.

Again you wrongly overlay human concepts freedom to domestic animals who care nothing for that concept and then you wrongly judge the situation for them by a concept that means nothing to them.

Pets and free range farmed domestic animal live a great life up until their death. And whether that future death is a family pet being put down or slaughter for food means nothing to the animal during the period of its enjoyed life just as the deer being killed by the wolf eventually still wants its life despite an eventual harsh death.

So only man gets retarded enough to overlay human concepts on domestic animals and to try and judge through that lens. It is as dumb as saying keeping house plants is wrong as all plants belong out in nature. You are imparting human concepts where they do not belong and are not valued.

Whether its a goat in the wild or a goat on a family farm BOTH OF THEM simply want their chance at life and the fact that both may one day die by predation does not change that desire.

Wow. You say my logic is dumb and yet it seems the entire foundation of your logic is based upon the appeal to nature fallacy, which you use to try and justify your own continued exploitation of animals.

Predation is natural in the wild yes but so are a lot of other behaviours which we have now come to regard as being morally repugnant i.e. infanticide, rape and solving territorial disputes through sudden and savage acts of violence as well as other less harmful but similarly socially unacceptable acts such as greeting each other by pissing and sniffing each others nether regions.. Are you really suggesting that we should base our ethical framework around the behaviour of wild non human animals? Fucking come on man.

As if your argument wasn't already absurd enough it gets worse when you bring plants into the equation. There is no comparison here, animals = sentient.... plants not sentient.

Finally you seem to have missed the main crux of my argument which is not how well we treat animals but the fact that I don't believe we have the right to use them at all. Just as I believe it is morally indefensible to use human beings as commodities so too do I believe it is equally wrong to exploit and use non human animals as means to our own ends. Animals have their own evolutionary needs and desires to fulfill and we have no damn right to deny them.