Great article on suicide/mental health

[equus]

This is deep brother and well said.

Wasnt my goal but thanks man.

 

[Mike]

Sometimes it's like your a whole other person, is the thing. Its like you're kind of watching it all happen. You put something into your hands and you wrap it around your throat or your touch your wrist with it and you almost don't even know what the hell is going on.

I don't think it's a rational thing. I don't believe you can "think your way out" of one of those moments. You can only hope to get lucky and survive it, or snap out of it before it goes too far.

This is what a lot of my life feels like. Like I'm someone else just watching from overhead. The times I've seriously hurt myself is usually when I feel the most detached. It's interesting how you can be in this massive emotional pain but also feel like you're not really there.

thanks for the link ts
it touch me

a lot of people saying talk get it out.. that's always been the problem for me i figured the war inside my head i have figure it out nobody business etc...self loathing sucks when your told you should be happy you have it great...
the most frustrating thing about depression. It isn't always something you can fight back against with hope. It isn't even something

 

[equus]

You seem like a really genuinely nice person.

man, we all have things we are passionate about. I can be a total asshole but theres a time to cut the shit and help each other as humans.

 

[Wrath621]

Want to hear real talk? Go down to a senior center and find the most pathetic looking senior you can whos still able to talk and go sit next to them. Then ask them to tell you about life. And sit there and stfu. Listen. and really listen. Until they stop talking and want to go take their afternoon nap. That's where you will hear the real shit. That's where you will hear the actual legit pieces of realness that 20 somethings contrive and try to spit in here like their modern day Kafkas.

I have actually done something like this. Back in the late 80's when I was in the Corps. I would go to this senior home and visit with an old WW I vet. I probably visited him 10 to 15 and we became kind of close. He would talk for hours about the ups and downs of his life and things he had seen and experienced. Years later when my wife passed a lot of his words really helped me out.

 

[GordoBarraBJJ]

I like it,

nice thought isn't it.

 

[Lovestorm]

Been depressed and had suicidal thoughts since i was about 10. I'm 29 now, and over the last 5 years my emotions have almost evaporated, so i don't feel much anymore, which includes depression.

I guess things worked out in the end.

 

[nihilistxn85]

Been depressed and had suicidal thoughts since i was about 10. I'm 29 now, and over the last 5 years my emotions have almost evaporated, so i don't feel much anymore, which includes depression.

I guess things worked out in the end.

same here I lost my feelings for 2 years now and I am fine with it.

 

[Bay Area]

I think our ideas (society) about suicide are all wrong. If a person wants to take his life, then who am I to stand in his way? Guilting a person to continue living is horrible. Why persuade a person to continue living when he doesn't want to? In the end, its his decision and no one elses. Now of course let the person know that you are available to talk if he needs it, and that you are his friend or whatever. But its his life, and his free will. There needs to be assisted suicide programs imo.

 

[HUNTERMANIA]

I think our ideas (society) about suicide are all wrong. If a person wants to take his life, then who am I to stand in his way? Guilting a person to continue living is horrible. Why persuade a person to continue living when he doesn't want to? In the end, its his decision and no one elses. Now of course let the person know that you are available to talk if he needs it, and that you are his friend or whatever. But its his life, and his free will. There needs to be assisted suicide programs imo.

Totally agree with everything you've said. 100%. Especially the assisted suicide programs.

 

[JonesBones]

I think our ideas (society) about suicide are all wrong. If a person wants to take his life, then who am I to stand in his way? Guilting a person to continue living is horrible. Why persuade a person to continue living when he doesn't want to? In the end, its his decision and no one elses. Now of course let the person know that you are available to talk if he needs it, and that you are his friend or whatever. But its his life, and his free will. There needs to be assisted suicide programs imo.

People are happy to kill the sick and the disabled to save their dignity. They want people to maintain control. But control is an illusion. Scifi authors always get it wrong. They envision a future that is like Nazi Germany, where eugenics is rampant. But there is a reason why Nazi Germany was stamped out. They offered no illusion of control.

Think about it though. If I wanted to exterminate all people who aren't productive, I'd be a pariah. But train people from birth to derive their self worth from their utility and you'll have people lining up, begging for death. Tell people the mentally incompetent don't live happy lives. Tell people that they have the right to not be dragged down by caring for a mentally incompetent child. Give them a choice, and people will murder their own offspring. Give people the freedom to maintain their dignity, and they'll commit suicide so as not to be a burden.

Freedom and dignity are an illusion. Control is an illusion. Life is the only thing that is real to life. I cannot ask my cat if he wants to live. I cannot ask an ant if it wants to live. I know it does though. Why wouldn't it?

What do humans have without freedom and dignity? Nothing at all, but life.

There are moments in our life, when we dedicate a kind of love and touching respect to nature in its plants, minerals, animals, landscapes, just as to human nature in its children, in the morals of country folk and of the primeval world, not because it is pleasing to our senses, not even because it satisfies our understanding or taste (the opposite can often occur in respect to both), but rather merely because it is nature. Every fine man, who does not altogether lack feeling, experiences this, when he walks in the open, when he lives upon the land or tarries beside monuments of ancient times, in short, when he is surprised in artificial relations and situations with the sight of simple nature.

Nature in this mode of contemplation is for us nothing other than voluntary existence, subsistence of things through themselves, existence according to its own unalterable laws.

This conception is absolutely necessary, if we should take interest in such phenomena. If one could give to an artificial flower by means of the most perfect deception, the appearance of nature, if one could carry the imitation of the naive in morals up to the highest illusion, so would the discovery, that it be imitation, completely destroy the feeling of which we are speaking.1 From this it is clear, that this kind of pleasure in regard to nature is not aesthetical, but rather moral; for it is produced by means of an idea, not immediately through contemplation; also, it by no means depends upon the beauty of forms. What would even a plain flower, a spring, a mossy stone, the chirping of birds, the buzzing of bees, etc., have in itself so charming for us? What could give it any claim upon our love? It is not these objects, it is an idea represented through them, which we love in them. We love in them the quietly working life, the calm effects from out itself, existence under its own laws, the inner necessity, the eternal unity with itself.

But their perfection is not their merit, because it is not the work of its choice. They afford us, therefore, the entirely peculiar pleasure, that they, without shaming us, are our model. A constant divine appearance, they surround us, but more refreshingly than dazzlingly. What constitutes their character is precisely that which is lacking in ours to be complete; what distinguishes us from them is precisely that which is missing in them to be divine. We are free, and they are necessary; we change, they remain the same.

 

[RSmith47]

I agree about that.

One of the worst phrases ever is that people who commit suicide are cowards.
It's actually completely the opposite. Killing yourself is arguably one of the bravest things you could ever possibly do.

To actually make that choice is without doubt the most important decision anyone can ever possibly make.
Of course it will affect people who care about you, but if you're in such a way that you think ending your life is the only way to go, regardless of people or things you love and enjoy, then it's only about yourself.

Unless someone has been there, it's very hard, maybe impossible, for them to understand and that's why they say things like "oh it's a cowards way out".
Same as people who think the same sort of thing about people with serious addiction issues.

I think it's both. They're cowards and brave at the same time.

They're brave for doing arguably one of the toughest things in the world to do. The complete opposite of what nature has designed you to do.

On the other hand, you're a coward because you couldn't face the challenge that was life. Instead of putting in the long hours of pulling yourself up by the bootstraps and fixing your depression, you end it swiftly and quickly. Brave? Yeah. Coward? Yeah.

I went through an insane depression at one point in my life to where suicide was on my mind all the time. The image I had of myself was awful. I was the ugliest person ever. I was the weirdest person ever. I had zero skills. I didn't even think I could hold down a job that high school kids held down. I felt absolutely useless, worthless and like no one other than my family cared about me. I was thinking I was going to end up being one of those guys living in his parents basement who is just locked in his head for his entire existence. The only thing that kept me from ending it was thinking about my family and my siblings who looked up to me.

The world wasn't going to swoop in and pick me up on a wild ride of making friendships, getting laid, making money and being happy. So I had to build myself up from thinking I was the biggest loser in the world to actually being confident with myself. It took a lot of work because those things didn't come naturally to me. I got to experience all the things (other than a 3 some...damn!) that I fantasized about as a teen. Some things turned out to be a disappointment and other things turned out to be better beyond my wildest dreams. I wouldn't have even been able to experience life if I had ended it at that point.

Life is what you make of it. It comes easy for some people and it's extremely difficult for others. Some people have to work at it harder than others but I think everyone can find some level of happiness if they put in the time and effort. It's the most important "job" of your life, yet people give up on it if the skills don't come naturally to them.

 

[dirtypablo]

I wasnt going to post this, and am sure some with think Im a pos for it, but Im at my wits end, I dont know what to do, and wanted to see if anyone has been through something similar. I recently moved across the country, and my ex gf has been making suicide threats pretty much daily since I left. (I now live 2000+ miles away from her.) I never wanted something serious with her, but she is incredibly clingy and every time I would try and end things, she would go nuts and guilt me into staying, so I just kept dating her knowing I would soon be moving and that would be the end of things.

She is going through some rough stuff in her life beyond me leaving her, and had been before I left, but nothing that cant be overcome. The main problem is that no one else in her life cares or takes her seriously, and so Im left to freak out pretty much on a daily basis about whether or not she will make it through the day. She will text me that she is ending things and then not respond for a while, I have tried texting her 'best friend' to get her to go over to her place to check on her, and she just doesnt take it seriously. I asked her to go check on her, and her response was, "Ive been texting her, she isnt listening, she is being very stubborn." And Im like wtf? Thats it? I eventually called her on it, and told her she needed to step up and do something, and she told me its my fault and then blocked my number. Ive texted her mom, and she responds 'k.' Ive wanted to call the police/ambulance, but I dont know her apartment number, and she most likely has drugs on her, and if she got caught she would lose her job ect, and Im scared it would just make things worse.

I do care about her, and want her to get better. But nothing I say helps, and even when she seems to start doing better, she'll then want to chat all day, and then gets into "when can I come visit, we could maybe get back together" etc, and then I put a stop to it and we start the whole cycle over again. Pretty much every night I go to sleep not knowing if she'll make it through the night, and every morning I check my phone every 5 minutes for a text to see if she is still alive. I just started a new job, and have hardly been able to sleep at night, and when Im at work I can barely concentrate, and if she texts me something suicidal while Im at work, I spend the rest of the day zoning out not able to do anything.

I feel like a horrible person for thinking like this, but its like how long can this go on? What am I supposed to do? I cant remember the last time I was happy, I feel stressed out, guilty, helpless, and depressed pretty much 24/7. I get mad at her, then feel guilty for being mad at her, then mad at her for making me feel guilty and so on. Ive snapped at her a few times, and am so frustrated and beaten down by the situation that I have to do breathing exercises to calm myself pretty much every time we talk. I know I sound like a piece of shit, and feel guilty as hell about it. But at what point do I put my own life first? If I was there, it would be a completely different situation. But Im not, and there is only so much I can do from 2000 miles away. Its killing me but I want my life back.

 

[HUNTERMANIA]

You totally DON'T sound like a piece of shit, bro. You're trying to do all the right things, you're trying to help. There's nothing blameworthy about any of that. You don't need to feel guilt at all. You're a very good person going by that post.

 

[philth]

Ive wanted to call the police/ambulance, but I dont know her apartment number

You totally DON'T sound like a piece of shit, bro. You're trying to do all the right things, you're trying to help. There's nothing blameworthy about any of that. You don't need to feel guilt at all. You're a very good person going by that post.

^ this.

You're not the least bit a pos man.

Trick her into giving you her address, tell her your sending her a care package or something. get the address, next time she threatens, call the police/ambulance. that's your care package. you care enough to try and get her professional help. after that, break it off. there's only so much you can do, and it seems like its tearing you apart, which is completely unfair to you.

 

[Err]

Yeah I was about to say there wasn't one sentence or part of your post that made you come off like an asshole. You seem like a really sympathetic person trying to do all you can to help.

 

[Matt M]

It does differ but in general I would say that people who keep using suicide as a threat are very unlikely to actually go through with it.
Most suicides seem to be more or less out of the blue, most people who do it don't have some kind of big build up to it.

Using it as a threat is just a cry for attention and help.

 

[HUNTERMANIA]

It does differ but in general I would say that people who keep using suicide as a threat are very unlikely to actually go through with it.
Most suicides seem to be more or less out of the blue, most people who do it don't have some kind of big build up to it.

Using it as a threat is just a cry for attention and help.

Maybe it's not a threat and she just wants to know that she feels loved or she doesn't think it's worth living? I don't agree with that line of thinking for every case.

 

[dirtypablo]

^ this.

You're not the least bit a pos man.

Trick her into giving you her address, tell her your sending her a care package or something. get the address, next time she threatens, call the police/ambulance. that's your care package. you care enough to try and get her professional help. after that, break it off. there's only so much you can do, and it seems like its tearing you apart, which is completely unfair to you.

Ive actually tried that. Told her I had some stuff to send her, and asked for the address , but she wouldnt give it to me. I know the apartment complex and which apartment it is, just not the actual number and dont know if I could describe it to an ambulance or if they would go door to door.

The other thing is, sometimes it seems like shes serious, others not so much. Thats part of whats hard. Once when she was saying this stuff I told her I was going to contact her mom and tell her everything, and immediately she changed her attitude. Since then Ive told her she is putting me in that situation and Im not going to not do anything, so I just text her mom. I usually give her a warning, and she stops, but a few times she has said she doesnt care, and to just do it. So, Im in the position of not wanting to call the ambulance because if I do and she isnt fully serious, and she loses her job, has to spend a few days in the hospital, etc, it might just make things worse.

Deep down I dont think she really wants to do it. What really scares me is that she will take a bunch of pills and get drunk, then not knowing how much she has taken take more and accidentally do it.

 

[philth]

So, Im in the position of not wanting to call the ambulance because if I do and she isnt fully serious, and she loses her job, has to spend a few days in the hospital, etc, it might just make things worse.

this may sound harsh but.. (and I do acknowledge that you're in a tough spot for sure)
If she hasn't just done it yet, she won't ever do it. it's all empty threats and a cry for attention to rattle you, and her mission to screw with your life is working.
there's gotta be a way for you to find that apartment number, her mom other friends, etc.. then next time call the cops. You've cared enough about this problem, no need to worry about what happens to her and her job and whatever else after that. it's a tough choice but for your own health it's gotta be done.
call the cops, then immediately change ALL of you contact information - you've done all you can and the only person you're hurting at this point is yourself.. and that's no way to live man.

Good luck man. you deserve it for once.

 

[Nonsense]

Dirtypablo, do you know her family members or anybody her close friends?

I know this is uncomfortable, but I really think that the most compassionate thing for you to do is to get one of them involved and then back out for a while. She seems to be grieving your relationship, and badly. That is not to say that you or she is doing anything wrong. But every time you engage with her, her grieving process is interrupted and returned to the start line.

I know it sounds cruel and she will think you are cruel, but take it from someone who knows. The best thing you can do for her is to not speak to her again.