WRL62

[waiguoren]

The mission of the NYT is not related to advancing any particular candidate, and it executes its mission at least roughly as well as any similar organization. That matters.

Regardless of whether I agree with your premises or not, no, it doesn't matter in this conversation about whether NYT headlines are biased against or in favor of certain candidates.

I don't really watch anything regularly on YT, and I'm not sure if I've ever seen the show you're referring to. Your claim seems surprising given what I know about the publication, but I'm not in a position to address it, except in the general way that identifying bias in someone else is always complicated because you must first correctly assess your own bias and then record observations in a way that doesn't introduce more bias (as relying on memory would).

Here are the last 20 titles of The Hill's Youtube show that relate to the 2020 race:

0) Intercept's Ryan Grimm: How progressives are changing the Democratic Party.
1) Panel: Why a Hillary 2.0 strategy won't work in 2020
2) Biden's best moment exposes fundamental weaknesses
3) Panel: Bernie up, Warren up. Biden, Kamala down.
4) The Hill's Rafael Bernal explain's Bernie's appeal to Latinos
5) Biden's past keeps coming back to bite him
6) Panel: Do Biden's gaffes make him unelectable?
7) What Biden gets so wrong
8) Panel: Andrew Yang qualifies for Third Debate
9) Panel: New poll Bernie and Biden Beat Trump
10) Debunking the myth that Bernie Sanders is unelectable
11) Iowa Democratic Chair: Sanders, Warren have drawn biggest crowds
12) Panel: Why Elon Musk is supporting Andrew Yang
13) Dismantling Biden's gaffe excuses
14) New poll: Bernie consolidates second choice support
15) Panel: How Biden's gaffes could cost him against Trump
16) New poll: Biden's support plummets among college students
17) David Pakman to Dems: Don't play to the center
18) Krystal Ball educates the media on Tulsi Gabbard
19) Kamala Harris lands big Iowa endorsement



Assuming the sample size were 10x larger, is it really your position that it takes "super-human" ability to detect bias here?

Your approach, if well-executed, would approximate the processes that produced the headlines in the first place (highly informed people trained to root out political bias--excluding bothsidesist bias--working together to prevent it).

You assume much more about the way the headlines are written than I do. I think you should re-examine how much you actually know about how NYT politics headlines are created.

 

[Prokofievian]

Which book? I grabbed Inadequate Equilibrium or whatever when he was giving it away, but I didn't make it very far. That unedited prose (see also: N.N.Taleb) is a chore to navigate.

I have some issues with his AI stuff too, but I'm a little green on the subject still. Superintelligence was more accessible but still felt a bit off somehow. I never thought I'd say this, but I was actually hoping Sam Harris would put out a book on the topic (following up his TED Talk) because I need the ideas formulated a little more clearly to work with them.

 

[Tycho- Taylor's Version]

Maybe I should say that I need to find someone who is clearly and earnestly wrong about the topic so I can better understand what I think lol.

 

[Higus]

Isn't union busting awesome? Either you suck your boss's dick or you suck poverty's dick. Great options.

I was listening to a podcast with Michael Moore as a guest. He noted that a (possibly intended) consequence of the country's demonization of unions and safety net programs is that the average worker is too afraid to ask for increases to benefits or compensation, even when their productivity goes up and their working conditions deteriorate.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Regardless of whether I agree with your premises or not, no, it doesn't matter in this conversation about whether NYT headlines are biased against or in favor of certain candidates.

Here are the last 20 titles of The Hill's Youtube show that relate to the 2020 race:

0) Intercept's Ryan Grimm: How progressives are changing the Democratic Party.
1) Panel: Why a Hillary 2.0 strategy won't work in 2020
2) Biden's best moment exposes fundamental weaknesses
3) Panel: Bernie up, Warren up. Biden, Kamala down.
4) The Hill's Rafael Bernal explain's Bernie's appeal to Latinos
5) Biden's past keeps coming back to bite him
6) Panel: Do Biden's gaffes make him unelectable?
7) What Biden gets so wrong
8) Panel: Andrew Yang qualifies for Third Debate
9) Panel: New poll Bernie and Biden Beat Trump
10) Debunking the myth that Bernie Sanders is unelectable
11) Iowa Democratic Chair: Sanders, Warren have drawn biggest crowds
12) Panel: Why Elon Musk is supporting Andrew Yang
13) Dismantling Biden's gaffe excuses
14) New poll: Bernie consolidates second choice support
15) Panel: How Biden's gaffes could cost him against Trump
16) New poll: Biden's support plummets among college students
17) David Pakman to Dems: Don't play to the center
18) Krystal Ball educates the media on Tulsi Gabbard
19) Kamala Harris lands big Iowa endorsement

Assuming the sample size were 10x larger, is it really your position that it takes "super-human" ability to detect bias here?

There definitely seems to be a bias in the story choices and opinion pieces. And I think you're misreading me with your last sentence there, as I believe that reading them all at once is another way to noticeably improve your ability to assess the issue (you'll recall that I asked you for something like this with the NYT when we first started discussing this).

Imagine if the challenge was to identify whether a particular news source uses a particular letter in the alphabet an above-average amount of times. I don't think anyone could do it if they're relying on their memories of the past several months, but if it's all on a page to be looked at at once, they'd have a much better chance.

You assume much more about the way the headlines are written than I do. I think you should re-examine how much you actually know about how NYT politics headlines are created.

I don't assume anything. I'm relying on my own experience as well as that of people I know.

 

[waiguoren]

There definitely seems to be a bias in the story choices and opinion pieces. And I think you're misreading me with your last sentence there, as I believe that reading them all at once is another way to noticeably improve your ability to assess the issue (you'll recall that I asked you for something like this with the NYT when we first started discussing this).

So your position is that bias can be detected? Where's the disagreement?

Imagine if the challenge was to identify whether a particular news source uses a particular letter in the alphabet an above-average amount of times. I don't think anyone could do it if they're relying on their memories of the past several months, but if it's all on a page to be looked at at once, they'd have a much better chance.

That's a really bad analogy. Our brains don't process individual letters as they process concepts and people.

I don't assume anything. I'm relying on my own experience as well as that of people I know.

Ok, that risks branching us into off-topic territory. The point is that it doesn't matter how the headlines come about if our sole purpose is to determine favorability/unfavorability for particular candidates in NYT published headlines.

 

[My Spot]

Gosh, I dunno. The american system of having different levels of crime is so fucking retarded it's hard to tell. So I'll just say ''different culture, hard to judge.''

Per the FBI, violent crime is murder/non-negligent manslaughter, rape, armed robbery, and aggravated assault. I think it's fair.

 

[My Spot]

True. But my post was in reply to someone insulting me first. These would be examples of someone flaming another poster without provocation:
Those, unlike my post, were naked flaming.
And, consistent with the First Amendment, I really do believe that truth is an absolute defense. So, in my defense, @Farmer Br0wn really is not intelligent enough to understand a lot of things, and one of those things is clearly the concept of intelligence itself. That is as undeniable as the fact that @MadDildo is a sexless, underachieving loser with no friends and a tiny dick. And me telling Farmer Brown that is far, far closer to the mere statement of fact than him telling me I'm dumber than Donald Trump.

"But what about..."

 

[My Spot]

So, is it game on? I mean if we're endorsing the manipulation of posters into screwing themselves, there are some very clever people who can make that game a blowout. I don't think that's a good direction for the WR, though.

It was one of y'all who emailed Crave Media over a joke in the OT. You started the "game." Don't try and be Triple H when you're Shane Douglas instead.

 

[Prokofievian]

Per the FBI, violent crime is murder/non-negligent manslaughter, rape, armed robbery, and aggravated assault. I think it's fair.

No I mean, you have state crimes and federal crimes. Which is pretty silly, IMO.

 

[Jack V Savage]

So your position is that bias can be detected? Where's the disagreement?

Bias can't be detected from memory in a NYT-like publication.

That's a really bad analogy. Our brains don't process individual letters as they process concepts and people.

I think it's a good analogy, and your objection is bad.

Ok, that risks branching us into off-topic territory. The point is that it doesn't matter how the headlines come about if our sole purpose is to determine favorability/unfavorability for particular candidates in NYT published headlines.

But it does matter because it's the opposite of the organization's mission to insert bias into the headlines. If it happens, it's a subtle, inadvertent failure. Your proposed means for detecting bias would be similar to the organization's means of avoiding it. Well, they deliberately insert bothsides bias (and a similar bias would be inserted for a primary).

 

[dissectingaorticaneurysm]

The mission of the NYT is not related to advancing any particular candidate, and it executes its mission at least roughly as well as any similar organization. That matters. I don't really watch anything regularly on YT, and I'm not sure if I've ever seen the show you're referring to. Your claim seems surprising given what I know about the publication, but I'm not in a position to address it, except in the general way that identifying bias in someone else is always complicated because you must first correctly assess your own bias and then record observations in a way that doesn't introduce more bias (as relying on memory would).



That would get around the individual's bias. Your approach, if well-executed, would approximate the processes that produced the headlines in the first place (highly informed people trained to root out political bias--excluding bothsidesist bias--working together to prevent it).

So you really think Sydney Ember presents an objective account of Sanders? Why is she the tasked with reporting on him for the NYT when she has conflicts of interest and proven unchecked bias? She should recuse herself from Sanders coverage out of journalistic integrity.

 

[dissectingaorticaneurysm]

edit

 

[Jesus H. Sherdog]

No I mean, you have state crimes and federal crimes. Which is pretty silly, IMO.

Well a state doesn’t have any jurisdiction outside of its own state. So it’s not silly at all. How else do you enforce laws that cross state lines? Or laws like immigration laws that states can’t enforce?

States don’t all have the same laws, but federal laws apply to all of the states.

 

[Prokofievian]

Well a state doesn’t have any jurisdiction outside of its own state. So it’s not silly at all. How else do you enforce laws that cross state lines? Or laws like immigration laws that states can’t enforce?

Oh, easy, you just don't have state crimes, like everywhere else in the world.

 

[Jesus H. Sherdog]

Oh, easy, you just don't have state crimes, like everywhere else in the world.

Well in countries that don’t have States yeah you don’t have state crimes.

Here states have the right to govern themselves to a degree and make their own laws. I’m sure other countries with states have similar systems, I know Mexico has laws and court customs that vary from state to state.

Why bother having national laws when international law exits right? Who need police in Germany with Interpol and Europol

 

[Prokofievian]

Well in countries that don’t have States yeah you don’t have state crimes.

Here states have the right to govern themselves to a degree and make their own laws. I’m sure other countries with states have similar systems, I know Mexico has laws and court customs that vary from state to state.

Why bother having national laws when international law exits right? Who need police in Germany with Interpol and Europol

Sure, but the states can also govern things that are federal, which is where the silliness comes in. For example, there's a woman now serving a prison sentence in texas because she voted in 2016. She had a criminal record and was a few months short of completing her probation. In something like 30-ish states that is completely legal. Exact same american citizen, in the exact same federal election, exercising her exact same constitutional right is either completely within her rights, or a felon.

That's silly.

 

[Jack V Savage]

So you really think Sydney Ember presents an objective account of Sanders? Why is she the tasked with reporting on him for the NYT when she has conflicts of interest and proven unchecked bias? She should recuse herself from Sanders coverage out of journalistic integrity.

To answer the two questions:

1. Yes.
2. The premise of the question is wrong.

And do you think it would set a good precedent if fans of a candidate were able to bully a reporter who wasn't sufficiently biased into "recusing" herself from a beat?

 

[Deleted member 539235]

@Trotsky
https://forums.sherdog.com/posts/154230659/

here's how it's done, just don't actually use the word 'stupid' and you're all good

 

[senri]

"But what about..."

.... Your body?