Would Fedor's legacy have been hurt had his first post-Pride losses happened in the UFC instead of Strikeforce?

[WOLVERINEKILLS]

I don’t think so. Werdum smoked Cain. Reem clobbered JDS. Arlovski later went on a good run. Everyone loses at some point. Fedor being out of prime after the Sylvia fight combined with actively competing in sambo was losing sooner than later, it doesn’t matter what org it was in.

 

[Tweak896]

No one would shut up about Fedor fighting in UFC after Pride. Like it or not, he would've lost so much if he lost to someone like JDS or Brock. You probably would have people say he was out of prime. Strikeforce was weird last minute matchups it felt like. UFC would've built up Randy vs Fedor then Brock then Cain.

It's a real shame he had that M1 management that had to copromote when every other Pride fighter basically was fine with it.

 

[markg171]

Did you not see the shape Werdum came into that fight?

He was unreasonably out of shape.

Notice how you don't say that you think Werdum would've ever actually beaten JDS.

Just like he also didn't beat him when they rematched 15 years later.

 

[markg171]

I think the orginal question omits what actually DID cement Fedor's Legacy... that after Pride, he beat and finished two recent UFC HW champs in Affliction. KOing Arlavski and mauling Sylvia is what proved that he was the THE BEST HW of that era. The Strikeforce stuff was after that.

So IF Fedor had never fought in Afflication AND went straight to the UFC AND lost, yes it would have diminished his legacy and been known only as the King of Pride (which in turn would have also been diminished).

How does beating Arlovski and Sylvia prove you're the best HW of the era when neither Arlovski or Sylvia were the actual UFC champion because they'd, you know, lost their belts to someone else in the UFC?

Wouldn't, you know, beating that guy be the better thing for proving you're the best?

Cause I mean you do go and admit that when you say if he'd instead gone to the UFC and lost to their current champion that would just make him the King of Pride.

The mental gynmmastics of Fedro fans never fail to amaze me.

 

[markg171]

I don’t think so. Werdum smoked Cain. Reem clobbered JDS. Arlovski later went on a good run. Everyone loses at some point. Fedor being out of prime after the Sylvia fight combined with actively competing in sambo was losing sooner than later, it doesn’t matter what org it was in.

Of course it matters more if you finally lose in a title fight instead of a random HW fight.

Next you'll tell us it also doesn't matter if you lose by robbery split decision in a title fight instead of getting subbed in 60 seconds in a random HW fight.

 

[Kungpowking]

How does beating Arlovski and Sylvia prove you're the best HW of the era when neither Arlovski or Sylvia were the actual UFC champion because they'd, you know, lost their belts to someone else in the UFC?

Wouldn't, you know, beating that guy be the better thing for proving you're the best?

Cause I mean you do go and admit that when you say if he'd instead gone to the UFC and lost to their current champion that would just make him the King of Pride.

The mental gynmmastics of Fedro fans never fail to amaze me.

No gymnastics needed. Just an IQ over 85 to to understand. Fedor became the HW champion of Pride FC in 2003 and held that belt til 2006. During that time the UFC HW championship changed hands 5 times. 4 of those 5 were Tim Sylvia and Arlovski. (dont think anyone doubts Fedor would beat Mir in 2004, but if thats the hill you want to die on, more power to you). I guess one could make the argument that Fedor never beat Cotour who beat Sylvia and defended against Gonzaga. But then who became Interim HW Champ in 2008, Big Nog. The Big Nog that Fedor beat twice in very convincing fashion.

 

[markg171]

No gymnastics needed. Just an IQ over 85 to to understand. Fedor became the HW champion of Pride FC in 2003 and held that belt til 2006. During that time the UFC HW championship changed hands 5 times. 4 of those 5 were Tim Sylvia and Arlovski. (dont think anyone doubts Fedor would beat Mir in 2004, but if thats the hill you want to die on, more power to you). I guess one could make the argument that Fedor never beat Cotour who beat Sylvia and defended against Gonzaga. But then who became Interim HW Champ in 2008, Big Nog. The Big Nog that Fedor beat twice in very convincing fashion.

Long winded way of saying the UFC HW champion was actually Randy due to the fact he'd dominated Sylvia first and then defended against the guy who dominated Fedor's biggest foe Cro Cop, and the interim champ was Nog who also beat Sylvia before Fedor too and then lost to Mir. Who had also beaten Sylvia years prior in another title fight. You could've just said Fedor fought a dude who had lost his last 2 UFC championship fights and a 3rd to another champ at the time.

While skipping over entirely that Brock then wins that whole UFC champion mini tourney anyways shortly thereafter too which is why the conversation then shifted to wanted Brock vs Fedor.

You guys would be a hell of a lot more credible if you simply went with the factual argument that beating Sylvia and Arlovski were GOOD wins but proved nothing in solidfying if Fedor actually was better than his UFC counterparts as they weren't his by then. Neither were stripped of their belts, they'd lost them in title fights to better fighters. It wasn't some big super secret mystery as to who the best in the UFC were like you guys want to pretend it was for your narratives.

 

[Kungpowking]

Long winded way of saying the UFC HW champion was actually Randy due to the fact he'd dominated Sylvia first and then defended against the guy who dominated Fedor's biggest foe Cro Cop, and the interim champ was Nog who also beat Sylvia before Fedor too and then lost to Mir. Who had also beaten Sylvia years prior in another title fight. You could've just said Fedor fought a dude who had lost his last 2 UFC championship fights and a 3rd to another champ at the time.

While skipping over entirely that Brock then wins that whole UFC champion mini tourney anyways shortly thereafter too which is why the conversation then shifted to wanted Brock vs Fedor.

You guys would be a hell of a lot more credible if you simply went with the factual argument that beating Sylvia and Arlovski were GOOD wins but proved nothing in solidfying if Fedor actually was better than his UFC counterparts as they weren't his by then. Neither were stripped of their belts, they'd lost them in title fights to better fighters. It wasn't some big super secret mystery as to who the best in the UFC were like you guys want to pretend it was for your narratives.

 

[markg171]

You guys are incredibly insecure about the fact that Fedor avoided the UFC for 17 years after Pride.

Maybe one day you'll get over it.

 

[WOLVERINEKILLS]

Of course it matters more if you finally lose in a title fight instead of a random HW fight.

Next you'll tell us it also doesn't matter if you lose by robbery split decision in a title fight instead of getting subbed in 60 seconds in a random HW fight.

I never said it did or did not, but a loss is a loss whether a belt is on the line or not.

 

[WOLVERINEKILLS]

You guys are incredibly insecure about the fact that Fedor avoided the UFC for 17 years after Pride.

Maybe one day you'll get over it.

Show us on the doll where Fedor penetrated you… it’s okay, you’re safe now…

 

[Mind Mine]

He's just trolling.
Fact is Hendo is a Pride guy...further cementing the greatness of All Pride fighters.
Pride > UFC

So getting tossed around like a small child by Brett Rogers a round? Top tier Pride stuff?

 

[VinceArch]

So getting tossed around like a small child by Brett Rogers a round? Top tier Pride stuff?

Bob Sapp tossed Minotauro around in Pride. Moreso than Brett Rogers did to Fedor. In fact, Fedor wasn't tossed around at all.

 

[djacobox372]

I think Fedor likely beats Lesnar and Randy, which would cement his legacy not hurt it.

 

[djacobox372]

Dan Henderson literally needed rocks in his shorts to even make the 206lb HW minimum for his fight with Fedor.

Which was originally a catchweight 220lb fight until Hendo said "lol there's no way I can make 220lb and it has to be HW so I can even make 206lb" and Coker scrambled to make it a HW fight after Hendo exposed the size difference there.

Which caused Fedor to still do a gentleman's agreement and still actually cut from his usual 235 down to 222lbs once he realized the size difference at play.

Hendo is definitely a small fighter, get the fuck out of here. As guys like Rogan have said countless times though, when you put your arm around him for an interview his muscles are like rock hard wires however. He's small but dense, a tough and grizzled wiry motherfucker like men used to be.

Fedor was dominating Hendo until he got caught by a shot that only Dan could land with power. Not to mention Fedor landing in an awkward position that led to a quick stoppage. Shit happens.

 

[markg171]

Fedor was dominating Hendo until he got caught by a shot that only Dan could land with power. Not to mention Fedor landing in an awkward position that led to a quick stoppage. Shit happens.

Yes, most of Fedor's losses are due to fighting like an idiot. Not prime related.

 

[markg171]

I never said it did or did not, but a loss is a loss whether a belt is on the line or not.

It's actually not seeing as a title being on the line would generally indicate it's a higher level fight than a non-title fight and so a title loss isn't as bad.

 

[HHJ]

@markg171 got shoved into lockers by PrideFC fans confirmed.

 

[markg171]

@markg171 got shoved into lockers by PrideFC fans confirmed.

The only thing gayer than posting on a karate forum is being part of a club within it.

 

[HHJ]

The only thing gayer than posting on a karate forum is being part of a club within it.