Why don't thais set up their kicks?

[jtwarwagon4life]

I'm not talking about them. To be clear, I really got into muay thai after watching Sittichai/Roosmalen 1 and stumbling on this forum. I was a silly little mma dork who read jack slack and believed everything he said, and since coming out of that phase I haven't really paid attention to sports bloggers.

My problem is really with the audience who don't care about muay thai (though that's fine on its own) and the ideas that are allowed to run rampant. Since I went straight from mma dork to muay thai hipster I don't really know how kickboxing fans are different from mma fans, but from the sounds of it it's the same shit.

A lot of mma coaches/fighters/writers also believe the same nonsense and they have a reasonably close connection to kickboxing, you'd think they would be corrected at some point.

I don't think there is any real difference between the attitudes, about muay thai, that some random idiots on Reddit have and those of sports bloggers in the MMA and kickfighting sphere. Look at the things which Sherdog and Bloody Elbow put out, look at what Ruebusch, Wyman, Slack, Kenshin, Thomas, Coffeen, Breen, etc. have to say about muay thai, when they talk about it at all. They all subcribe to the "traditional" vs "modern" distinction, they all explicitly denigrate the way that Thais fight and almost exclusively praise the ones that fight abroad for being more "modern".

 

[Tayski]

I think culture and proximity is more relevant to fans than skin color

Exactly.

An example to prove that is how most Western MMA writers, journalists, and even fans don't have a clue about the Russian MMA scene, all the skillful fighters they have there - even just knowing the names, what fights are taking place, etc. Unless those fighters are fighting in international promotions like Fedor and Khabib for example, nobody knows who all the others are apart from the very very hardcore MMA fans and people who actually train MMA.

It's more about proximity, culture, and marketing than it is about skin colour.

I can guarantee you that if the Muay Thai stadium fights were broadcasted on Western TV with Western commentary, there would be a lot more awareness and following than currently where you gotta do your own research, watch the fights on youtube after they've happened with the commentary being either in Thai or non existent.

I managed to get my girlfriend into both MMA and Kickboxing because there's marketing around the fighters and English commentary. She understands the sports and the rules, knows the fighters and has her favourites regardless of colours. Getting her into Muay Thai stadium fights is impossible, not because they're Thai (she actually loves Thailand and Thai people and a fan of Thai fighters in Kickboxing), but because there is 0 marketing around the fighters, and no English commentary of the fights. Hell I can even get her to watch promotions like Yokkao because at least there's some English commentary.

 

[Thycidides]

Mostly things that go unnoticed. Slogging through years of records to make wiki pages (Sagetdao, Singdam, Pornsaneh, Sam-A etc..), made a bunch of highlights with many of them (best of the month highlights) taking lots of time, sieved probably thousands of fights which made it so people could avoid the shitty matches and instead see the good fights they might not have known about. On top of that I pretty much introduced philosophy of Muay Thai.

What is the philosophy of Muay Thai?

 

[Thycidides]

There certainly is some ethnocentrism going on. Also I think people like Jack Slack that are familiar more with karate have some bias against Muay Thai. I just had an argument with a karate fan in the striking technique section for that could not imagine Mauy Thai as anything but "stand and bang".

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

Also I think people like Jack Slack that are familiar more with karate have some bias against Muay Thai.

Muay thai doesn't have enough front snap kicks.

 

[freaky]

Because they still land it. How are they landing so many kicks if they don't set it up? Maybe you just don't see it.

 

[verrix]

There certainly is some ethnocentrism going on. Also I think people like Jack Slack that are familiar more with karate have some bias against Muay Thai. I just had an argument with a karate fan in the striking technique section for that could not imagine Mauy Thai as anything but "stand and bang".

Second-option bias is painfully common on the internet as well. People see a common idea and are likely to accept the contrary position with little evidence because being counter to the norm feels automatically smart to people. Muay Thai is especially vulnerable to this since there is still a lot of respect for it, or at least for the vague idea of the "Muay Thai Striker" that throws leg kicks or w/e, but nobody really knows anything about it so it's easily "debunked."

also 10/10 on the first post you're still tricking people somehow

 

[Tayski]

There certainly is some ethnocentrism going on. Also I think people like Jack Slack that are familiar more with karate have some bias against Muay Thai. I just had an argument with a karate fan in the striking technique section for that could not imagine Mauy Thai as anything but "stand and bang".

That guy you were arguing with wasn't a karate guy though, he was from Tae Kwon Do and he's a bit of a weirdo.

I'm from a Karate background, Shotokan and then Kyokushin, and all the people I've trained with have a huge respect for Muay Thai. In Kyokushin, Muay Thai is almost seen as a kind of rival as they're considered tough fighters and can bring good fights.

I don't think there's such a bias against Muay Thai, there is much more a bias from MT people against Karate and other arts with forms IMO especially on this forum, they consider it lesser arts.

 

[Snubnoze707]

So, once two thais have gone through the rigmarole of beating up a couple of white boy, they are given the kickfighting gold stamp of approval. Once, that happens fights between two thais are acceptable, even very interesting. Since now they're two of the greatest fighters who ever lived and totally legit.

You're an idiot. I've cared about Thai vs Thai matches probably longer than you've even known about the sport.

 

[AbeRudder]

I managed to get my girlfriend into both MMA and Kickboxing because there's marketing around the fighters and English commentary. She understands the sports and the rules, knows the fighters and has her favourites regardless of colours. Getting her into Muay Thai stadium fights is impossible, not because they're Thai (she actually loves Thailand and Thai people and a fan of Thai fighters in Kickboxing), but because there is 0 marketing around the fighters, and no English commentary of the fights. Hell I can even get her to watch promotions like Yokkao because at least there's some English commentary.

This put an image in my head of Cocakillbana taking some girl he met off tinder back to his house and making her watch hours of 108lb muay thai fights whilst talking about the balance constantly.

 

[shincheckin]

muay thai, kyokushin, boxing, high level tkd. seems about it for striking.

 

[MinhHau]

I trained in Muay , they like to kick fisrt to setup their punches

 

[Thycidides]

Second-option bias is painfully common on the internet as well. People see a common idea and are likely to accept the contrary position with little evidence because being counter to the norm feels automatically smart to people. Muay Thai is especially vulnerable to this since there is still a lot of respect for it, or at least for the vague idea of the "Muay Thai Striker" that throws leg kicks or w/e, but nobody really knows anything about it so it's easily "debunked."

also 10/10 on the first post you're still tricking people somehow

Yeah people often argue out of their ass in an attempt to seem clever.

You think Jack Slack does that? He doesn't really talk about Muay Thai. I read something he wrote about Seanchai once but other than that nothing about Mauy Thai.

And is that line about tricking people directed at me?

 

[verrix]

Yeah people often argue out of their ass in an attempt to seem clever.

You think Jack Slack does that? He doesn't really talk about Muay Thai. I read something he wrote about Seanchai once but other than that nothing about Maut Thai.

And is that line about tricking people directed at me?

I don't think people are consciously bullshitting to seem clever, more like they see a new and exciting idea and run with it before actually thinking it through. I meant people in general, I don't know what slack's deal is (besides the karate fetish he has).

I meant the guy above me who gave a serious reply to the first post. And the other guy above you now, actually.

 

[Cocakillbana]

nevermind then. Thought you had some dispute with someone on here, for not putting your name on some article (?) or something.

Apparently I confused my dreams for being reality. I thought I produced some content for liverkick, but I didn't.

 

[Cocakillbana]

What is the philosophy of Muay Thai?

Philosophy was probably not a good way of putting it. Something like Muay Thai reason would be more accurate, or the effort to bring common sense to Muay Thai. There are usually logical and straightforward explanations for most of what I say on the matter, with artifice, hype and fabrication having no place. It's pretentious of me to say I introduced thinking about Muay Thai, but I don't believe my thoughts on the sport were (are) common throughout English speaking muay thai fandom.

 

[Cocakillbana]

This put an image in my head of Cocakillbana taking some girl he met off tinder back to his house and making her watch hours of 108lb muay thai fights whilst talking about the balance constantly.

I'd start her off with lots of heavyweights and then later go to a single 108 pound fight. If she's a keeper it would take her just one fight to acknowledge the superiority of the smaller fighters. That's the test.

 

[Tayski]

I'd start her off with lots of heavyweights and then later go to a single 108 pound fight. If she's a keeper it would take her just one fight to acknowledge the superiority of the smaller fighters. That's the test.

Could also just mean that she gets turned on by midgets.

 

[SuperLuigi]

Could also just mean that she gets turned on by midgets.