Who is Floyds 50 fight?

[PUO3]

Not true. I call out bullshit and if it happens to be one of your boys, you get snarky.
As for Canelo/Floyd, it was a big disparity in skills and Floyd would have to fall off tremendously to lose, anyway waiting for someone to get old isn't really proving anything.

Its entirely true. You shit on everyone outside of a very select few. Mainly Pac and Joshua.

 

[burningspear]

Its entirely true. You shit on everyone outside of a very select few. Mainly Pac and Joshua.

BS tactics from Floyd, Canelo and Wilder isn't everyone old chap.

btw.. What a fantastic display from Frampton, he fought the fight of his life, loved every second. To watch two top tier guys in their prime is mesmerising.

 

[Canelo]

Just that size gives a fighter an advantage. Did you really watch Canelo vs Cotto and not think that size played a role?

Of course size plays a role, but I'm not going to just attribute everything Canelo did in that fight to a 10lb weight advantage, it's simply an ignorant way to assess a boxing match.

When I saw Canelo do this:

and this:

I didn't think 'oh well that was expected, Canelo is bigger' - that would be beyond ignorant. What you see in the above GIF's and most exchanges in the fight is superior boxing skill, and there's no dressing it up. better punch selection, accuracy, speed and timing. Those uppercuts are much more to do with Canelo having the best uppercut in the sport, than him having a size advantage.

I mentioned to Slim and Nac about the left hook. Canelo's size didn't help him defend the left hook, he defended it by holding his right glove close to his chin. Here' an example of what I was referencing, a blocked power shot from Cotto and a very accurate left hook response from Canelo:

In the instances where Canelo backed Cotto up and put some damage on him then yes, it is more than fair to argue that Canelo's size helped him out there. However, the majority of the fight was contested in the middle of the ring and Canelo was happy to box with Cotto and counter him hard, if anything that is a strategy that suits the smaller, lighter fighter who has the better jab.

There were so many exchanges in this fight that showcased Canelo's superior boxing skill, it really does baffle me that someone can review the fight and conclude that Canelo was simply 'bigger and fresher', and not mention the fact that Canelo was the vastly superior boxer in 8/10 exchanges. Those extra pounds don't make Canelo punch more accurately than Cotto, they don't help the timing of his defense and they don't make him a better counter puncher. If Canelo had Cotto pinned down for the entirety of the fight I could see the argument, but it was boxer-puncher style fight in the middle of the ring and outside of the jab, Canelo was sharper absolutely everywhere.

If you are talking about this fight and not mentioning the stuff I covered above and simply focusing on size then you are being disingenuous to what actually happened. You can mention how size played a role, but there's a big AND that needs to follow.

 

[LangfordBarrow]

Of course size plays a role, but I'm not going to just attribute everything Canelo did in that fight to a 10lb weight advantage, it's simply an ignorant way to assess a boxing match.

When I saw Canelo do this:

and this:

I didn't think 'oh well that was expected, Canelo is bigger' - that would be beyond ignorant. What you see in the above GIF's and most exchanges in the fight is superior boxing skill, and there's no dressing it up. better punch selection, accuracy, speed and timing. Those uppercuts are much more to do with Canelo having the best uppercut in the sport, than him having a size advantage.

I mentioned to Slim and Nac about the left hook. Canelo's size didn't help him defend the left hook, he defended it by holding his right glove close to his chin. Here' an example of what I was referencing, a blocked power shot from Cotto and a very accurate left hook response from Canelo:

In the instances where Canelo backed Cotto up and put some damage on him then yes, it is more than fair to argue that Canelo's size helped him out there. However, the majority of the fight was contested in the middle of the ring and Canelo was happy to box with Cotto and counter him hard, if anything that is a strategy that suits the smaller, lighter fighter who has the better jab.

There were so many exchanges in this fight that showcased Canelo's superior boxing skill, it really does baffle me that someone can review the fight and conclude that Canelo was simply 'bigger and fresher', and not mention the fact that Canelo was the vastly superior boxer in 8/10 exchanges. Those extra pounds don't make Canelo punch more accurately than Cotto, they don't help the timing of his defense and they don't make him a better counter puncher. If Canelo had Cotto pinned down for the entirety of the fight I could see the argument, but it was boxer-puncher style fight in the middle of the ring and outside of the jab, Canelo was sharper absolutely everywhere.

If you are talking about this fight and not mentioning the stuff I covered above and simply focusing on size then you are being disingenuous to what actually happened. You can mention how size played a role, but there's a big AND that needs to follow.

Ok tl;dr all of it. I'm not saying Canelo has no skill or didn't do well or even that he didn't deserve to win. All I'm saying is that it didn't take long to realize Cotto wasn't big enough. In the grand scheme of things I don't think it's a fight many people will point to in the future when talking about how great Canelo was.

 

[Canelo]

Ok tl;dr all of it. I'm not saying Canelo has no skill or didn't do well or even that he didn't deserve to win. All I'm saying is that it didn't take long to realize Cotto wasn't big enough. In the grand scheme of things I don't think it's a fight many people will point to in the future when talking about how great Canelo was.

I'm not going to waste much more time on you given that a couple of paragraphs was too much for you to handle.

I've already replied to your points so if there's anything else you want to discuss then I'm afraid you'll have to consult that monstrous reply of mine and forge a counter argument all on your own.

 

[nac386]

Cotto had to fight as the smaller man, using his jab and movement, as opposed to the more aggressive style that made Cotto what he is. Coming into a fight against a much larger guy, at an advanced stage in his career, and having to adjust to a style that really is not what made you champion is a very admirable thing to do. For a guy who fights like Cotto, a lot of things have to change when you step into the ring with a guy who is much larger, stronger, and younger than you.

We will see if Canelo shows the same testicular fortitude that Cotto has shown over the years. We'll see if he fights a guy like GGG, who is his own size, or if he goes up to fight a young prime 168 pounder when he's in his mid-30s.

First things first, though. Let's see how long it takes prime Canelo to fight a middleweight that is already in his mid-30's.

 

[LangfordBarrow]

I'm not going to waste much more time on you given that a couple of paragraphs was too much for you to handle.

I've already replied to your points so if there's anything else you want to discuss then I'm afraid you'll have to consult that monstrous reply of mine and forge a counter argument all on your own.

I will after work = )

PS I did skim through it...

 

[LangfordBarrow]

I'm not going to waste much more time on you given that a couple of paragraphs was too much for you to handle.

I've already replied to your points so if there's anything else you want to discuss then I'm afraid you'll have to consult that monstrous reply of mine and forge a counter argument all on your own.

Right, I read it all, and like I responded earlier. The biggest factor was size. It seemed pretty obvious to me. Canelo has skill but he needs to step up. If it's the way you claim with his boxing ability then he would take the GGG and be confident of winning. If all that skill is there the way you wrote then if GGG has the weight advantage Canelo will still win. And I do watch Canelo's fights and appreciate him but this whole GGG mess has left him with egg on his face.

 

[Strange King]

Well since we keep getting these joke fights canelo khan and brook ggg

Floyd should fight Carl frampton for his 50th fight

 

[burningspear]

If Brook upsets Golovkin, Floyd's spider sense will be tingling like fuck.

 

[Canelo]

Cotto had to fight as the smaller man, using his jab and movement, as opposed to the more aggressive style that made Cotto what he is. Coming into a fight against a much larger guy, at an advanced stage in his career, and having to adjust to a style that really is not what made you champion is a very admirable thing to do. For a guy who fights like Cotto, a lot of things have to change when you step into the ring with a guy who is much larger, stronger, and younger than you.

We will see if Canelo shows the same testicular fortitude that Cotto has shown over the years. We'll see if he fights a guy like GGG, who is his own size, or if he goes up to fight a young prime 168 pounder when he's in his mid-30s.

First things first, though. Let's see how long it takes prime Canelo to fight a middleweight that is already in his mid-30's.

Canelo was at the very most 10lbs heavier and Cotto had already knocked out two naturally bigger middleweights before the Canelo fight.

The evidence speaks for it's self, Canelo was simply the better boxer. They had a boxing match in the center of the ring and he got outskilled. You knew that Canelo was the bigger man before the fight and still predicted that Cotto would back him up and fight an aggressive fight. When I told you this wouldn't be the case, your reply was along the lines of "When has Cotto not fought like that", almost as if the Margarito fights didn't exist.

Cotto is not a brawler, he is a boxer puncher, this was not an unfamiliar strategy for him, he has always been regarded as having very good boxing skills and one of the best jabs in the game. Canelo fought him at that game and was better at it. You can ignore it all you want, but whether you like it or not, Canelo's took away most of Cotto's offense because he has a world class defense, not because he was 10lbs heavier. I'm willing to accept that size give Canelo an advantage in certain areas of the fight, but you're just coming across as bitter when you evaluate the fight and don't mention anything about Canelo countering the shit out of Cotto in almost every round.

 

[Canelo]

Right, I read it all, and like I responded earlier. The biggest factor was size. It seemed pretty obvious to me. Canelo has skill but he needs to step up. If it's the way you claim with his boxing ability then he would take the GGG and be confident of winning. If all that skill is there the way you wrote then if GGG has the weight advantage Canelo will still win. And I do watch Canelo's fights and appreciate him but this whole GGG mess has left him with egg on his face.

Sorry, but your posts are barely worth replying to.

You don't substantiate any counter arguments, and constantly reference GGG in a discussion that has nothing to do with him. If the biggest factor was size, you should be able to provide counter arguments as to why Cnaelo was faster, slicker and the all round better boxer in the center of the ring. I have absolutely no doubt that you will not do that.

 

[LangfordBarrow]

Sorry, but your posts are barely worth replying to.

You don't substantiate any counter arguments, and constantly reference GGG in a discussion that has nothing to do with him. If the biggest factor was size, you should be able to provide counter arguments as to why Cnaelo was faster, slicker and the all round better boxer in the center of the ring. I have absolutely no doubt that you will not do that.

What counter arguments do I need? He was the bigger and younger guy and I believe those reasons were more of a factor than his amazing speed and slickness.

 

[LangfordBarrow]

Canelo was at the very most 10lbs heavier and Cotto had already knocked out two naturally bigger middleweights before the Canelo fight.

The evidence speaks for it's self, Canelo was simply the better boxer. They had a boxing match in the center of the ring and he got outskilled. You knew that Canelo was the bigger man before the fight and still predicted that Cotto would back him up and fight an aggressive fight. When I told you this wouldn't be the case, your reply was along the lines of "When has Cotto not fought like that", almost as if the Margarito fights didn't exist.

Cotto is not a brawler, he is a boxer puncher, this was not an unfamiliar strategy for him, he has always been regarded as having very good boxing skills and one of the best jabs in the game. Canelo fought him at that game and was better at it. You can ignore it all you want, but whether you like it or not, Canelo's took away most of Cotto's offense because he has a world class defense, not because he was 10lbs heavier. I'm willing to accept that size give Canelo an advantage in certain areas of the fight, but you're just coming across as bitter when you evaluate the fight and don't mention anything about Canelo countering the shit out of Cotto in almost every round.

How do you know he was no more than 10 pounds heavier?

 

[Canelo]

What counter arguments do I need? He was the bigger and younger guy and I believe those reasons were more of a factor than his amazing speed and slickness.

Are you broken?

The whole point of a debate is that you provide evidence that supports your claims. Simply saying he was bigger and younger, that's why he won is a rubbish argument. Mainly because it ignores what actually happened in the fight and is supported by nothing over than 'he was bigger'. The difference in the fight come down to Canelo landing the cleaner shots and neutralizing Cotto's offense. If you want to substantiate how that is more to do with a 10lb size advantage and not boxing skill, feel free, if not, we can leave it there.

 

[Canelo]

How do you know he was no more than 10 pounds heavier?

Because Canelo rehydrates to the low 70's and Cotto to the low 60's. Cotto said immediately after the weigh in that he would be rehydrating, so he'd only need to gain 5-7 pounds during that re hydration period for my estimates to be correct.

Daniel Geale weighed more than Canelo when he fought Cotto, shame his size wasn't enough to stop him getting bulldozed.

 

[burningspear]

Floyd was smaller than Canelo and won pretty easily.
Am I the only one who wouldn't have been surprised if Cotto received the nod?
Is Canelo's refusal to reveal his fight night weight the biggest bitch move yet of this ongoing saga?

 

[LangfordBarrow]

Are you broken?

The whole point of a debate is that you provide evidence that supports your claims. Simply saying he was bigger and younger, that's why he won is a rubbish argument. Mainly because it ignores what actually happened in the fight and is supported by nothing over than 'he was bigger'. The difference in the fight come down to Canelo landing the cleaner shots and neutralizing Cotto's offense. If you want to substantiate how that is more to do with a 10lb size advantage and not boxing skill, feel free, if not, we can leave it there.

So you don't think his size had anything to do with neutralizing Cotto's offense?

 

[LangfordBarrow]

Because Canelo rehydrates to the low 70's and Cotto to the low 60's. Cotto said immediately after the weigh in that he would be rehydrating, so he'd only need to gain 5-7 pounds during that re hydration period for my estimates to be correct.

Daniel Geale weighed more than Canelo when he fought Cotto, shame his size wasn't enough to stop him getting bulldozed.

Ok, so in other words, you're guessing.

 

[LangfordBarrow]

Floyd was smaller than Canelo and won pretty easily.
Am I the only one who wouldn't have been surprised if Cotto received the nod?
Is Canelo's refusal to reveal his fight night weight the biggest bitch move yet of this ongoing saga?

It was a good fight but I thought Canelo won. Mayweather did beat him but Cotto doesn't have that same type of style.