Who has better TDD? Gaethje? or Chandler?

[Peli]

Charles got a reactive takedown, kinda but Chandler pulled guard. Does Charles get gaethje down if he was in the same situation?

 

[KID Yamamoto]

Chandler had benson Henderson on his back and Olivera. TDD is irrelevant because Justin's submission defense is clearly very loose.

 

[Peli]

Chandler had benson Henderson on his back and Olivera. TDD is irrelevant because Justin's submission defense is clearly very loose.

can't be submitted if you can't get taken down. I don't think its a debate about who has better submission defense. Its chandler.

 

[Jojomojo]

Geathje got taken down by Eddie (since Khabib might not be the best reference) but hard to judge. I would say Chandler is generally harder to take down because his build and strenght, but his reckless style leaves him open to takedowns more.

 

[Kdup]

can't be submitted if you can't get taken down. I don't think its a debate about who has better submission defense. Its chandler.

You can certainly be submitted standing up lol.

 

[Pain4Pain]

Chandler is a bit more explosive and actually uses his wrestling, so probably Chandler. But I wonder how many clean hooks Chandler can take from Gaethje

 

[pinero]

can't be submitted if you can't get taken down. I don't think its a debate about who has better submission defense. Its chandler.

Except if you are Masvidal...<Lmaoo>

 

[Peli]

Except if you are Masvidal...<Lmaoo>

You can certainly be submitted standing up lol.

Okay, you guys are right. Forgot about standing submissions, but you get what I mean lol.

 

[Substance Abuse]

If Chandler got taken down by Khabib in his last fight, you guys would have some negative recency bias against him too. I believe Eddie took both down. I figure a Chandler/Gaethje fight primarily takes place on the feet.

 

[Peli]

If Chandler got taken down by Khabib in his last fight, you guys would have some negative recency bias against him too. I believe Eddie took both down. I figure a Chandler/Gaethje fight primarily takes place on the feet.

I agree with it taking place on the feet, but I'm asking out of the two fighters who has the better TDD if they were to fight the same opponents.

I think Gaethje has better TDD, with chandler having better submission defense, obviously. I'm kinda crazy, but I think gaethje can get up against oliveira if he takes him down in the immediate scramble. It has to be fast though. I don't think Oliveira as good as he is and more versatile of a submission artist than Khabb is, I don't think he's going to be one step ahead of gaethje when it comes to the grappling. Gaethje might have his moments to escape clean. Eddie took him down, but he wasn't able to do anything with.

Think about how Khabib took gaethje down, that was one of the best TDs he had, countering a sprawl reversing it and taking gaethje's back.

If gaethje gets taken down and stays down, he's obviously getting submitted.

 

[Substance Abuse]

I agree with it taking place on the feet, but I'm asking out of the two fighters who has the better TDD if they were to fight the same opponents.

I think Gaethje has better TDD, with chandler having better submission defense, obviously. I'm kinda crazy, but I think gaethje can get up against oliveira if he takes him down in the immediate scramble. It has to be fast though. I don't think Oliveira as good as he is and more versatile of a submission artist than Khabb is, I don't think he's going to be one step ahead of gaethje when it comes to the grappling. Gaethje might have his moments to escape clean. Eddie took him down, but he wasn't able to do anything with.

Think about how Khabib took gaethje down, that was one of the best TDDs he had, countering a sprawl reversing it and taking gaethje's back.

If gaethje gets taken down and stays down, he's obviously getting submitted.

Dustin does have better scrambles but I think everyone's perspective on his ability is skewed by that Khabib fight. No one ever really was able to do anything against him grappling wise outside of a few random pockets here or there.

Gaethje isn't looked at too fondly to quite a few after that Khabib loss, but people don't realize in that short span he landed a lot more successful offense than Poirier did standing up.

 

[Peli]

Dustin does have better scrambles but I think everyone's perspective on his ability is skewed by that Khabib fight. No one ever really was able to do anything against him grappling wise outside of a few random pockets here or there.

Gaethje isn't looked at too fondly to quite a few after that Khabib loss, but people don't realize in that short span he landed a lot more successful offense than Poirier did standing up.

I agree. I made a thread about it saying despite the fight being shorter, gaethje did more damage than Conor or dustin did. It was scoffed at. some fans just don't appreciate other fighters skillsets because they lose which I find stupid.

 

[taugrim]

Geathje got taken down by Eddie (since Khabib might not be the best reference) but hard to judge. I would say Chandler is generally harder to take down because his build and strenght, but his reckless style leaves him open to takedowns more.

IIRC Barboza had Gaethje down briefly.

Gaethje's TDD is actually better now that he fights under control. He got taken down by Khabib, but so does everyone.

That said, I think Chandler is the more powerful scrambler, and his escape from that figure 4 body lock last night was a super rare move to pull off. I can't recall another figure 4 body lock being broken like that in a title fight when the guy with back control has fresh legs.

Gaethje has better length than Chandler and a tremendously effective kicking game, so I think Gaethje matches up better against Oliveira better than Chandler does. Ditto for Poirier.

I'm not saying they're better than Oliveira - if anything the last 2 fights showed that people have been underestimating Oliveira and he's grown tremendously.

If they rematch, I think Gaethje narrowly beats Poirier in a 5-round war.

 

[Orochimaru 大蛇丸]

Dustin does have better scrambles but I think everyone's perspective on his ability is skewed by that Khabib fight. No one ever really was able to do anything against him grappling wise outside of a few random pockets here or there.

Gaethje isn't looked at too fondly to quite a few after that Khabib loss, but people don't realize in that short span he landed a lot more successful offense than Poirier did standing up.

Gaethje's performance against Khabib is so underrated because of Khabib's A+ poker face

Gaethje landed several low kicks, if he was able to survive into the 3rd and 4th round Khabib would've been in trouble

 

[Deep808State]

Justin has better TDD but I do feel he expends a LOT more energy than Chandler while defending

 

[Peli]

That said, I think Chandler is the more powerful scrambler, and his escape from that figure 4 body lock last night was a super rare move to pull off. I can't recall another figure 4 body lock being broken like that in a title fight when the guy with back control has fresh legs.

that was impressive, ngl. I thought Oliveira had him dead to rights there, great submission defensive. Its not advised to do so, but I like how he gave his back to fight the hands, like AL did against Khabib. Chandler knows what he's doing and what he's comfortable with. Giving the back is not an issue for him if he feels he can control the hands.

 

[Substance Abuse]

I agree. I made a thread about it saying despite the fight being shorter, gaethje did more damage than Conor or dustin did. It was scoffed at. some fans just don't appreciate other fighters skillsets because they lose which I find stupid.

They only recall Justin getting subbed and not realizing other factors like Khabib's pace, how great he is and driven he was to fight more aggressively than he ever had before and how that pace made Gaethje gas quickly. If Khabib fought like he normally fought without that pressure he would have given Justin a lot more opportunities to achieve success.

 

[Peli]

They only recall Justin getting subbed and not realizing other factors like Khabib's pace, how great he is and driven he was to fight more aggressively than he ever had before and how that pace made Gaethje gas quickly. If Khabib fought like he normally fought without that pressure he would have given Dustin a lot more opportunities to achieve success.

You mean Justin? lol

 

[Substance Abuse]

Gaethje's performance against Khabib is so underrated because of Khabib's A+ poker face

Gaethje landed several low kicks, if he was able to survive into the 3rd and 4th round Khabib would've been in trouble

Khabib's leg was already hurting. That pressure and pace neutralized what Justin wanted to do. Khabib was on a mission that night. Some of his best takedown work ever was in that fight. Whoever was in that cage that night against him was getting mauled and submitted. No one can convince me differently.

 

[Substance Abuse]

You mean Justin? lol

Yes. My phone changed Justin to Dustin. Damn technology.