Earning shots in a division is less meaningful when you only get there as a product of the top guys losing and either moving to the back of the line or leaving the division entirely.
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That's a biased, unfair way of discredtiting Okami's accomplishments once again mate c'mon
> On the one hand, Okami earning a tittle shot for being 7-1 in UFC or beating Muñoz and Marquardt is, according to you, "less meaningful when you only get there as a product of the top guys losing and either moving to the back of the line or leaving the division entirely."
Well that's false in the first place. It could be right applied to Patrick Coté, or maybe Dan Hardy, but not a guy who remains at the top for almost a decade, a guy who was notoriously denied a title shot for a long time for not being a draw, and that actually proved he belongs in the elite at MW and at WW too (didnt the Shields fight happened at WW, according to you?)
> On the other hand, Fitch was 8-0 in UFC and got his tittle shot off a win over UFC new comer Wilsson, his best win until that time being #5 Sanchez by SD.
Yet I dont read you nothing about "is less meaningful". None of that shit in this case even though Fitch barely beat anybody in his way to the tittle shot better than Okami's wins...
In this case you dont take into account that Shields leaving the division, or other dudes fighting in other promotions, or guys as Maia waiting a couple more years to move down (and dominating Fitch right away)...played a role on Fitch getting a tittle shot despite nlacking of "big" wins. Here I dont read you the same arguments you used to downplay accomplishments as "less meaningful" in your book.
You only get picky when it comes to Okami and MW. You even give full-credit to Fitch stats that involve gross referee mistakes.
That's called BIAS my friend, and pretty blatant at that.
Burkman I brought up as a solid win. Not as a great win, I mean if we’re calling Muñoz solid then I don’t think the bar is all that high.
Okami
Marquardt
Muñoz
Lombard
Belcher
Swick
J. McDonald
Tanner
....plus Shieds controversial decision
Fitch
Alves
Sanchez
Burkman?
Pierce
Paulo Thiago
Erick Silva
Gono
....plus BJ controversial decision
The bar is pretty on par. Only through big amounts of bias and nitpicking you can try to present one list as much superior than the other.
And yeah, Hughes was probably past his prime for those fights, though I’d argue less so for his fight with Alves and that was pretty one sided. In any case, a former champion and legend like Hughes is a bigger win than anything Okami did. I’d put the Shields fight over it if Okami were a ww but he isn’t so I won’t.
You pretrending that Kos is a much more legitimate contender than Okami solely around the fact that he beat a way over the hill Hughes, is, again, pretty dishonest.
The list of guys who beat over the hill legends is pretty long, but you need to understand context. I would even say Pele Landi beat a better version of Hughes yet I dont read you claiming he is a supperior opponent.
Okami was not been finished by guys as Paulo Thiago in his way to his tittle shots as Kos did btw. If he was losing, it was to top5 competition in extremely close decs.
Not to nitpick here, but if Okami is a ww/mw and his wins are against good guys who fall into the same category (smallish mw), how does that make him a higher quality win? I get how it justifies his losses, but in doing that it seems like you’re kind of pulling the rug out from under the argument that he should be considered a tier 1 win for Silva.
Why it makes it a less quality win in this comparison?
Do you discredit Burns or Colbi for being rather light WWs? Are they less "meaninful" for Usman?
Did you used the same logic for Jon's win over Sanchez? Of course you didnt xD
The in-cage weight difference between Okami-Silva and GSP-Fitch was very similar.
Silva, in case you are not aware, is not a big MW neither. He is a smaller MW than GSP is a WW.
Silva is a former top ranked WW who weighted in at 195lbs for a LHW bout with Daniel Cormier.
Back in the day, it wasnt so uncommon that fighters avoided big weightcuts. Otherwise, Fitch would have had a way harder time to get his tittle shot off Chris Wilsson having guys as Maia, Marquardt, Kampman or Lawler in the same pool, although I know that you only take this into account when it comes to discredit or downplay Okami/Silva in ths discussion as "less meaningful". For Kos, Fitch or Alves and the state of the WW division n UFC at the time there is no nitpicking on your part.
I really don’t have a bias. Silva was spectacular to watch, I don’t believe in trying to tear someone down just to build someone else up. Not my style.
I dont assume its dishonest on purpose. But you are certainly using different measuring sticks in this discussion.
