Where are my libertarians?

I always supported Ron Paul over ANY republican or Democrat. Wasn't as committed to Rand and when Trump ran, I joined Trump army and never looked back.
 
Hans Gercmiov said:
Roll call. Fuck conservatives and liberals
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Greoric said:
By not legitimizing its initiation, and allowing the services we all want anyways to be produced by cooperative means as opposed to coercion.
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And when other, less enlightened societies, decide to take advantage of your non-violent one, and introduce violence?
Or when members of your society decide to introduce violence because your society isn't producing enough to keep everyone satisfied (a virtual impossibility, given our nature) and they decide they want more?
Or when you realise that 'the services we all want' aren't something that everyone can agree on?
 
11_others said:
I always supported Ron Paul over ANY republican or Democrat. Wasn't as committed to Rand and when Trump ran, I joined Trump army and never looked back.
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I liked your post after reading the Ron Paul part, then unliked after I finished. lol

How do you even associate the two?
 
PrinceOfPain said:
And when other, less enlightened societies, decide to take advantage of your non-violent one, and introduce violence?
Or when members of your society decide to introduce violence because your society isn't producing enough to keep everyone satisfied (a virtual impossibility, given our nature) and they decide they want more?
Or when you realise that 'the services we all want' aren't something that everyone can agree on?
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I don't think you're appreciating how difficult it is to govern people that don't want to be governed....

By the way, that's what's beautiful about decentralized markets. Everyone doesn't have to agree on what they want to be paying for. In fact a minority doesn't have to. Only the individual does.
 
silus_2000 said:
I liked your post after reading the Ron Paul part, then unliked after I finished. lol

How do you even associate the two?
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By picking what's best for the country at the given time. I believe drugs should be decriminalized as it will lessen the prison burden and maybe reduce gang operations. We don't know if that would work in practice, but we do know drug war is a big business and it's not good for citizens. Building a strong border is actually a one facet of reducing drug inflow, but won't solve the issue.

I think Federal government should be curbed- Trump is in the ballpark on that side with that position
I'm anti-interventionist with war - Trump and Ron and Rand Paul had same position. This was a biggie for me. Trump stood there and shitted on Bush Jr. like a boss and I totally respect that.
Protectionism- I believe Ron Paul also had that stance and it's the main thing for Trump.

I think it's not a wide gap as you imagined. Yes, Trump does talk a big game about spying on citizens and putting people on lists and I don't entirely like it, but we have to face the reality that Americans can be fearful and they need to feel safe.
 
Greoric said:
I don't think you're appreciating how difficult it is to govern people that don't want to be governed....
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I'm not sure where you're from, but I have a feeling I have far more practical experience with this than you do. It doesn't result in a dearth of violence from any side.

Greoric said:
By the way, that's what's beautiful about decentralized markets. Everyone doesn't have to agree on what they want to be paying for. In fact a minority doesn't have to. Only the individual does.
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Not sure what this has to do with my question about violence.
You don't need to legitimize violence. it's legitimate because it works.
 
I am mostly libertarian, but like anything in politics - absolutes never work.
 
11_others said:
By picking what's best for the country at the given time. I believe drugs should be decriminalized as it will lessen the prison burden and maybe reduce gang operations. We don't know if that would work in practice, but we do know drug war is a big business and it's not good for citizens. Building a strong border is actually a one facet of reducing drug inflow, but won't solve the issue.

I think Federal government should be curbed- Trump is in the ballpark on that side with that position
I'm anti-interventionist with war - Trump and Ron and Rand Paul had same position. This was a biggie for me. Trump stood there and shitted on Bush Jr. like a boss and I totally respect that.
Protectionism- I believe Ron Paul also had that stance and it's the main thing for Trump.

I think it's not a wide gap as you imagined. Yes, Trump does talk a big game about spying on citizens and putting people on lists and I don't entirely like it, but we have to face the reality that Americans can be fearful and they need to feel safe.
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Ron Paul is governed by nothing but sound principles. Trump? I have no idea.
 
PrinceOfPain said:
I'm not sure where you're from, but I have a feeling I have far more practical experience with this than you do. It doesn't result in a dearth of violence from any side.

Not sure what this has to do with my question about violence.
You don't need to legitimize violence. it's legitimate because it works.
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Yeah you're in SA. Elaborate if you would.

As it is now with modern weaponry, if a population has it in their mind that they're free individuals that don't believe they need to be coerced to pay for services or have "security" you can bet your ass the conquering force (whether domestic or foreign) is going to be in for a shit show.

My second section was in response to your, "what if everyone can't agree on the services they want?" My answer is that they don't have to. That's the point of not electing someone to make decisions for the group and compel the funding of those services.
 
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my views most closely align with libertarianism

the only problem is we havent had a good libertarian candidate since ron paul

for the record, i supported trump the whole time because there was no way rand was going to win and gary johnson is a joke.

i actually voted for johnson in both 2012 and 2016. because i live in california and its going blue anyways, i could only try to contribute so that the libertarian party can grow and potentially put forth a serious candidate.
 
11_others said:
Yes, you're right but he does have stances against certain treaties. I think I chose term poorly- protectionism is also not what Trump is for. My bad. Here is where he is against TPP:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/vi...l_bring_big_government__world_government.html

And this is his stance against NAFTA. This is not very different from Trump's underlying trade message.

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They're similar in the respect that they don't like non-bilateral trade agreements, but Trump is a heavy protectionist visa vie his tariff comments. Paul ain't got no time for that.
 
Libertarianism kills itself because it has literally no protection. What absolutely free trade means the whole of Africa could immigrate in and good luck having and preserving your precious freedoms then.
 
silus_2000 said:
Ron Paul is governed by nothing but sound principles. Trump? I have no idea.
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So we can agree that Trump's platform is in fact similar to Ron Paul's, but you don't trust Trump because you think he has no principles.

Fair enough. What I think is that Trump's ego will do him good by him trying to outdo other presidents and become GOAT president. He's a GOAT campaigner in my book, just for beating the Clinton/Media machine and all the powers that be who didn't want him to win. Let's hope he gets to be the greatest president since Andrew Jackson.
 
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Thurisaz said:
Libertarianism kills itself because it has literally no protection. What absolutely free trade means the whole of Africa could immigrate in and good luck having and preserving your precious freedoms then.
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Absolutely not. It implies the free flow of capital... not necessarily people.
 
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