What's the argument for Floyd being "greater" than Muhammad Ali?

[CodeBreaker]

I see Floyd fans saying he is undefeated and is the better pure technical boxer than Ali.

 

[toogreen]

IF the object of the fight game is to win as many fights as possible, take as little damage as possible and make the most money...Floyd is the GOAT

 

[defjaam]

I don't care too about all time rankings too much, I'm more interested in skills.

I would like to say that both were equally in terms of ring IQ / ability to adjust during a fight. But the Ken Norton fights throw a monkey wrench in it for me. Floyd figured out everyone he fought, whereas Ali could never decisively figure out Norton.

Ali's technical flaws became apparent when he deteriorated physically, as seen against Jimmy Young, Ron Lyle and Earnie Shavers, ... comparable to Sugar Ray Leonard ... Floyd still took care of Canelo and Pacquaio at that age. So I'd give Floyd the edge in relation to ring-craft,... but Ali was a vastly bigger & more popular personality outside the ring and had a much bigger impact on the sport of boxing that is still having influence TILL THIS DAY!

 

[don't quote me!]

Floyd wins the longevity test, as he was the pound for pound no.1 boxer on the planet at 38 yrs of age, which as far as I can tell no other boxer in history can claim. Ironically the next highest on the list would be ALi who I felt was the best in the game until 35/36.

Ali beat better fighters, but comparitively Floyd beat bigger ones. FLoyd was being outweighed on the scales by 10 pounds on fight night, throughout his career even going back to his super featherweight days. A problem Ali rarely, if ever had to face, big George foreman outweighted ali by 4 pounds only, in the rumble in the jungle

 

[burningspear]

 

[mozfonky]

the real fans of the sport who have seen alot wouldn't say that. Floyd does because he's insecure but it's not his place to rank himself (not any fighters really). The younger fans are blinded the same way many of us were when we were younger with our heroes and can't see objectively.

 

[baconCrunch]

ali is a great boxer, and the complete definition of greatness, inside and outside of the ring. an entertainer, a role model and a historical icon.

floyd is a great boxer, but nothing else.

 

[SandaKicker]

Floyd has brainwashed his fans that boxing is more complicated than quantum physics, even when Maidana was giving him problems mostly winging overhand rights it was all part of a wider plan to "box him".

Several fighters who I've seen throughout boxing history have had a mystique and I'm sure there are others who I haven't followed.

 

[YourBoss]

Hm never lost, has a great resume himself, was a world champ for 20 years, was still beating stellar opponents at 36/37/38. Ali almost lost to a 185 lbs man, got beaten by Norton who is by no means a special fighter, lost to Frazier when both where close to his prime. Ali gets mysthified, but the reality is, that Mayweather is in fact better than him. And i dont even like Mayweather, he is a moron.

 

[CodeBreaker]

I don't care too about all time rankings too much, I'm more interested in skills.

I would like to say that both were equally in terms of ring IQ / ability to adjust during a fight. But the Ken Norton fights throw a monkey wrench in it for me. Floyd figured out everyone he fought, whereas Ali could never decisively figure out Norton.

Ali's technical flaws became apparent when he deteriorated physically, as seen against Jimmy Young, Ron Lyle and Earnie Shavers, ... comparable to Sugar Ray Leonard ... Floyd still took care of Canelo and Pacquaio at that age. So I'd give Floyd the edge in relation to ring-craft,... but Ali was a vastly bigger & more popular personality outside the ring and had a much bigger impact on the sport of boxing that is still having influence TILL THIS DAY!

Ali beat Norton twice... i mean 3rd fight was pretty close but Floyd also had very close fights and should have lost to Castillo.

Also styles make fights, Norton just had that style Ali had difficult time with, just like Pacquiao to Marquez. We never saw that from Floyd because he cherry picked his opponents. Ali fought everyone, while Floyd fought guys who he knows he can beat.

 

[djacobox372]

Ali had a lot of fights later in his career where he came in out of shape and undertrained. Floyd has more discipline.

 

[Heath Robinson]

I haven't heard a single person who's opinion I respect ever claim Mayweather was greater than Ali.

 

[Noraaq]

Skill doesn’t equal greatness. Floyd may be the more skilled boxer but Ali’s greatness transcended the boxing ring.

 

[Boxiana]

Skill doesn’t equal greatness. Floyd may be the more skilled boxer but Ali’s greatness transcended the boxing ring.

 

[r-harper-1]

Both Great .... Floyd has a great record and in my view only had one close fight against Castillo 1.....but what holds floyd back is he didn’t fight everybody when he should’ve fought them .....Ali fought everybody when he should’ve fought them no hesitation.....That’s what separates them imo

 

[burningspear]

I don't care too about all time rankings too much, I'm more interested in skills.

I would like to say that both were equally in terms of ring IQ / ability to adjust during a fight. But the Ken Norton fights throw a monkey wrench in it for me. Floyd figured out everyone he fought, whereas Ali could never decisively figure out Norton.

Ali's technical flaws became apparent when he deteriorated physically, as seen against Jimmy Young, Ron Lyle and Earnie Shavers, ... comparable to Sugar Ray Leonard ... Floyd still took care of Canelo and Pacquaio at that age. So I'd give Floyd the edge in relation to ring-craft,... but Ali was a vastly bigger & more popular personality outside the ring and had a much bigger impact on the sport of boxing that is still having influence TILL THIS DAY!

Sugar Ray Leonard suffered a detached retina, retired in '82, fought once in 5 years, challenged Hagler, beat him. This sort of thing ranks him and Ali above Floyd. When did Floyd ever overcome insurmountable odds? To be the greatest, you need to do great things, take great risks, not just have a pretty record.

 

[aries]

Sugar Ray Leonard suffered a detached retina, retired in '82, fought once in 5 years, challenged Hagler, beat him. This sort of thing ranks him and Ali above Floyd. When did Floyd ever overcome insurmountable odds? To be the greatest, you need to do great things, take great risks, not just have a pretty record.

Exactly. Floyd in his prime never fought anyone that he wasn't supposed to beat.

 

[zapataxiv]

Floyd has brainwashed his fans that boxing is more complicated than quantum physics, even when Maidana was giving him problems mostly winging overhand rights it was all part of a wider plan to "box him".

Several fighters who I've seen throughout boxing history have had a mystique and I'm sure there are others who I haven't followed.

I find your post disturbing
Especially considering you consider yourself a lay practitioner of the sport. But to discount Floyd’s skills over your dislike of his fans is pretty dumb.
I guess I just expected better from you.

Out of curiosity who are these other fighters? How do you compare your Floyd hate with you naseem love?

 

[SandisLL]

I see that this is a bit pepper to add for this forum.
Plenty of posters there are pro American oriented, to discount non US fighters skills is casual daily stuff for this forum.
Then everything is OK.

 

[SandaKicker]

I find your post disturbing
Especially considering you consider yourself a lay practitioner of the sport. But to discount Floyd’s skills over your dislike of his fans is pretty dumb.
I guess I just expected better from you.

Out of curiosity who are these other fighters? How do you compare your Floyd hate with you naseem love?

The title of the thread was a comparison between Muhammad Ali and Floyd Mayweather, that's a pretty illustrious comparison.

I can accept that there might be some things going on technically in Floyd's fights that I am missing technically, what I don't accept is that Floyd was always in complete control of all of his opponents or that he wasn't susceptible to losing a decision to an elite fighter who was busier than him.

As far as fighter's who have generated a mystique Sonny liston before the first Cassius Clay fight, Mike Tyson at points of his career and Hamed himself. I'm also pretty sure that I never loved Naseem but rather regarded him as a bit of an asshole who was a great entertainer. I would have to say Mayweather achieved more as a boxer.