what instructor has the best grapplers under him?

[thewhiterooster]

I was nerding out online today and I didn't realize how many high high level blackbelts that Lloyd Irvin has under him. he gave out black belts to mike fowler, Tim spriggs, jt Torres and Muhammed Aly (I'm sure there's others). but I was wondering what other fellow bjj nerds thought on this. who else comes to mind? Renzo has a lot of bad ass dudes under him, but some of them are a generation or two below him (under Almeida, deblass, danaher etc). Carlos Gracie jr has some great guys. thoughts?

 

[mataleaos]

Lloyd Irvin had a lot. Yeah. JT. Fowler. DJ. Spriggs. Aly. Harbison. Easton. He gave browns to Keenan Cornelius and Ryan Hall.

Lloyd was and is by all accounts a great coach.

Marcelo comes to mind. He belted Grippo, Diniz, Danis, Khera, Satava, Silva, Dominyka, and others too.

 

[TroldeAnsigt]

Isn't there are a lot of hype for John Danaher and his Boys right now?

 

[dimmyfinster]

Ramon Lemos. Only two but Rafa and Gui have ten ibjjf championships between them.

Along those lines, Cicero Costa, who spawned two Miyaos and one Lo.

Fabio Gurgel who spawned Marcelo and Reis and Gabi Garcia and even more under Marcelo.

 

[thewhiterooster]

Isn't there are a lot of hype for John Danaher and his Boys right now?

I think Eddie Cummings is the only dude from "danaher's death squad" who got his black belt from danaher. Garry tonon got his black belt from deblass, gordon Ryan got his black belt from tonon, Nicky Ryan is a purple belt cuz he's too young for a black belt.

 

[TheMood]

Ramon Lemos. Only two but Rafa and Gui have ten ibjjf championships between them.

Along those lines, Cicero Costa, who spawned two Miyaos and one Lo.

Fabio Gurgel who spawned Marcelo and Reis and Gabi Garcia and even more under Marcelo.

I think Damian Maia is another person under Gurgel.

 

[mataleaos]

Isn't there are a lot of hype for John Danaher and his Boys right now?

Out of the 3 main 'Danaher Death Squad' guys, the only one to actually be given a black belt by John Danaher is Eddie Cummings. Tom DeBlass gave Garry Tonon his black belt, who gave Gordon Ryan his black belt. As for the junior members, I believe Nicky Ryan is a purple belt under John Danaher, and then Ethan Crelinsten and Oliver Taza are brown belts under Firas Zahabi.

But his crew is definitely killing it right now.

 

[mataleaos]

Terere low key has a ton of good black belts, including Andre Galvao and Cobrinha.

Andre Galvao also has asolid stable, promoting guys like Keenan Cornelius, Josh Hinger, etc.

Cicero Costha produced the Miyao Bros and Leandro Lo.

Ricardo Franjinha Miller produced some good early American black belt pioneers with Bill Cooper, Jeff Glover, and Tyrone Glover.

Xande and Saulo Ribeiro produced Rafael Lovato Jr, who produced Justin Rader, James Puopolo, and Jared Dopp.

 

[tekkenfan]

Lloyd Irvin had a lot. Yeah. JT. Fowler. DJ. Spriggs. Aly. Harbison. Easton. He gave browns to Keenan Cornelius and Ryan Hall.

Lloyd was and is by all accounts a great coach.

Marcelo comes to mind. He belted Grippo, Diniz, Danis, Khera, Satava, Silva, Dominyka, and others too.

tbh i think that has to do with him having over 1300 students tbh a brown belt who had that many students under him would at least produce 1 world champion

 

[tekkenfan]

Ramon Lemos. Only two but Rafa and Gui have ten ibjjf championships between them.

Along those lines, Cicero Costa, who spawned two Miyaos and one Lo.

Fabio Gurgel who spawned Marcelo and Reis and Gabi Garcia and even more under Marcelo.

didnt fabio teach maia? and a ton of alliance guys

depends what you want id go to saulo for solid fundamentals


im stuck between mendes and renzos though for competition stuff leaning more towards renzos since has tons more students and mma guys

 

[Colleric]

Well, all round it's Jacare, but not sure really how many of them he taught at all

 

[yetanother]

Cicero Costha produced the Miyao Bros and Leandro Lo..

Having 3 super elite grapplers from a small dirty gym is super impressive (plus there are a bunch of tough guys from Ciceros gym).

 

[Submission]

Romulo. Promoted Arges, Najmi, and has a great part on Pena's development. And he's only been coaching for a few years.
And also as has been said, Carlos Gracie has the highest number of black belt world champions under him. Romero Jacare is close to him.

 

[Balto]

The problem with these lists is that the black belt lineage information easily available is quite unreliable.

For example, JT is actually a Jared Weiner black belt -- at least according to JT's own account of it.

https://www.flograppling.com/articl...american-dream-part-3-from-east-coast-to-west

I've seen Andre Galvao listed under Dagmar, Terere, or Telles. All three sort of make sense in a way, although Terere is probably the most accurate.

There is a lot of politics involved in claiming famous guys.

 

[JustTheTip]

This is a tough one because many of the top BBs switched teams and got their BBs from people who didn't really develop a large percentage of their game. Guys like Romero “Jacare” Cavalcanti,Fabio Gurgel,Terere and Galvao have alot of great BBs but many of them were already highly successful advanced Belts prior to coming to them. If the question is about who has trained the most good BBs from start to finish, i'd say Cisero Costa. Brazil has far deeper talent at the BB level so for US based instructors I'd say Marcelo Garcia then Crazy 88/Lloyd Irvin. Alot of Lloyd's best BBs were developed at lower belts by his affiliates. Especially Crazy 88. Franjiha Miller has to be up there too. He has put out good American BBs that he developed start to finish. Romulo Barral has a great team but pretty much all of his competitive BBs switched to him when they were already successful. The same with Galvao.

 

[mattemate]

Renzo has probably been the most influential. Danaher and Easton are from that lineage. He worked a lot with Roger and gave Roger his black belt. And he is current with all the changes that have occurred with BJJ and grappling over all.

So as far as lineages coming from a current guy, gotta go with him. Even DDS is Renzo in a sense

 

[mataleaos]

The problem with these lists is that the black belt lineage information easily available is quite unreliable.

For example, JT is actually a Jared Weiner black belt -- at least according to JT's own account of it.

https://www.flograppling.com/articl...american-dream-part-3-from-east-coast-to-west

I've seen Andre Galvao listed under Dagmar, Terere, or Telles. All three sort of make sense in a way, although Terere is probably the most accurate.

There is a lot of politics involved in claiming famous guys.

Yeah and on top of that (or maybe I'm just rewording what you said) I would say that your lineage isn't always super indicative of who your coach or your instructor is. For example the person that I consider my mentor/coach/instructor is a different lineage than who I am belted under.

I imagine a lot of competitors, including some of the ones you named, if asked who their coaches/instructors/mentors were, would not unanimously say who belted them.

 

[mikedenny]

The problem with these lists is that the black belt lineage information easily available is quite unreliable.

For example, JT is actually a Jared Weiner black belt -- at least according to JT's own account of it.

https://www.flograppling.com/articl...american-dream-part-3-from-east-coast-to-west

I've seen Andre Galvao listed under Dagmar, Terere, or Telles. All three sort of make sense in a way, although Terere is probably the most accurate.

There is a lot of politics involved in claiming famous guys.

JT being a Jared Weiner black belt is just more lies Balto! It was a joint promotion that Lloyd approved. At least you said 'by jt's own account"

 

[mikedenny]

This is a tough one because many of the top BBs switched teams and got their BBs from people who didn't really develop a large percentage of their game. Guys like Romero “Jacare” Cavalcanti,Fabio Gurgel,Terere and Galvao have alot of great BBs but many of them were already highly successful advanced Belts prior to coming to them. If the question is about who has trained the most good BBs from start to finish, i'd say Cisero Costa. Brazil has far deeper talent at the BB level so for US based instructors I'd say Marcelo Garcia then Crazy 88/Lloyd Irvin. Alot of Lloyd's best BBs were developed at lower belts by his affiliates. Especially Crazy 88. Franjiha Miller has to be up there too. He has put out good American BBs that he developed start to finish. Romulo Barral has a great team but pretty much all of his competitive BBs switched to him when they were already successful. The same with Galvao.

Justin, besides Tim who are Lloyd's best black belts that were developed at lower belts by his affiliates that you speak of?

To say a lot of his best black belts seems false.

 

[JustTheTip]

Justin, besides Tim who are Lloyd's best black belts that were developed at lower belts by his affiliates that you speak of?

To say a lot of his best black belts seems false.

Come to think about it, I was off. All of his best BBs other than Tim and Mahammed Aly were home grown.