What changed your mind about Religion?

jgarner said:
I always found that to be such a silly argument. It reminds of me the equally silly argument about the Earth being closer or further away from the sun by a mile that we wouldn't exist. Well no. In fact, there is a habitable range that the Earth could be in that allows for human life. You just don't understand science or evolution very well it appears.

It's not a mathematical impossibility. In fact, it's the complete opposite. It's mathematically inevitable given conducive conditions and enough time.

All the materials and circumstances for life happened to be on Earth, and thus Earth had life. You and your beliefs are a product of your life, which is a product of 4.543 billion years of evolution on Earth.

https://mic.com/articles/88441/camb...fe-could-have-started-from-nothing#.DE0HC3gEU
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evolution on mars? on venus? No, just earth.

another improbability

There is no logical reaosn for life to exist either. Light a match in a vaccum 1000000 times and you will never get life.
 
reckufssa said:
I used to be an atheist

But then I realized that nothing doesn't just come from nothing. and Also realized that for everything to ACCIDENTALLY go perfectly right in history for me to be here typing a message in a computer is a mathematical impossibility
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Nothing certainly does come from nothing!

As for things accidentally happening, if you start thinking that something has to make everything, you get into the who created the creator question.
 
ralphc1 said:
Nothing certainly does come from nothing!

As for things accidentally happening, if you start thinking that something has to make everything, you get into the who created the creator question.
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something*

A creator creating the creator does not mean anything to me.

If you program a computer game with people does that mean you cannot have a father?

IMO being immortal has little to do with being first
 
reckufssa said:
evolution on mars? on venus? No, just earth.

another improbability

There is no logical reaosn for life to exist either. Light a match in a vaccum 1000000 times and you will never get life.
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Well for one, it's possible that Mars used to have some sort of life. We don't know yet. We just proved water on Mars. So it's entirely possible that millions of years ago, there was basic life developed on Mars. Venus is unlikely due to the conditions of the planet. It's the hottest planet in the solar system.

Light a match in a vacuum and you won't get life. That's correct. Have all the conditions for life floating around for billions of years and you might get life. I just showed you a link on how the fundamental parts of life, I.E, RNA could have been created out of a chemical soup. Just because we don't have all the answers in science that doesn't mean we should give up on it and go "God did it all". It's ridiculous.

What's even less likely is the idea of your god being real. I won't hold my breath for you to prove your theory.
 
jgarner said:
Well for one, it's possible that Mars used to have some sort of life. We don't know yet. We just proved water on Mars. So it's entirely possible that millions of years ago, there was basic life developed on Mars. Venus is unlikely due to the conditions of the planet. It's the hottest planet in the solar system.

Light a match in a vacuum and you won't get life. That's correct. Have all the conditions for life floating around for billions of years and you might get life. I just showed you a link on how the fundamental parts of life, I.E, RNA could have been created out of a chemical soup. Just because we don't have all the answers in science that doesn't mean we should give up on it and go "God did it all". It's ridiculous.

What's even less likely is the idea of your god being real. I won't hold my breath for you to prove your theory.
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God could be a group of computer programmers, or a group of super intellects from another dimension.

A god does not have to be some kind of magic superhero who was never born and never died.

Look at the earth. everything that is living has a purpose.

a tree gives off apples so the animals can eat the apples and shit out the seeds. a whale has a hole in it's head in order to breath. Humans experience love which is a chemical reaction
in order to reproduce. I can go on and on. Everything living things do have a purpose.

Non-living things do not have this purpose. They are also much more durable than living things. So what would be the purpose of the subatomic dead particles of the big bang to eventually
create life?

If I ask myself okay, how do I make a non-animated object animated? The answer is you have to program it. but it doesnt just happen.
 
reckufssa said:
God could be a group of computer programmers, or a group of super intellects from another dimension.

A god does not have to be some kind of magic superhero who was never born and never died.

Look at the earth. everything that is living has a purpose.

a tree gives off apples so the animals can eat the apples and shit out the seeds. a whale has a hole in it's head in order to breath. Humans experience love which is a chemical reaction
in order to reproduce. I can go on and on. Everything living things do have a purpose.

Non-living things do not have this purpose. They are also much more durable than living things. So what would be the purpose of the subatomic dead particles of the big bang to eventually
create life?

If I ask myself okay, how do I make a non-animated object animated? The answer is you have to program it. but it doesnt just happen.
Click to expand...

Yes things have a purpose. That's a result of evolution. Basic life forms getting more and more complex over time to adapt to the environment. We didn't start with apples. Hell, the apples you eat aren't the apples of the past.

I accept the idea that there could be a being capable of greater things than we can imagine who is responsible for all of this. I don't accept the idea that he created himself to be crucified for a bunch of barbaric humans in the Roman era and inspired humans to write a book about his wants and stories.
 
I take issue with the word 'worship'. It seems like too much to ask of someone. I can't imagine being involved with a god that needed to be worshipped. Too egotistical.

I'm more of a Gaia concept kind of guy. We're in this together... with the animals.
 
I've always been a logical, straight forward, "show me" kind of person. It's kind of hard to get on board when nobody can show you a damned thing.
 
jgarner said:
Yes things have a purpose. That's a result of evolution. Basic life forms getting more and more complex over time to adapt to the environment. We didn't start with apples. Hell, the apples you eat aren't the apples of the past.

I accept the idea that there could be a being capable of greater things than we can imagine who is responsible for all of this. I don't accept the idea that he created himself to be crucified for a bunch of barbaric humans in the Roman era and inspired humans to write a book about his wants and stories.
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see, nobody is talking about religious dogma.

If you don't beleive in a god, why use the bible as a guide to not beleive in something....when you don;'t ebelive the bible anyway?

i don't get it...
 
ralphc1 said:
Nothing certainly does come from nothing!

As for things accidentally happening, if you start thinking that something has to make everything, you get into the who created the creator question.
Click to expand...

Maybe creator came from nothing :p
 
I grew up catholic and went to a catholic school all the way to highschool. I always remember being an instrospective kid and I ALWAYS remember thinking "this shit doesnt make sense" and I dont mean the idea of "a god" or where is it or shit like that, I guess I understood what "faith" is, but what didnt make sense to me was that people were not living the way "their" religion supposedly tells them to. According to catholic or christian religion gays are incorrect or you are not supposed to use condoms because you shouldnt fornicate.... well but you do fuck and you do accept gays... WELL then "you dont agree with your religion" and thats just 2 examples... I can name hundreds.

Thats just how it started as a kid (which is what your thread asks) since then it has progressed to MANY other fundamentals believes about life and the universe. As a kid I started to understand that MOST people belong to a certain religion only because of tradition, because it has ben passed to them and they just think its correct to pass it to their kids, if they would sit down and analyze the things you are "supposedly believing because of your faith" they would find out MOST of it doesnt make any sense, of course most people dont do that or more sadly they will never do that, because they dont have time and they think if they do they will have to live with no god, their "make believe" reality and after death promise would crumble and of course they dont want to do that.

Growing spiritually where you understand that you dont need religions and still feel very comfortable with yourself and your reality takes time, most people dont want to take that time, its more comfortable going to mass or service and think "ok I got it over with, Im ok with god now"
 
reckufssa said:
see, nobody is talking about religious dogma.

If you don't beleive in a god, why use the bible as a guide to not beleive in something....when you don;'t ebelive the bible anyway?

i don't get it...
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Because the Christian god is the most common system of belief on this board for those that believe in a god. I'm more than happy to talk science, but you don't seem to understand it very well so I don't know where to start. Answers the unknown is the whole point of science. Scientists don't pretend to have all the answers. In fact, they seek out questions and the unknown to find answers. You ask why subatomic particles from the big bang create life? We don't know yet, but we will eventually. We aren't even positive the big bang is the origins of the universe. It's only a theory. J.J. Thompson discovered the electron in 1897. Hans Geiger and Ernest Marsden discovered the nucleus in 1909. Before then we were asking questions about how elements did this or that.

It's like a constant circle of the same routine with believers.

Believers say "You can't explain this with science, so there must be a creator"

Scientists say "You're right. We don't know!"

Believers act smug. Scientists go into the lab.

Scientists say "We figured it out, this is how it works! We also found this new thing we didn't know existed!"

Believers say "You can't explain this new thing with science, so there must be a creator"


And the cycle continues.
 
jgarner said:
Because the Christian god is the most common system of belief on this board for those that believe in a god. I'm more than happy to talk science, but you don't seem to understand it very well so I don't know where to start. Answers the unknown is the whole point of science. Scientists don't pretend to have all the answers. In fact, they seek out questions and the unknown to find answers. You ask why subatomic particles from the big bang create life? We don't know yet, but we will eventually. We aren't even positive the big bang is the origins of the universe. It's only a theory. J.J. Thompson discovered the electron in 1897. Hans Geiger and Ernest Marsden discovered the nucleus in 1909. Before then we were asking questions about how elements did this or that.

It's like a constant circle of the same routine with believers.

Believers say "You can't explain this with science, so there must be a creator"

Scientists say "You're right. We don't know!"

Believers act smug. Scientists go into the lab.

Scientists say "We figured it out, this is how it works! We also found this new thing we didn't know existed!"

Believers say "You can't explain this new thing with science, so there must be a creator"


And the cycle continues.
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A god could exist without being the christian god is the point.

I don't understand science?

give one example of non-life creating life.

give one example of a physical object being created out of nothing.
 
reckufssa said:
A god could exist without being the christian god is the point.
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One could, sure. Any reasonable person will agree that it is possible a god exists.

What reason do we have to believe that one does exist?
 
reckufssa said:
IMO everything
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Ok.

Well, I'll need a little more than that in order carry on a conversation.

As to your other question about "something from nothing" Lawrence Krauss wrote a book about it. You should find some answers in there.
 
When I was around 4yo and someone tried to describe Noah's Ark to me. It didn't make any sense, even at that age I wasn't stupid enough to believe that all the animals would fit on a f-ing wood boat.
 
ShadBo said:
Ok.

Well, I'll need a little more than that in order carry on a conversation.

As to your other question about "something from nothing" Lawrence Krauss wrote a book about it. You should find some answers in there.
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Something just doesn't come form nothing man. This is common sense.
 
I believe in God. I didn't for a while, but I rediscovered my faith after some very trying times in my life. Even when I wasn't practicing, I realized that I was being taken care of and watched over in a way that's beyond mathematical possibilities. There is a plan bigger than all of us, something way beyond what we can perceive with our incredibly rudimentary understanding of the universe. Perhaps we can understand it one day, but we can't now. But whatever it is, I know that there is a plan for us. I know because it happened to me.
 
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