Weakest middleweight division in history

BullyKutta said:
It’s always been a weird division though.
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it's true, for whatever reason it's always been weak. i remember how everyone used to complain about it back with it was ace and then anderson. not exactly sure what's the reason.
 
It's been weak for a while but maybe it's getting better.

Top guys are who?

Ddp
Izzy
Strickland
Rob
Jared
Costa
Vetorri
Allen

Ironically 2 of the top 3 do seem weak.

I'd like to see them fight non rematches in the top 10
 
Greyscale said:
Of course it was much stronger in the times of Sonnen, Lutter, Leites, Patrick Cote and Marquardt, right? Actually, no. And people who say that Anderson wouldn't notice DDP make a mistake. They were saying that Whittaker, Adesanya and Sean wouldn't either.
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I'd pick a truly prime Anderson to beat DDP but don't think it would be an easy fight for him. I don't think DDP is an easy fight for any MW ever. He's very tough, durable, great chin, unorthodox and a good grappler though not one who constantly uses wrestling to grind down opponents. I just think Anderson would continually counter his lunging striking attempts and probably finish him late in the fight. I tihink the same would happen with prime Anderson vs. Yoel. Again, Anderson finished prime Hendo (who had just gone life and death with Rampage for 5 rounds) in the 2nd round. Hendo was very similar to Yoel and somewhat similar to DDP, though a less diverse striker (not many kicks). I think DDP would last a bit longer than Hendo due to his striking being less predictable (not so many H-bombs) Anderson ate an H-bomb, though, and it didn't faze him.
 
mkt said:
I'd pick a truly prime Anderson to beat DDP but don't think it would be an easy fight for him. I don't think DDP is an easy fight for any MW ever. He's very tough, durable, great chin, unorthodox and a good grappler though not one who really uses wrestling to grind down opponents. I just think Anderson would continually counter his lunging striking attempts and probably finish him late in the fight. I tihink the same would happen with prime Anderson vs. Yoel. Again, Anderson finished prime Hendo (who had just gone life and death with Rampage for 5 rounds) in the 2nd round. Hendo was very similar to Yoel and somewhat similar to DDP, though a less diverse striker (not many kicks).
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Prime Anderson is itself a tough question. After all, he joined UFC at a ripe age of 31 and was at the peak of his reign around 35 years. Many fellow Chute Boxe bros were already in steep decline after 30. You could say that he had a ton of experience at that point. That said, he probably wasn't at the peak of his physical capabilities already and the cracks soon started to show. And if he, like most athletes, was at his physical peak at around 27, then it's actually Anderson who was dominated by Takase.

Also, I don't think that Anderson faced an opponent of DDP's caliber during his title reign. The closest thing to DDP he did face was actually pre-Rockhold Weidman.
 
Greyscale said:
Prime Anderson is itself a tough question. After all, he joined UFC at a ripe age of 31 and was at the peak of his reign around 35 years. Many fellow Chute Boxe bros were already in steep decline after 30. You could say that he had a ton of experience at that point. That said, he probably wasn't at the peak of his physical capabilities already and the cracks soon started to show. And if he, like most athletes, was at his physical peak at around 27, then it's actually Anderson who was dominated by Takase.

Also, I don't think that Anderson faced an opponent of DDP's caliber during his title reign. The closest thing to DDP he did face was actually pre-Rockhold Weidman.
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Not all fighters age the same. Unlike other Chute Box guys, Anderson had good head movement and was able to evade strikers well. Most others were brawlers who took a lot of damage. Anderson still had great reflexes when he fought Forrest. He was around 34-35 then. But he clearly had declined some by the time he fought Weidman at age 38, in terms of reflexes and chin.

I'd say current 30-year old DDP vs. Anderson between the ages of 31-34 would be an ideal fight. As I've noted already in the threat, Hendo was somewhat comparable to DDP. He probably hit even harder, though his striking was less diverse. He'd just gone 5 competitive rounds vs. Rampage for the LHW belt before facing Silva. Though he didn't wrestle much, he was capable of it and had a strong clinch, probably from being an Olympic-level Greco wrestler in his early 20s. In fact, some of his training partners said he was the strongest guy they knew. He also had an iron chin and was durable.
 
mkt said:
Not all fighters age the same. Unlike other Chute Box guys, Anderson had good head movement and was able to evade strikers well. Most others were brawlers who took a lot of damage. Anderson still had great reflexes when he fought Forrest. He was around 34-35 then. But he clearly had declined some by the time he fought Weidman at age 38, in terms of reflexes and chin.

I'd say current 30-year old DDP vs. Anderson between the ages of 31-34 would be an ideal fight. As I've noted already in the threat, Hendo was somewhat comparable to DDP. He probably hit even harder, though his striking was less diverse. He'd just gone 5 competitive rounds vs. Rampage for the LHW belt before facing Silva. Though he didn't wrestle much, he was capable of it and had a strong clinch, probably from being an Olympic-level Greco wrestler in his early 20s. In fact, some of his training partners said he was the strongest guy they knew. He also had an iron chin and was durable.
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Good analysis, I think as of right now, we can certainly say that Hendo certainly hits harder than DDP but distinguishing who is more chinny is hard. So far, DDP has only gotten cracked once.

I think Anderson is also a genuine submission threat on the ground whereas Izzy's grappling is nonexistent.
 
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filthybliss said:
I think Anderson is also a genuine submission threat on the ground whereas Izzy's grappling is nonexistent.
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That's certainly true. To be fair, though, I don't see Anderson catching DDP with a triangle like he did against Sonnen (which didn't happen until 2 minutes left in the 5th round). Then again, I don't see DDP keeping Anderson grounded for much of 5 rounds like Sonnen did. I don't think his double legs are as good as Chael's and DDP prefers standing most of the time and mixing in TDs sparingly. Standing too long vs. prime Anderson could be very dangerous.
 
Jibsta69 said:
Izzy was a good talent but I think age and mental health has declined him. It’s not just the division, the entire sport feels like the talent level has taken steps back the last few years.
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Sport peaked with Khabib vs Connie.

Gonna be a while until it gets back to that level. Problem is that the UFC seem to be trying to slow the growth of the sport to line their own pockets.
 
The talent in the UFC in general outside of the lighter weight classes have been on a decline. There’s an issue if guys who are strictly kickboxers with minimal grappling skills are champion or in title contention. DDP is one the few well rounded fighters in that divison. He will be champion for a while. His only tough matchups are Chimaev or Bo Nickal.
 
You talk about a division where Chael mopped the floor with the then undisputed champ PEDs Silva during whole 4 and half a round

A division where a part-time math teacher, "still my boy", no-hearted Rockhold, one-eyed Bisping and an inactive and undersized GSP were champs

So please stop acting like MW wasn't always the poor cousin of UFC divisions
 
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