War Room Lounge v69: Oh no not the bees! Edition

[Social Distance Warrior]

@Crazy Diamond

 

[Limbo Pete]

Imagine picking 2019 - a time in which American conservatives are passing laws punishing boycotts of a foreign country, actively running interference for foreign war crimes, supporting aggressive trade protectionism (and protectionism built on identity politics, nonetheless), constantly attacking the media as "fake news" for reporting facts and cheering on vindictive action against them by the government, supporting cracking down on protesters, knowingly supporting rampant contravention of due process in border detainees (and just opposing free immigration in general), actively trying to tear down the separation of church and state and referencing the Bible in their political movement, criminalizing abortion and jailing women for contraceptive mishaps, stripping consumer and worker rights to litigation before a court of the law - to say that American conservatives are actually liberal.

I can't imagine the amount of lead a reasonable person would have to consume to think that.

It's just flat out retarded

 

[Trotsky]

It's just flat out retarded

No, you're the one that's retarded. The people in special needs homes are actually the geniuses. If you read the Constitution, you'd know that.

 

[Fawlty]

"THE CONSERVATIVES ARE REALLY LIBERALS! THE LIBERALS ARE FASCISTS!
YAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH!"

so many classical liberals in places like charlottesville imo

 

[EL CORINTHIAN]

"THE CONSERVATIVES ARE REALLY LIBERALS! THE LIBERALS ARE FASCISTS!
YAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH!"

Imagine picking 2019 - a time in which American conservatives are...

passing laws punishing boycotts of a foreign country;
actively running interference for foreign war crimes;
supporting aggressive trade protectionism (and protectionism built on identity politics, nonetheless);
constantly attacking the media as "fake news" for reporting facts and cheering on vindictive action against them by the government;
supporting cracking down on protesters;
knowingly supporting rampant contravention of due process in border detainees (and just opposing free immigration in general);
actively trying to tear down the separation of church and state and referencing the Bible in their political movement;
criminalizing abortion and jailing women for contraceptive mishaps;
threatening withholding of federal funds to coerce states and municipalities to hand over their law enforcement resources to the federal government for immigration enforcement; and
stripping consumer and worker rights to litigation before a court of the law...

...to say that American conservatives are actually liberal.

I can't imagine the amount of lead a reasonable person would have to consume to think that.

so many classical liberals in places like charlottesville imo

 

[Limbo Pete]

No, you're the one that's retarded. The people in special needs homes are actually the geniuses. If you read the Constitution, you'd know that.

I think it's a great failing of our education system that so many seem unaware the founding fathers had to immediately force people to pay taxes at gunpoint lol

 

[Trotsky]

so many classical liberals in places like charlottesville imo

 

[Fawlty]

I can't imagine the amount of lead a reasonable person would have to consume

He awaits the whatever fluids of your consumption. You must become one with his innards and such.

 

[PolishHeadlock2]

"Where's my favorite dictator?"

 

[Jack V Savage]

This is just flat out false.

Everything I said is true.

American Conservatism is liberal as the constitution is laid out. Is it a form of modern day progressivism?

That's true, and not relevant to what I said.

Is it liberal in the sense that it espouses equality for all under the law, speration of church and state, freedom of speech ect ect. Yes. This is why i told you over and over last time that it doesn't make a lick of difference how the general voting "bloc" (english is a second language let's not forget) does not negate what American Conservatism is. All those changes mean is that it's shifted left. And before you misinterpret that i mean that the voting bloc has shifted left according to you. Ideology and it's position on the spectrum doesn't simply dissapear because how of how people vote or your perception of those trends are.

The correction there was for your benefit; not meant to be an insult or anything. I'm sure you speak English much better than I speak your language.

Yes, the American political scene is to the left of one where there is a monarchy. But the American right pushes us in the direction of a monarchy, while the left pushes us in the direction of a purer democracy.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Yeah, Trump just said that the DOJ should intervene to stop people from accusing Kavanaugh of misconduct. Where was the outrage from the right about that? Nowhere. These people don't care at all about free speech or due process or rule of law.

If college students protest a fascist speaker, that's the end of free speech in America. If the president wants to use the Justice Department to silence people, that's dandy.

 

[EL CORINTHIAN]

Yes, the American political scene is to the left of one where there is a monarchy. But the American right pushes us in the direction of a monarchy, while the left pushes us in the direction of a purer democracy.

Debatable but also not relevant to what i said.
We are apparently discussing two different things here.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Debatable but also not relevant to what i said.
We are apparently discussing two different things here.

I said before that if you're using a private definition of "American right" or "American conservatism" that doesn't refer to real people, it can mean anything. "The American right" can refer to people who support mandatory Taco Tuesdays for all citizens. But the actual American right is right-wing.

 

[EL CORINTHIAN]

I said before that if you're using a private definition of "American right" or "American conservatism" that doesn't refer to real people, it can mean anything. "The American right" can refer to people who support mandatory Taco Tuesdays for all citizens. But the actual American right is right-wing.

Enough.

You're going in circles at this point. American Conservatism/Rightism is reserved for people who uphold the status quo in the country which is classical liberalism. If the American rightwing bloc doesnt uphold it they cease to be conservative and shift from those values. T

You are talking about people and im talking about ideas. This isn't rocket science.

con·serv·a·tive
/kənˈsərvədiv/

1. holding to traditional attitudes and values and cautious about change or innovation, typically in relation to politics or religion.
   synonyms: traditionalist, traditional, conventional, orthodox, stable, old-fashioned, dyed-in-the-wool, unchanging, hidebound; More
   • 
     
   • a person who is averse to change and holds to traditional values and attitudes, typically in relation to politics.

1. synonyms: right-winger, reactionary, rightist, diehard; More
   
   

Authoritariansm is not a American conservative value. End of story.

 

[Falsedawn]

Enough.

You're going in circles at this point. American Conservatism/Rightism is reserved for people who uphold the status quo in the country which is classical liberalism. If the American rightwing bloc doesnt uphold it they cease to be conservative and shift from those values. T

You are talking about people and im talking about ideas. This isn't rocket science.



Authoritariansm is not a American conservative value. End of story.

So none of the American right is conservative? Is that what you're telling us?

 

[Limbo Pete]

This shit is so sad lol

 

[Jack V Savage]

Enough.

You're going in circles at this point. American Conservatism/Rightism is reserved for people who uphold the status quo in the country which is classical liberalism. If the American rightwing bloc doesnt uphold it they cease to be conservative and shift from those values. T

I think we've agreed about that. The American right isn't "right" by your definition. Your definition of "American Conservatism" (which is not conservative) better describes the American left.

You are talking about people and im talking about ideas. This isn't rocket science.

I'm talking about ideas held by people.

Authoritariansm is not a American conservative value. End of story.

To be clearer: Authoritarianism is a main value of actual American conservatives and the American conservative movement but not of "American Conservatism" as you define it.

 

[EL CORINTHIAN]

So none of the American right is conservative? Is that what you're telling us?

No idea how you arrived at that conclusion based off of what i wrote but if you are directly asking me than of course there is big portion that are conservative.

Actually that's more along the lines of what Jack over there is saying. Not me. Im not even talking about people.

 

[Falsedawn]

This shit is so sad lol

Shut up history nerd, this is the 21st century. Stop being such a sheep and let these guys redefine everything they hate as left wing.

John Bolton...left wing.

See how easy that was?

 

[EL CORINTHIAN]

I think we've agreed about that. The American right isn't "right" by your definition. Your definition of "American Conservatism" (which is not conservative) better describes the American left.

No

I'm talking about ideas held by people.

I realize that. It's misplaced in this conversation

To be clearer: Authoritarianism is a main value of actual American conservatives and the American conservative movement but not of "American Conservatism" as you define it.

That is incorrect. It's anti-thetical.