Social War Room Lounge v255: The War Room has a regular with all the BBQs

[CubicleGangster]

Is something going on with Team USA? If so, I'm out of the loop.

You tell us, bud. You got the tab open on your phone.

 

[Gregolian]

Bud, need I remind you it was you who came in here acting like a children's party game is the most technical fighting game of all time? I know the wave dashing and dashi canceling take timing and skill but it is still a low execution game compared to a lot of FGC titles. Us beating each other at our own game's wouldn't really prove anything.

I hate Paul so goddamn much.

 

[BEER]

Bud, need I remind you it was you who came in here acting like a children's party game is the most technical fighting game of all time? I know the wave dashing and dashi canceling take timing and skill but it is still a low execution game compared to a lot of FGC titles. Us beating each other at our own game's wouldn't really prove anything.

It's really not "low execution" though lmao. There aren't really "special" moves in the game in the same sense as most other fighting games, so multi-input special attacks have a higher execution than Melee. But most fighting games don't have anywhere near the same level of nuance in the movement systems. In fact, movement in most fighting games is very rudimentary. Like I said, high level players can get above 600 inputs per minute, which is a recipe for arthritis if nothing else. The movement brings a whole different level to neutral interactions, punish game, and extending combos that other fighting games don't have.

And I'm not shitting on other games. I love other fighting games. Melee is my favorite, and you refused to even call it a fighting game! C'mon son!

 

[Gregolian]

It's really not "low execution" though lmao. There aren't really "special" moves in the game in the same sense as most other fighting games, so multi-input special attacks have a higher execution than Melee. But most fighting games don't have anywhere near the same level of nuance in the movement systems. In fact, movement in most fighting games is very rudimentary. Like I said, high level players can get above 600 inputs per minute, which is a recipe for arthritis if nothing else. The movement brings a whole different level to neutral interactions, punish game, and extending combos that other fighting games don't have.

And I'm not shitting on other games. I love other fighting games. Melee is my favorite, and you refused to even call it a fighting game! C'mon son!

The thing that pisses me off about Smash from a competitive stand point is the bullshit tactics in it. The constant rolling, over use of the shield, Fox/Falco are STILL in the top tier and Marth is an annoying cunt added to the fact there is the damn ledge grab shit to deny someone coming back to the stage.

 

[CubicleGangster]

It's really not "low execution" though lmao. There aren't really "special" moves in the game in the same sense as most other fighting games, so multi-input special attacks have a higher execution than Melee. But most fighting games don't have anywhere near the same level of nuance in the movement systems. In fact, movement in most fighting games is very rudimentary. Like I said, high level players can get above 600 inputs per minute, which is a recipe for arthritis if nothing else. The movement brings a whole different level to neutral interactions, punish game, and extending combos that other fighting games don't have.

And I'm not shitting on other games. I love other fighting games. Melee is my favorite, and you refused to even call it a fighting game! C'mon son!

Tell this to Tekken and KOF players, lol. Korean backdashes, normal dashes, air dashes, wall rides/bounces, forward hops, back hops. Shit, look at the constant inputs required in a game like MvC2. And that's if we take the argument "higher inputs means higher execution/technical" at face value, which I don't. Some RTS games require higher APM but that doesn't make them more technical.

 

[CubicleGangster]

The thing that pisses me off about Smash from a competitive stand point is the bullshit tactics in it. The constant rolling, over use of the shield, Fox/Falco are STILL in the top tier and Marth is an annoying cunt added to the fact there is the damn ledge grab shit to deny someone coming back to the stage.

The thing that pisses me off about Smash is that they invade FGC events while refusing to support other games in the FGC then they have the audacity to bitch that Smash doesn't get the respect it deserves
Also, their game requires removing like 80% of the game in order for it to be competitive

 

[BEER]

Tell this to Tekken and KOF players, lol. Korean backdashes, normal dashes, air dashes, wall rides/bounces, forward hops, back hops. Shit, look at the constant inputs required in a game like MvC2. And that's if we take the argument "higher inputs means higher execution/technical" at face value, which I don't. Some RTS games require higher APM but that doesn't make them more technical.

I guess you'd have to define what you think "technical" and "high/low execution" means.

Either way, I'm just defending the game from slander. Other fighting games are cool too. I used to get my ass beat at SF2 and Soul Caliber at mixed tournaments/fests all the time.

 

[BEER]

The thing that pisses me off about Smash is that they invade FGC events while refusing to support other games in the FGC then they have the audacity to bitch that Smash doesn't get the respect it deserves
Also, their game requires removing like 80% of the game in order for it to be competitive

I've never been to larger events. Locally, there has always been a decent amount of crossover with fighting games. It sucks if smash fans aren't supporting other games at events, though. I'll give you that. I enjoy high-level play for most games, no matter the genre.

 

[Gregolian]

The thing that pisses me off about Smash is that they invade FGC events while refusing to support other games in the FGC then they have the audacity to bitch that Smash doesn't get the respect it deserves
Also, their game requires removing like 80% of the game in order for it to be competitive

It's a problem Siege ran into when it first tried to take a chunk of the pie from the shooter scene and they learned their lesson. They no longer try to go head to head with the long standing king in CS but they've still filled a market desire.

As to input amounts... the Civilization series in my opinion requires more brain power than most any other RTS out there. Starcraft as a series is the king and I get that but there are bonafide strategies you can use for every race. Civilization? Sometimes you just get fucked by the random resource chance and get rolled by the AI in the first 15 turns.

The higher level difficulty AI of the Civ games too reminds me of this:



They can just roll you through nothing other than RNG.

 

[Trotsky]

Translation:

"Spacegnome better because he likes the same thing I do."

Yawn.

So....white flag?

 

[Chillin' Nuts]

It's definitely a different strokes for different folks sort of situation. The one and only time I was in the hospital for any length of time, they gave me a scrip for month's worth of dilaudid. I didn't need anything that strong so I could have done pretty much anything I wanted with them. I never found myself getting high off them.

Opiates are a weird one for me because it's absolutely one of my favorite highs but I never got addicted to the point I just had to have them. When they were around I would partake. I think it had a lot to do with simple economics; I could make 100 bucks of weed last a good while but I could go through $100 of pills in less than 48 hours.

I figure if I'd have had @LazaRRus money back in 2000 or so I would in all likelihood be six feet under.

 

[Islam Imamate]

You're literally saying Kamala Harris isn't a racist? I'll see myself out of this conversation

What makes you think Kamala Harris is racist?

 

[Gregolian]

I've never been to larger events. Locally, there has always been a decent amount of crossover with fighting games. It sucks if smash fans aren't supporting other games at events, though. I'll give you that. I enjoy high-level play for most games, no matter the genre.

Vid is two years old but breaks it down ok.

 

[PolishHeadlock2]

Opiates are a weird one for me because it's absolutely one of my favorite highs but I never got addicted to the point I just had to have them. When they were around I would partake. I think it had a lot to do with simple economics; I could make $100 bucks of weed last a good while but I could go through $100 of pills in less than 48 hours.

I figure if I'd have had @LazaRRus money back in 2000 or so I would in all likelihood be six feet under.

I remember smoking a joint laced with opium back in college and it was scary how good the high was.

 

[Islam Imamate]

I liked it enough but I hated Jim.

I just read that Kelsey Grammer was 38 when Frasier started....

The best moments of the show are when Jim gets humbled.

 

[HereticBD]

So....white flag?

You made no argument. It was just your typical "This guy agrees with me more, so he's better than you" Trotsky hot take.

It's a pretty tired routine.

 

[LazaRRus]

What makes you think Kamala Harris is racist?

I think there are plenty of things to suggest that she is but like I said to Trotsky I don't see the conversation going anywhere. Didn't want to ignore your post but I think it's safe to say that nobody is going to change the other's mind on it. She's been a fairly substantial public figure even before becoming VP so if you don't think she is then nothing I say will change it. Plus those type of debates typically end poorly. Not saying you would be unfair but it's probably better served not to walk that path.

 

[LazaRRus]

The best moments of the show are when Jim gets humbled.

The best part of the show is not listening to it. Can't stand that guy

 

[CubicleGangster]

I guess you'd have to define what you think "technical" and "high/low execution" means.

Either way, I'm just defending the game from slander. Other fighting games are cool too. I used to get my ass beat at SF2 and Soul Caliber at mixed tournaments/fests all the time.

You aren't really defending it from slander, though. I'm being over critical for the lolz, but this all started when you asserted it was the most technical fighting game when it is not.

I've never been to larger events. Locally, there has always been a decent amount of crossover with fighting games. It sucks if smash fans aren't supporting other games at events, though. I'll give you that. I enjoy high-level play for most games, no matter the genre.

This has been proven with the sign ups for larger events. Smash has the lowest amount of crossover compared to the other games.

Also they smell bad.

It's a problem Siege ran into when it first tried to take a chunk of the pie from the shooter scene and they learned their lesson. They no longer try to go head to head with the long standing king in CS but they've still filled a market desire.

As to input amounts... the Civilization series in my opinion requires more brain power than most any other RTS out there. Starcraft as a series is the king and I get that but there are bonafide strategies you can use for every race. Civilization? Sometimes you just get fucked by the random resource chance and get rolled by the AI in the first 15 turns.

The higher level difficulty AI of the Civ games too reminds me of this:



They can just roll you through nothing other than RNG.

The Computer also cheats in Civ in order to make the game more difficult since it is too hard for them to program a competent AI

 

[Islam Imamate]

The thing that pisses me off about Smash is that they invade FGC events while refusing to support other games in the FGC then they have the audacity to bitch that Smash doesn't get the respect it deserves

Smash is just so different that its only natural that its community and the community of other FG don't have a lot of cross over. Like you said, its a children's party game at the end of the day

Also, their game requires removing like 80% of the game in order for it to be competitive

That's what kind of annoys me about tryhard Smash players. If I find myself at a Smash tourney its just to play four player friendlys with items at the back. The game is so awesome when you play with all the elements. One-on-one is fine for a bit but I get bored of it so quickly.