Using Quads in MT Kick

I don't. Ask any boxer about whether or not bag movement means power. Power means penetration. I'm just saying that using the amount that bag moves as a means of measuring kicking power is flawed. As I said, the kyokushin kick came from MT. I started this thread initially because I was confused by what people meant when they said swing ur leg like a bat.
 
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a dead stick said:
I am not "pushing" the bag with a muay thai kick, if you have some stylistic preference in believe karate kicks are more powerful, fine, it only demonstrates the how discussing technique on a form can be futile.

I'm speaking from my own experience if you just want to assume I was doing the karate style kick wrong for 15 years without ever seeing me demonstrate you are just being a dick.
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A good and proper MT kick will push the bag after penetration because of proper follow through on the kick, that is what produces the knock back effect in sparring even if it is blocked. This the primary reason that the MT kick is _visually_ much more powerful that a chambered kick, when in practice the difference is not that great.
 
Bennosuke said:
OZ is right about how much the bag moves. A powerful technique will penetrate the bag more than it will cause it to move. For example, I can push the bag with my arm and move it more than when I punch, but that doesn't make my push more powerful than my punch. That just means the force is being applied over a longer time.

I think a good example of what I am thinking of may be this guy's video, even though he is obnoxious...
YouTube - Taekwondo Full Roundhouse Kick Tutorial (Kwonkicker) Also he says he's TKD, but this doesn't look like any TKD i've seen
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I have never seen any pure TKD documentation on that style kick. It looked like a text box MT kick to me. would not be surprised to find it has gotten picked up by some schools becuase of it's popularity.
 
@Barnaowl; I wouldn't be surprised either! However, the guy talks about chambering the leg kinda sorta, or about keeping the knee bent and extending it around contact time. Is this still in line with kicking like swinging a baseball bat?

Also, thank you for the explanation about the moving heavy bag.
 
Jesus H christ, you guys.

The penetration of the bag is also MUCH greater with the muay thai style, sorry for not explain myself more accurately to you nit picking asswipes.

Where the karate style makes a nice dent, the muay thai style kinks the entire bag and makes it bounce on the chain.

And its WHOLLY the result of the upper body mechanics of the muay thai kick, which you will never understand without dropping your preconceived notions.
I went through it myself as I described.

The Muay Thai style kick generates more velocity, more velocity = more force applied to the target. Making it significantly more powerful.

I've felt the difference being kicked in sparring, and it seemed a fairly significant difference to me.

The upper body mechanics, especially the torso twist/arm fling, which is very counter-intuitive to the mechanics and strategies employed by TKD and Karate stylists, is what makes the main difference.

If this is not good enough for you, go to a decent muay thai gym and see for yourself.

If anything, the karate style kick is more of a push, since it relies on muscular force rather than velocity to deliver force to the target.
 
a dead stick said:
Jesus H christ, you guys.

The penetration of the bag is also MUCH greater with the muay thai style, sorry for not explain myself more accurately to you nit picking asswipes.

Where the karate style makes a nice dent, the muay thai style kinks the entire bag and makes it bounce on the chain.

And its WHOLLY the result of the upper body mechanics of the muay thai kick, which you will never understand without dropping your preconceived notions.
I went through it myself as I described.

The Muay Thai style kick generates more velocity, more velocity = more force applied to the target. Making it significantly more powerful.

I've felt the difference being kicked in sparring, and it seemed a fairly significant difference to me.

The upper body mechanics, especially the torso twist/arm fling, which is very counter-intuitive to the mechanics and strategies employed by TKD and Karate stylists, is what makes the main difference.

If this is not good enough for you, go to a decent muay thai gym and see for yourself.

If anything, the karate style kick is more of a push, since it relies on muscular force rather than velocity to deliver force to the target.
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No offense but the torso twist and counter balance with the same side kicking arm is not unique to MT. It's pretty common to karate stylists and probably others.

Of course, I've never seen you kick so I'm not passing judgment on your kicks.
 
Perhaps it was unique to the instructors I trained with, there is plenty of variation within specific styles....
 
how about this... would you say the guy in this video is kicking like swinging a baseball bat?

YouTube - Mixed Martial Arts & Muay Thai Kickboxing : How to Do a Roundhouse Kick

I wouldn't expect this guy to have good MT form, you can tell me that. I will say, it looks like he is keeping his knee bent and extending around contact time (albeit with poor form). In this way, it looks similar to kicking the way I was taught to in Kyokushin.

My initial belief, and what I believe I am getting at (supported by barnowl and some other members' posts), is that the analogy is just not something I get, but that the MT style of kick is essentially the same as Kyokushin.
 
a dead stick said:
Jesus H christ, you guys.

The penetration of the bag is also MUCH greater with the muay thai style, sorry for not explain myself more accurately to you nit picking asswipes.

Where the karate style makes a nice dent, the muay thai style kinks the entire bag and makes it bounce on the chain.

And its WHOLLY the result of the upper body mechanics of the muay thai kick, which you will never understand without dropping your preconceived notions.
I went through it myself as I described.

The Muay Thai style kick generates more velocity, more velocity = more force applied to the target. Making it significantly more powerful.

I've felt the difference being kicked in sparring, and it seemed a fairly significant difference to me.

The upper body mechanics, especially the torso twist/arm fling, which is very counter-intuitive to the mechanics and strategies employed by TKD and Karate stylists, is what makes the main difference.

If this is not good enough for you, go to a decent muay thai gym and see for yourself.

If anything, the karate style kick is more of a push, since it relies on muscular force rather than velocity to deliver force to the target.
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Everything you said is wrong. The karate style one has more velocity, not the muay thai one. The muay thai one, if either, is more of a push because of its lower velocity.
 
a solid MT kick to thigh is so ridiculously painful and they hit with so much force, even much smaller MT fighters can hurt larger guys with good low kicks, because MT low kicks power isn't based to much on strength but technique,a lot of people like to say MT kicks are like whips but I think a whip with a mace at the end of it is a better description, MT kicks usually land with shin, and shins a re hard you can feel then even through shin guards in training.
 
heres a vid of samkor throwing bone crushing kicks while half assing it in training.
 
When I looked at the slow motions of his mid-level and high kicks, it looked like he was bending his leg. He was so fast though, it is hard to say. Would you say he kicks like he swings a baseball bat?
 
Bennosuke said:
When I looked at the slow motions of his mid-level and high kicks, it looked like he was bending his leg. He was so fast though, it is hard to say. Would you say he kicks like he swings a baseball bat?
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He achieves power through the step of hop on his post leg right before he kicks. He takes a quick shuffle step forward and outside to generate a rebound of energy from the ground and the step outside widens his kicking arc. His kicking leg is nearly diagonal and not horizontal as a roundkick should be. That helps with speed but that's nearly the same crappy technique you see in Olympic style TKD minus the chamber at the knee.
That being said I think his kick sucks. :redface:
 
Bennosuke said:
how about this... would you say the guy in this video is kicking like swinging a baseball bat?

YouTube - Mixed Martial Arts & Muay Thai Kickboxing : How to Do a Roundhouse Kick

I wouldn't expect this guy to have good MT form, you can tell me that. I will say, it looks like he is keeping his knee bent and extending around contact time (albeit with poor form). In this way, it looks similar to kicking the way I was taught to in Kyokushin.

My initial belief, and what I believe I am getting at (supported by barnowl and some other members' posts), is that the analogy is just not something I get, but that the MT style of kick is essentially the same as Kyokushin.
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Are you trying to represent Muay Thai with a McMuayThai Dojo video? That is not even proper Muay Thai technique in that video. Not even close. Those expert village videos are horrendous.

Here are some of the p4p hardest kicks in the world:


More Samkor pad destruction:
 
quikkick said:
He achieves power through the step of hop on his post leg right before he kicks. He takes a quick shuffle step forward and outside to generate a rebound of energy from the ground and the step outside widens his kicking arc. His kicking leg is nearly diagonal and not horizontal as a roundkick should be. That helps with speed but that's nearly the same crappy technique you see in Olympic style TKD minus the chamber at the knee.
That being said I think his kick sucks. :redface:
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Who told you this? My trainers come from the Fairtex camp in SF. We're instructed to kick to the body upward at 45 degrees. This is the same with many camps in Thailand, although their are variances in kicking technique within Muay Thai. Samkor has broken ribs and made fighters quit with his kicks. I hope you're talking about another video and I'm just misunderstanding.
 
Snubnoze707 said:
Who told you this? My trainers come from the Fairtex camp in SF. We're instructed to kick to the body upward at 45 degrees. This is the same with many camps in Thailand, although their are variances in kicking technique within Muay Thai. Samkor has broken ribs and made fighters quit with his kicks. I hope you're talking about another video and I'm just misunderstanding.
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Everyone. Muay Thai, Karate, Taekwondo...
 
Buakaw must be getting some poor instruction. Look at how his crappy pad holder is angling the pads at 45 degrees.

 
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