Crime Use it in a Sentence (special counsel thread v. 25)

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

I see shit getting very ugly if this goes to impeachment over campaign finance laws related only to paying off women for NDAs on affairs.

That used to be, and still is, enough.
The allegation is that he directed a criminal enterprise through Cohen, violating campaign finance laws.

That's certainly not some small potatoes, and despite what some here would love to believe, the court of public opinion won't matter a damned thing if the impeachment ball gets rolling.

 

[MikeMcMann]

Only the Senate can remove him. And a Republican Senate wouldn't do such a thing even if Jeebus himself floated down from on High and called Trump a prick imo

Don't be so sure. They maybe be whores to Trump right now, but they saw in the Midterms that will Trump support amongst the hardcore remains static, that is not enough to save their seats. If they see a similar wave coming in 2020, and far more Repub Senate seats are at risk then, they will become whores to their own self interest and survival. They will not take a bullet to save Trump at their own expense. They will only do it if they think they both survive.

I guarantee you they are watching closely their own polling data on general Repub support and not just the Trump support most pay attention to.

 

[HereticBD]

They would be stupid to try unless they think the evidence is so overwhelming and clear that either the Repub Senators will feel morally compelled to act properly (LOL we know that won't happen) or the Repub Senators continue to see core Repub support plummet and they decide they have to make moves to separate themselves from this president or they will continue to go down even as the hard core base props him up just enough, just as happened in the MidTerms.

LOL, you want to see Republican support plummet? Turn on Trump.

The Republican party is dead. It's Trump's party. So go he, so goes the support he brings. Don't act like the midterms were some kind of anomaly that never happens to first term Presidents. It's not indicative of anything. Compared to past Presidents' records on first term midterms, Trump's losses were rather ordinary.

 

[Protectandserve]

That used to be, and still is, enough.
The allegation is that he directed a criminal enterprise through Cohen, violating campaign finance laws.

That's certainly not some small potatoes, and despite what some here would love to believe, the court of public opinion won't matter a damned thing if the impeachment ball gets rolling.

Not arguing that it is not enough for impeachment. Just saying I think things will get very ugly.

We've already seen tons of political violence surrounding this election and current president.

 

[ChainFlow]

I see shit getting very ugly if this goes to impeachment over campaign finance laws related only to paying off women for NDAs on affairs.

I think Mueller is doing a thorough job and looking for anything and everything in this investigation.

My question is how is the general public going to react if there is no evidence of collusion but some other stuff comes to light that leads to impeachment. I think we see some massive political violence if that happens.

We’re well past that these days.

The most obvious “collusion” aspect is the quid pro quo of Trump receiving financial backing for his Trump Tower Russia - a project which is only on pause until Trump exits the presidency - from a bank sanctioned by the US. His “quid” is lifting those sanctions, which he immediately moved to do after assuming office (but was thwarted by Congress). As you know, it doesn’t matter if he succeeded - he tried. That’s Bribery at the least and probably lots of other things too.

There’s also aiding and abetting computer crimes.

There’s also conspiracy to defraud the US gov, which is of course why those Russian hackers working with the campaign were charged under that statute as part of the same criminal action.

And more.

The media is just focusing on the mistress payoffs because Mueller didn’t bother to redact any of that because it was already all out in the open.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

Not arguing that it is not enough for impeachment. Just saying I think things will get very ugly.

We've already seen tons of political violence surrounding this election and current president.

He's certainly doing nothing to help with his rhetoric, but that's why he's among the worst leaders in the history of the United States if not the worst.

Shame a sitting president can't be indicted for crimes. But I guess the standard now is "It's not like he killed somebody, and presidential dignity is overrated."

 

[ChainFlow]

He's certainly doing nothing to help with his rhetoric, but that's why he's among the worst leaders in the history of the United States if not the worst.

Shame a sitting president can't be indicted for crimes. But I guess the standard now is "It's not like he killed somebody, and presidential dignity is overrated."

The team investigating Nixon actually did hold that a President can be indicted. So did Ken Starr. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/22/us/politics/can-president-be-indicted-kenneth-starr-memo.html

Don’t internalize the position that the Trump team has been working furiously to spread.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

The team investigating Nixon actually did hold that a President can be indicted. So did Ken Starr. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/22/us/politics/can-president-be-indicted-kenneth-starr-memo.html

Don’t internalize the position that the Trump team has been working furiously to spread.

I follow that sage advice, believe half of what you see and nothing that you hear. When it comes from this president, I assume whatever he says is sprinkled with lies.

But to my limited understanding it's an open question among legal scholars and most of what I've heard indicates that a POTUS can't be indicted while in office.

 

[ChainFlow]

I follow that sage advice, believe half of what you see and nothing that you hear. When it comes from this president, I assume whatever he says is sprinkled with lies.

But to my limited understanding it's an open question among legal scholars and most of what I've heard indicates that a POTUS can't be indicted while in office.

It is indeed an open question. However, we shouldn’t cede that ground without examining it when the last analogous cases had strong arguments made that the President can indeed be indicted and those questions were not put to the test.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

It is indeed an open question. However, we shouldn’t cede that ground without examining it when the last analogous cases had strong arguments made that the President can indeed be indicted and those questions were not put to the test.

Whether it's the buttered side of the toast that hits the floor or not, it's toast, LOL

I'm afraid I agree, we'll likely end up with a Constitutional crisis

 

[Farmer Br0wn]

To me the worst thing that could happen to Donny Moscow already has:
History will remember him as a corrupt, compromised president whose administration was a trainwreck.

President Trump will be remembered much like former President Ronald Reagan

He will be lionized and remembered quite fondly by the right. The left will continue to demonize him to over-exaggerated and cartoonish levels.

 

[Quipling]

I believe so. An impeachment is to merely remove the President. I don't believe it has any basis on the law. The charges could still be filed afterwards, no matter what happens. It's why Nixon was granted a pardon after he stepped down, because they could've still charged him if they wanted to, once he out of office.

This is a good point, but articles of impeachment were never filed with Nixon. I tend to agree that they are unlikely to have a preclusive effect with respect to criminal matters, though.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

President Trump will be remembered much like former President Ronald Reagan

He will be lionized and remembered quite fondly by the right. The left will continue to demonize him to over-exaggerated and cartoonish levels.

 

[HereticBD]

This is a good point, but articles of impeachment were never filed with Nixon. I tend to agree that they are unlikely to have a preclusive effect with respect to criminal matters, though.

Yeah, my understanding is that impeachment is merely a political tool, and not a criminal proceeding. I don't believe one has an effect on the other. I don't know, but considering a sitting President can't be indicted, it could actually serve the purpose to remove a President so that they can be charged. That might be part of the intention of impeachment.

 

[Farmer Br0wn]

If this goes to impeachment proceedings, -and let's dispense with the bullshit, in any other presidency they would already be underway- Donald Trump will find himself in a situation where his support among current lapdog Republicans in the Senate and Congress collapses as they run for the exits like a crowd in a theater fire.

100% wishful thinking.

 

[Farmer Br0wn]

<{gspressed}>


History will ultimately prove me correct. The more time that passes, the more the right will look back fondly upon President Trump. During that same time, the left will continue to demonize President Trump to an increasingly cartoonish level.

 

[44nutman]

The best base. They respect you.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

100% wishful thinking.

Yah, it's not like politicians who want to protect their jobs put a toxic party member at arm's length.
That's never happened.

 

[hillelslovak87]

<{gspressed}>


History will ultimately prove me correct. The more time that passes, the more the right will look back fondly upon President Trump. During that same time, the left will continue to demonize President Trump to an increasingly cartoonish level.

This....is laughable. How would you say Richard Nixon is remembered?

 

[foxnoob]

President Trump will be remembered much like former President Ronald Reagan

He will be lionized and remembered quite fondly by the right. The left will continue to demonize him to over-exaggerated and cartoonish levels.

100% wishful thinking.

Psychological projection is a defense mechanism in which the human ego defends itself against unconscious impulses or qualities by denying their existence in themselves while attributing them to others.